Group A MG Metro Turbos - Where are they now?

[Boyracer050]

Hi im new here.. Sorry too dig up an old thread but wow so much info i never knew.. I myself have a Mg Metro Turbo which i have rebuilt and put back on the road recently..

[migliacars]

i no this isnt quite a works metro turbo but i think you will all like it. it has a lot of history as a racer. enjoy the pictures.
its a 1293cc
7 port head
fuel injected

[migliacars]

Oulton park BTCC Gold Cup 1984

type this into youtube and see the metro racing at oulton park

[migliacars]

found this as well whole race from 1983 with tony pond driving a works metro.



BTCC 1983 Donington pt1

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by migliacars

Oulton park BTCC Gold Cup 1984

type this into youtube and see the metro racing at oulton park

migliacars we have been lucky enough to see the youtube links before, thanks very much for reminding us though!!

I guess your unsername suggests a particular interest in BL/ARG little cars?

[billycooper]

several pics of MG Metro Grp A cars taken at Oulton, including Tony Pond

scroll down
http://www.flickr.com/photos/16788879@N02/

[KA]

Originally Posted by billycooper

several pics of MG Metro Grp A cars taken at Oulton, including Tony Pond

scroll down
http://www.flickr.com/photos/16788879@N02/

...and best of all, a clear pic of Paul Taft's 'Klaxon' car- think that's the first one we've had in the thread
http://www.flickr.com/photos/1678887...7624382877618/

[Jesper OH]

Being a half season MG specilist of 1984, I tend to agree with you KA. I think that a Birmingham connection was mentioned earlier, and here it is in splendid view for all.

Jesper

[Funkycars]

I have just found now this thread. There has been one Metro Turbo GRA in Switzerland for some rallyes. The car looks identical to the circuit racing cars (BBS style center lock wheels etc. ... in rallying!) and had UK numberplates A509LBW. Does anybody now anything about this?

welcome Funkycars i've moved this post to the main section thread for the moment as it will be of more discussion interest in there.

cheers
chunterer.

[KA]

Here's a bit of the story I don't think I knew before- Metro Turbos in French Supertourisme!

Just been looking on Forum-Auto where there's a fairly long-running thread on 80's Supertourisme pics (I've linked to it several times in the Rover and 635 threads) to see if there was anything new- and found this:

http://images.forum-auto.com/mesimag...2083%20mon.jpg

It's obviously one of the 1983-season Metros in Unipart/Daily Express colours- but what's it doing at Montlhery....?

A quick look at 1983 Supertourisme results on Frank de Jong's site comes up with the goods, as always...
http://homepage.mac.com/frank_de_jon...lhery%202.html

It seems that a pair of Metros made the trip for the final 1983 round at Montlhery, driven by Patrick Watts (#10) and Gerard Spencley (#21). Spencley's name rings a bell as one of the regular French competitors in the European Metro Turbo series- pretty sure I remember seeing him at Silverstone more than once.
Neither car seems to have qualified for the race however- Watts was about 1.5 seconds off the back of the grid, and Spenceley about a further two seconds slower.

It certainly seems to have been a one-off appearance- I can't see any mention of further Metro appearances in France in 1983/4

Small fwd cars certainly ran in the series though, Jean Ragnotti qualifiying this Renault 5 Alpine Turbo 6th at the same meeting...
http://images.forum-auto.com/mesimag...0mon.jpg1..jpg

So what was the story? A unsuccessful one-off outing for publicity, or a toe-in-the-water look to see if a Metro Supertourisme programme was viable? It's at the end of the season, the weekend after the final BTCC round, and a quick search suggests that Spencley won the French Metro series in 1983- could a run in one of the Group A Metros have been part of the prize (although the final round of that series seems to have been at the same meeting)

[KA]

Originally Posted by Funkycars

I have just found now this thread. There has been one Metro Turbo GRA in Switzerland for some rallyes. The car looks identical to the circuit racing cars (BBS style center lock wheels etc. ... in rallying!) and had UK numberplates A509LBW. Does anybody now anything about this?

welcome Funkycars i've moved this post to the main section thread for the moment as it will be of more discussion interest in there.

cheers
chunterer.

I've got a vague memory of one of the various outfits who ran cars in the Metro Turbo one-make series being involved with a presumably Group A Metro Turbo rallycar in the mid/late 80's. IIRC it was used on tarmac events, including some European rallies, and I'm sure I've got a couple of photos of it in a Mini/Metro book somewhere...

Anyone got any more of a clue? Enterprise Racing might have been the team involved....

I ran that reg number through the DVLA database, and it was definitely on an MG, but hasn't been on the road in the UK for a while...

Date of Liability 01 02 1987
Date of First Registration 01 02 1984
Year of Manufacture 1984
Cylinder Capacity (cc) 1275cc
CO2 Emissions Not Available
Fuel Type PETROL
Export Marker N
Vehicle Status Unlicensed
Vehicle Colour WHITE
Vehicle Type Approval Not Available

[KA]

Originally Posted by KA

Here's a bit of the story I don't think I knew before- Metro Turbos in French Supertourisme!

