2006 engines

[ubisir]

Forgive me, as I am new to this forum, so this topic may have been covered. Do you feel, or have any info, on who will be supplying the best engines for next year? Will we see a different dominant engine manufacturer?

As a cost-cutting measure, surely rebuilding engines from scratch, and having to re-design entire cars around them, trannies, tires, etc. must be the most expensive exercise to date.

Perhaps in the long run this will encourage new teams to join F1 so we can get back up to a 26-car full grid.

As for speed, didn't Toyota test a new car that was 8 secs slower at Jerez in September? And that margin will come down significantly...

Thanks

[safc_fan89]

Toyota's V8 is now about 4 seconds slower. It's difficult to judge where teams are because few have done that much mileage with the V8, and Toyota seem to have done the most. And with rumours spreading about that certain engines will not be competitive is certainly not helping!

Changing the engines from V10 to V8 is stupid it is more unnecessary cost, and I don't think F1 has got too fast.

Still, it should make for an interesting 2006, but drivers are complaining about the V8 engines being far less powerful.

[Marbot]

It may be expensive short term,but long term it will have benefits to new teams and costs as well.

Drivers will always say that their engine isn't powerful enough.

[safc_fan89]

I don't like this change from V10 to V8 engines. If it reduces speed, then how is F1 different from other series'? Hopefully this speed reduction will not be too great, and be caught up with in a few years. Doesn't matter what the FIA does to cut speeds, designers always find a way to regain the speed.

[Spudgun]

We won't know for sure until Melbourne before we know who's competetive and who's not. There are always some surprises.

[browney]

Is it likley that the champcars will have the potential to be quicker than f1 cars next year? Even though they are a spec serries, they will have the same number of cylinders, larger displacement, a turbo and slicks.

[maltafan]

As far as I know, v10 engines with restricted rev limit are allowed in 2006 in order to help low-budget teams. So will the teams be going for these cars rather than the new v8's? The V10's are more reliable and faster.

[ubisir]

Thanks for you comments! FYI, I recall speed trap velocity down the back straight here in Montreal. You may remember Williams in '04, 353 kph, and their side mirrors fell off. This year, speeds were down to 328 or so. Next year will be an interesting comparison. Of course, acceleration will be slower, but engineers will try to get the revs up higher. And I suppose we'll still see 2 races per engine, which further compromises a full throttle style of racing. Reliability: will v8's be tougher? Probably not at higher rpms! Thank you maltafan!

[Nintendo]

Cosworth's engine is up on similar power levels to the v10.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by Nintendo

Cosworth's engine is up on similar power levels to the v10.

The V8s will all be approximately 200 bhp shy of the V10s.This years V10 Cosworth will be detuned to V8 power levels.

[Mario_Andretti]

I still think thats not fair!!! If you cant afford a damn engine that are required by rules, you shouldnt be in F1!!!

[Mario_Andretti]

Bahh honda engines have too much of a hard time with reliability. At the present moment its the Ferrari engine and I would say BMW engines that are the best!

[Nado]

I reckon these three will have the best engines: Cosworth, Honda, Toyota. By the end of the year though Cosworth will be around midpack.

Worst engine next year. Could very well be BMW.

[ParkLife]

People should not underestimate Renault's ability at making engines. This years Renault was one of the best in the field, yet got very little recognition.

Look at their history with engines. Fantastic.

Also, don't forget that a number of years ago when Renault were still considering whether to come back into F1 (and the rules didn't restrict you to a V10) they developed a very high revving V6 and considerred it's weight advantage to overcome the power deficit. They were planning on using it when they re-entred F1, but then the V10 only rule came in......

[ParkLife]

Sato_Rules, welcome to the forum, although I am beginning to sense a bias in your opinions

[BootsOntheSide]

After a few posts this one seems to have degenerated into ill-informed bickering about something we have little hope of accurately predictingg, mainly thansk to a couple of hopefully short-lived members.

In the long-term V8s should be cheaper to build, and their reliability will be higher, so the short-term effects of those problems aren't particularly significant, especially as 2008 is the year when lots of new teams MIGHT join the grid. Suggesting that teams shouldnt't be on the grid if they can't afford top engines is crazy, you would be taking the sport entirely out of the reach of privateers, and turning it into a pointless playground for car manufacturers. The cars will be 2-3 seconds a lap slower by the start of the season, and even then only at the few fast circutis remaining in F1. Without speed-limiting regulations in recent years the speeds would be crazy and the races far too short.

[JeremySmith]

I agree whole heartedly with Boots, and I would like to add that I do not think that we will notice a difference in speed as all the cars will be more or less equal won't they!

[Kirk]

http://www.sportnetwork.net/main/s11....htm?fromrss=1
Of course each track will be different but based on Ferrari's latest testing the gap is shrinking fast. An excerpt from the above link:
----------
In the 2005 race at the circuit, the fastest Ferrari lap was a 1.32.886. Based on this, the Ferrari V8 is just over a second and a half slower than its 2005 V10 counterpart. Many sources were expecting the gap to be much larger. The V8 engine was in the back of a modified F2004. Further significant speed gains should be possible once the engine is mounted in a genuine 2006 chassis that is designed specifically for the packaging, power delivery and characteristics of a V8 engine.

[Frank_White]

I think that a significant portion of the gain reflected in the Bahrain testing was probably from the tires.

[safc_fan89]

As long as the speed loss is not noticeable, which I'm sure it won't be, then I'm not overly concerned. What I am concerned about is that the drivers are complaining about how easy V8-powered F1 cars are to drive. But maybe that will lead to complacency...

[JeremySmith]

Originally Posted by safc_fan89

As long as the speed loss is not noticeable, which I'm sure it won't be, then I'm not overly concerned. What I am concerned about is that the drivers are complaining about how easy V8-powered F1 cars are to drive. But maybe that will lead to complacency...

Complacency is not a good idea at 200MPH.

[Dutton]

Well, they can hardly be complacent when other drivers are driving with the same stuff!

[Pingguest]

Originally Posted by Frank_White

I think that a significant portion of the gain reflected in the Bahrain testing was probably from the tires.

I agree. The tyres will be a lot softer in 2006.

[Marbot]

Originally Posted by JeremySmith

I agree whole heartedly with Boots, and I would like to add that I do not think that we will notice a difference in speed as all the cars will be more or less equal won't they!

Some will be more equal than others.

[Marbot]

Yes,the tyres being softer will significantly reduce the lap times,maybe even negate entirely the loss of engine power.

Previously i thought the 2006 cars would be around 5 seconds a lap slower,i will have to revise that to around 2 seconds now i think.A bit more on the faster circuits,a bit less on the slower ones.