[Rules] Future Rule Changes

[EffectiveSprinkles]

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHhrZgojY1Q

[Tourer]

So according to M. Todt, F1 will "never" go fully-electric for its power units.

If that's the case, I feel positive about it personally. Does make me wonder why they went down the hybrid path of "road car relevance" though. If they're never going to be electric, maybe some high-end ICE tech would serve the sport better and maybe, just maybe develop some technologies that could be used in the mainstream automotive world - possibly some new fuel types that are more sustainable or something like that?

[S griffin]

I'm glad this is happening, leave electric to Formula E

[Akrapovic]

So can we put V8/V10/V12s back in now that we're not pretending they are road relevant?

[wnut]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

So can we put V8/V10/V12s back in now that we're not pretending they are road relevant?

Please!

[EffectiveSprinkles]

Hybrid engines are road relevant, electric drivetrains are not.

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

So can we put V8/V10/V12s back in now that we're not pretending they are road relevant?

Got my vote!

[wnut]

Originally Posted by EffectiveSprinkles

Hybrid engines are road relevant, electric drivetrains are not.

Hybrid vehicles, a cynical cash cow for manufacturers in road vehicles, a cynical cash cow for manufacturers in F1?

[Casper]

Originally Posted by Tourer

So according to M. Todt, F1 will "never" go fully-electric for its power units.

F1 will do whatever the manufacturer teams want it to do and Todt will have no say just as he has no say now.....do it our way or we are out of here. From all reports that is exactly what has happened and the PU will be a far cry from what was originally intended for '21. There is no fool like an old fool.

[chillibowl]

he does raise an interesting distinction though...

"FE has not the performance of F1," added Todt.

"At the moment one of the reasons FE is hosted in cities is because it would not create any interest to have FE on a circuit like Monza, for example. We are talking about two different categories.

i cant say i have thought about this way before. in the past i would have said that FE has this advantage because it can bring racing into cites and to the people in a way that F1 cant really do anymore in western cities.

but are the audiences so different that the typical FE fan has no interest in going to a bespoke racing circuit?

i get for the time being that circuits are, at this stage of development, to long and require a longer battery than FE can currently provide..so right now there is performance/technical differentiation. so for sure there is a calendar issue that will prevent F1 going full electric.

but i also suspect that JT is misunderstanding the audience, the manus desire to connect with that audience, and just how quickly things are changing.

[Greem]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

he does raise an interesting distinction though...

"FE has not the performance of F1," added Todt.

"At the moment one of the reasons FE is hosted in cities is because it would not create any interest to have FE on a circuit like Monza, for example. We are talking about two different categories.

i cant say i have thought about this way before. in the past i would have said that FE has this advantage because it can bring racing into cites and to the people in a way that F1 cant really do anymore in western cities.

but are the audiences so different that the typical FE fan has no interest in going to a bespoke racing circuit?

i get for the time being that circuits are, at this stage of development, to long and require a longer battery than FE can currently provide..so right now there is performance/technical differentiation. so for sure there is a calendar issue that will prevent F1 going full electric.

but i also suspect that JT is misunderstanding the audience, the manus desire to connect with that audience, and just how quickly things are changing.

I would expect his point, however butchered it might be, is that Formula E running at say Monza or Silverstone would not be interesting simply because the cars haven't been designed to race very quickly over long distances. When they ran the Gen 1 car tests at Donington, there were chicanes placed at suitable points to give the cars the ability to regenerate - they're just not ready, even in the new generation cars, for long full power runs on 'classic' circuits.

They'd be comparatively slow, they'd look slow, and they just wouldn't hold the interest of the spectators whether they're traditional F1 fans or new FE fans.

They'll get there, but it'll be a long time before they could race 53 laps of Monza in around 90 minutes like the F1 cars do now.

[chillibowl]

no doubt i am underestimating the speed difference between the two categories so there is that. and indeed, just from those snippets of quotes, i probably took another meaning from his comments then the one he intended.

[GasperG]

Today the diference is obvious, tomorrow not so sure. I see no problem in Formula E taking the crown, but we will have to wait a couple of decades.

F1 are hybrids not just because of publicity, but I believe a hybrid can actually make the diference in performance. Better lighter batteries, more precisely controllable electric motors. When you equip a car with brute force engine, you have done nothing.

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by GasperG

....When you equip a car with brute force engine, you have done nothing.

Except excite quite a few motor racing fans.......

[GasperG]

Speed will always be exciting...

[EffectiveSprinkles]

I'm pretty excited by the fact that since 2017 we actually have fast F1 cars again, even if only in qualifying.

[hondafan37]

Ross Brawn has presented today in Singapore the concept in which they are working for the 2021 cars of Formula 1, which will receive a big change at the power unit level, with a simplification of the hybrid technology, and also, they will have a change Aspect.



https://www.thebestf1.es/liberty-med...ormula-1-2021/

[ASCII Man]

What Mercedes wants, F1 gets.

[Adam43]

I thought it was what Ferrari wants?

[Tourer]

Article in Autosport too. Neither article says much about the engines other than they'll be simpler hybrid units.

The visual concept is different - not sure what I think about it TBH and no doubt what goes on the track in 2021 won't look exactly the same in any case. Looks kinda like an Indycar and a FE car got together for a dirty weekend.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Adam43

I thought it was what Ferrari wants?

Depends on if you subscribe to the Ferrari or Mercedes conspiracy bandwagon?

One day, maybe, people will accept that the best team / driver wins, and applaude the victory as a sporting achievement.

[ASCII Man]

It was not even about just them winning, but about the tremendous amount of lobbying and backstage politics Mercedes did to pull the proverbial blanket towards them in terms of engine design. They're a cancer in F1.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by ASCII Man

It was not even about just them winning, but about the tremendous amount of lobbying and backstage politics Mercedes did to pull the proverbial blanket towards them in terms of engine design. They're a cancer in F1.

Precisely.

[Adam43]

What they did was get working on with the new engine regs before anyone else. They were prepared.
Ferrari did as much “lobbying”. One thing they got was to make it a V6 rather than a 4 cylinder.

[Casper]

Originally Posted by Adam43

What they did was get working on with the new engine regs before anyone else. They were prepared.
Ferrari did as much “lobbying”. One thing they got was to make it a V6 rather than a 4 cylinder.

Yep and I bet MB are already working on the new motor/pu. Just because they are better and more prepared only makes the others look like dills trying to catch up. Ferrari might get around to thinking about it in 2020...maybe, though I think they have lifted their thinking and worked out that proper R&D is not such a bad thing.