Just been looking on Forum-Auto where there's a fairly long-running thread on 80's Supertourisme pics (I've linked to it several times in the Rover and 635 threads) to see if there was anything new- and found this:

http://images.forum-auto.com/mesimag...2083%20mon.jpg

It's obviously one of the 1983-season Metros in Unipart/Daily Express colours- but what's it doing at Montlhery....?

It seems that a pair of Metros made the trip for the final 1983 round at Montlhery, driven by Patrick Watts (#10) and Gerard Spencley (#21). Spencley's name rings a bell as one of the regular French competitors in the European Metro Turbo series- pretty sure I remember seeing him at Silverstone more than once.
Neither car seems to have qualified for the race however- Watts was about 1.5 seconds off the back of the grid, and Spenceley about a further two seconds slower.

A bit more on this mysterious appearance by the BTCC Metro Turbos in a French supertourisme round at Montlhery- There's a pic of Spencley in the car, and a brief piece about it in Auto-Hebdo's report of the Montlhery meeting- My French is pretty rusty, but it appears to say that the appearance of the two Metros was one of the highlights of the weekend, and that although running in British Group A spec meant they had little chance of qualifying, both drivers gave it a good try- Spencley (in Tony Pond's usual car) being hampered by brake troubles.

Most of the rest of the piece talks about how Spencley had come to the attention of Austin Rover for the drive- apparently he'd appeared a few times in the British Metro Challenge with decent results, despite running his car in less-powerful French series spec

The article also seems to suggest that there was some paddock gossip about Austin Rover looking at running a smaller car alongside the Rovers in Supertourisme in the future....

http://www.gtv6-156gta.be/GTV6Produc...toHebdo390.pdf

[chunterer]

Brilliant find KA, well done for that!

Yes Spencley was one of those guys who ran smart black and dayglo Baral sponsored cars in the euroseries IIRC, current Masters Escort pedaller Claude Boissy might have beeen another?

Hey I think it was a bit mean that the little cars got within 7 seconds of the fastest of those beasts and still didn't make the cut?!

Must've been a pretty strict qualifying procedure in supertourisme!

[KA]

Yes, it's interesting to wonder what might have happened if Austin Rover had taken a proper look at the Metro for Supertourisme, and whether they'd have been able to develop it enough to close that gap?
Renault certainly managed to get Ragnotti's little 5 Turbo to go pretty quickly under the French rules...

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by KA

Yes, it's interesting to wonder what might have happened if Austin Rover had taken a proper look at the Metro for Supertourisme, and whether they'd have been able to develop it enough to close that gap?
Renault certainly managed to get Ragnotti's little 5 Turbo to go pretty quickly under the French rules...

Maybe the run out was a prize for Spencley for his Metro challenge efforts, or an evaluation excercise for 1984, again maybe like you say a potential French programme was on the cards and maybe Spencley would've/weanted to be involved.

Or maybe, just maybe, he was going to be considered for a Metro ETC campaign......

He did pedal a 635 later on IIRC?

[KA]

Looking at the Auto-Hebdo report, apart from the section about the Metros, there's also a little bit of paddock gossip, which talks about some rumours for the 1984 season- Mercedes with a car run by a 'driver-preparer' (sounds like the Snobeck Merc deal!), Peugeot running two 505 Turbos and 'in the same vein, Austin-Rover could field a 'small' model (MG Metro Turbo) alongside a Rover 3500'

Spencley is interviewed briefly and says that some good overseas results- he'd run at the Nurburgring and Silverstone- had led to the Montlhery opportunity, as well as some further Metro Challenge races in Europe

[chunterer]

On a separate note, the 85 DPM/DTM footage we've been discussing shows a Metro Turbo running in Germany in 1985. Think it's the Massa backed car.

I thought we had only discoved this car running in 1984 earlier in this thread?

[KA]

Originally Posted by chunterer

On a separate note, the 85 DPM/DTM footage we've been discussing shows a Metro Turbo running in Germany in 1985. Think it's the Massa backed car.

I thought we had only discoved this car running in 1984 earlier in this thread?

The Massa Real backed car for Armin Hahne only appeared in a couple of late-season rounds in 1984, as you said. However, a guy named Volker Anhalt made a few 1985 appearances in a Metro- I'm guessing the same car, but who ran it? IIRC, for Hahne's 1984 outings, the car was still run by Roger Dowson- but was it then sold on to Anhalt and run by a German outfit, or was Dowson still running it?

A pic of Hahne in the Massa Real car
http://homepage.mac.com/frank_de_jon...alenpokal.html

[KA]

Incidentally, Massa Real went on to be one of the sponsors on the German Rovers in 1985

[Jesper OH]

Besides starting at the airfield races at Wunstorf, Mainz-Finthen and Erding I have notes that suggests Volker Anhalt and the MG Metro was present at both Zolder races and the Nürburgring. Details are sketchy, but would guess this is information from this very thread!
Also from my notes Roger Dowson did run the Anhalt car in '85, but still not sure how 100 % that is. Who ran the Paul Taft Klaxon Turbo during the 1984 BSCC season?

Jesper

[KA]

Originally Posted by Jesper OH

Besides starting at the airfield races at Wunstorf, Mainz-Finthen and Erding I have notes that suggests Volker Anhalt and the MG Metro was present at both Zolder races and the Nürburgring. Details are sketchy, but would guess this is information from this very thread!
Also from my notes Roger Dowson did run the Anhalt car in '85, but still not sure how 100 % that is. Who ran the Paul Taft Klaxon Turbo during the 1984 BSCC season?

Jesper

I thought the Taft car was run by Dowson alongside the Computervision pair- this Oulton paddock photo certainly shows all three Metros parked up together
http://www.flickr.com/photos/16788879@N02/3164762466/

[KA]

Originally Posted by Funkycars

I have just found now this thread. There has been one Metro Turbo GRA in Switzerland for some rallyes. The car looks identical to the circuit racing cars (BBS style center lock wheels etc. ... in rallying!) and had UK numberplates A509LBW. Does anybody now anything about this?

Originally Posted by KA

I've got a vague memory of one of the various outfits who ran cars in the Metro Turbo one-make series being involved with a presumably Group A Metro Turbo rallycar in the mid/late 80's. IIRC it was used on tarmac events, including some European rallies, and I'm sure I've got a couple of photos of it in a Mini/Metro book somewhere...

Anyone got any more of a clue? Enterprise Racing might have been the team involved....

Did a bit of digging around and found the Metro book I was thinking of in the loft- it's an early 90's Osprey paperback by Mark Steward, simply titled 'Metro'. There's a chapter on motorsport, thought it focuses mainly on rallycross and Metro Challenge, with just a brief mention and no pics of the BTCC cars.

One thing it does mention, and has a few pics of is a Group A Metro Turbo used by Rover Executive Engineer Brian Cameron in the West Euro Cup rally series in the late 80's- from the pics it was blue/white (split diagonally front/back, a bit like 80's Ford Motorsport stripes, rather than top/bottom as on the BTCC cars) with sponsorship by Tudor Webasto, and was registered XNK148X, rather than the plate Funkycars mentioned.

From the logo on the front spoiler, Metro Challenge team Enterprise Racing seem to have been involved with this, and it does look a lot like a Metro Challenge car- it uses the same alloy wheels (rather than the BTCC-style BBS wheels Funkycars described on the Swiss car), and the exhaust outlet appears to be cut into the sill ahead of the LH rear wheel in the same way it was on the Turbo Challenge cars.

A quick Google suggests Brian Cameron was involved with 'Project Pride' the endurance speed record bid using the later 'R6' K-series-engined Metro GTi in 1990 or thereabouts

http://www.aronline.co.uk/blogs/2010...project-pride/

[MG Rover Sport]

Originally Posted by KA

I thought the Taft car was run by Dowson alongside the Computervision pair- this Oulton paddock photo certainly shows all three Metros parked up together
http://www.flickr.com/photos/16788879@N02/3164762466/

True KA - Dowson ran the Taft car alongside the works entries.

That was a cracking find on the Montlhery entries KA - top detective work!

[MG Rover Sport]

Originally Posted by KA

...an early 90's Osprey paperback by Mark Steward, simply titled 'Metro'...

Have a look in the acknowledgements in the front KA - David Sims is my good self! Mark kindly gave me a few of the slides and photos that were used in the book as a goodwill gesture to thank me for my assistance. A nice chap!

[DAVID PATERSON]

Originally Posted by RichWard

Hi all. I've just noticed this thread and find it very interesting. I used to own an ex-Turbo Challenge car and I'm a huge fan of 6R4's, but I am hoping that some of you can help me out with a project I am working on. It is a free addon for a PC based racing game (rFactor), that is based on the Group A Touring Car era. The Metro Turbo is one of the many cars to be included.
Do any of you have any detailed info about the engines, gearbox, suspension etc, or pics that we can use to recreate the different liveries? So far we have the '84 BTCC and ETCC (seen above) cars done, aswell as the Unipart cars of Tony Pond from '83, the Armin Hahne DPM '84 car and Colin Pearcy's BTCC '87 car.

I have now joined in with helping this project. We want the simulation to be as accurate as possible, so can anybody please help us by answering the following questions?

1. Engine peak power and at what rpm? I've read 200hp at the flywheel, was this in Group A spec?
2. Engine peak torque and at what rpm? I've heard that these engines suffered from turbo lag. What was the useful rev range?
3. Diff ratios?
4. Gearbox ratios?
5. Weight? According to Group A regs, i believe the min. weight of these cars (sans driver) would have been 880kg. Did they get down to this?
6. Now we get down to obscure stuff, does anyone have an idea what spring ratings or geometry was used?
7. Where the Metro Challenge cars built to Group A spec or Group N or something else?