US Grand Prix- Austin (USA)

[JHamilton]

Cool! Austin is an awesome place.

[jab]

Originally Posted by Born Racer

Will it not make those who run F1 look bad if there is another failure though? Surely they wouldn't proudly announce these ventures without some sort of major faith in the whole chibang.

Did Donington's failure damage Bernie's reputation? No, of course not, it was barely a scratch

Bernie has an uncanny nack of 1) getting the deals he wants and 2) weaseling out of them with minimal damage when they go belly-up

[Good Times]

Well as a Austin resident, I think it could happen. there are plenty of rich car mad people here.
There is plenty of land east of Austin with a good road system to the other major cities.
Tilke could not be part of it, as the track would need to be run in both directions.
Anti clockwise is the norm over here.
I just hope there is no banked oval & a nice track is presented. like Leguna Seca

[duke_toaster]

Originally Posted by Born Racer

More recent than I thought. He's done almost all the new ones in the last ten or so years though, I think.

Marina Bay was done by KBR, an American outfit who used to be a subsidiary of Halliburton. Those who have heard of the Jamie Leigh Jones case and the ensuing legislative incident in the US, it was that company.

[strider]

FWIW, I think this one will happen. Bernie really won't want another Donington or US F1 on his hands, so he will have had his people due diligence on the deal.

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by jab

I'm sure Jeremy will correct me otherwise, but I really don't think this will happen

They've got less than 2 years to build a F1-standard permanent race circuit, and it's not the Middle East

In fact, it's in Texas. F1 in Texas. What next? Olympic yachting in Leicester?

Seriously, at first glance, this seems about as feasible as US F1. Less feasible than bloody Donington

Austin is not like the rest of Texas.

[Born Racer]

Originally Posted by jab

Did Donington's failure damage Bernie's reputation? No, of course not, it was barely a scratch

I don't mean Bernie though. I mean F1 as a whole. I suppose a deal like this will barely get a mention in a newspaper. But it's not a good sign that the deal gets announced and there is instant scepticism that it will actually go ahead.

[duke_toaster]

Originally Posted by jab

In fact, it's in Texas. F1 in Texas.

As ptclaus said, Austin is a bit different, it appears that it's redneck free (electing Democrats who appear to be proper Democrats, for example) and a high-tech sort of place. Supposedly the other major cities aren't as bad as people think, but Austin should be a good fit for F1.

What next? Olympic yachting in Leicester?

Leicestershire is landlocked, but not having water is no bar to a GP.

[ptclaus98]

It holds one of the States' largest indie music festivals, I don't think F1 would have too much trouble fitting in culturally. Especially if they have turbos and KERS by then so they could push green tech a little bit as well.

[ralf fan]

Austin is an awesome city. Hopefully they'll have a decent track. I doubt it though with Tilke probably involved.

[jab]

Originally Posted by duke_toaster

Leicestershire is landlocked, but not having water is no bar to a GP.

No, but being in Texas is

Come on, I know Austin isn't "true Texas" or whatever, but F1 hasn't worked anywhere in the US yet in enough places to show that that doesn't matter. It's still the South. It's still Texas

They'll need 100,000 attendances to make it viable - Indy had that for a while but 2005 damaged F1's American reputation even more, and that was Indy, the capital of American motorsport. This is Austin, which either hasn't held a major motorsport event in a while or hasn't ever held one. Car mad they may be, but I'm not so sure they'll take to F1 in a big way, especially with no American teams and drivers as it stands (unless they fix it so that one of the American teams wins the 13th spot, which this could be seen as an inference of)

Even if this does happen, surely it won't be a long term success once the novelty wears off. It's been the same with most of the other American F1 venues. And we've seen plenty of times that Bernie (although he may be gone by the time it's been established on the calendar for a few years) don't see it absolutely necessary to race in the US

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by jab

No, but being in Texas is

Come on, I know Austin isn't "true Texas" or whatever, but F1 hasn't worked anywhere in the US yet in enough places to show that that doesn't matter. It's still the South. It's still Texas

They'll need 100,000 attendances to make it viable - Indy had that for a while but 2005 damaged F1's American reputation even more, and that was Indy, the capital of American motorsport. This is Austin, which either hasn't held a major motorsport event in a while or hasn't ever held one. Car mad they may be, but I'm not so sure they'll take to F1 in a big way, especially with no American teams and drivers as it stands (unless they fix it so that one of the American teams wins the 13th spot, which this could be seen as an inference of)

Even if this does happen, surely it won't be a long term success once the novelty wears off. It's been the same with most of the other American F1 venues. And we've seen plenty of times that Bernie (although he may be gone by the time it's been established on the calendar for a few years) don't see it absolutely necessary to race in the US

That might not be cured by 2012, but it's coming.

[jab]

Also I gather Austin is quite an eco city as well. Yet another reason why it ain't gonna happen

[F1 Prospects]

As somebody who has spent the last 5 years going to the SXSW Music Festival and Conference and who has gone back on various other occasions I can assure you that Austin is definitely an eclectic city that prides itself on being different. F1 will just be another example of this and visitors to the race will absolutely love the place.

Somebody mentioned due diligence. As a lawyer I can assure you that both sides of the agreement will have made damn sure they are protected both ways. On a contract this large with what looks like state involvement in a litigation happy country like the US, nobody will blindly fumble into this and face the wrath of the American legal system and the voters of Austin and the state.

Now whether the race is a success or not will be anybody's guess but recent comments by people like Parris Mullins, Luca Luca di Montezemolo and the speculation around the Cypher Group indicate an interest from the corporate side of things that bode well for a return to the US. Add somebody like Alexander Rossi, who may just be ready to go F1 in 2012 or 13 and you have something the American media can work with.

The US has always had a weird relationship with F1 but it looks to me, from a distance that people are interested in making things happen in America for their own best interests if nothing else. I will always remain skeptical until the flag is dropped but something tells me that things are different this time around and certainly nobody wants to screw things up and give us something like the fiasco that was Las Vegas or Phoenix.

The teams want it, Bernie wants it, Full Throttle want it, the sponsors want it and I think American F1 fans, regardless if they are a minority want it so it will happen as it will be an event. And with all bets off with the rules and regulations from 2013 on things will get pretty interesting indeed. And it will be paired with the Canadian GP so unless that moves you are looking at a race in early June.

That's just my Canadian two cents.

[ukaskew]

My main concern with yet another brand new F1 spec track is the complete lack of natural features. Presumably they will find the largest, flattest piece of land going, and any 'features' will be artificially created.

Long gone are the days when new circuits are formed to fit into an existing feature (i.e. an airfield) or follow the path of least resistance through an existing, interesting piece of terrain.

Castle Combe is a subtle example of the point I'm trying to make, Avon Rise / Quarry is a fascinating and deceptively terrifying section of track, yet it only really exists because of a problem (a quarry) that they couldn't afford to sort properly. Had they thrown money at it the corner wouldn't be anything worth mentioning, and certainly nobody would have ever designed it to follow its existing subtle yet brillantly challenging path.

Most new circuits don't have obstacles to overcome in that respect, so organic solutions which add significant character and individuality to them don't ever have a chance to appear.

[Purist]

KBR may have built Singapore, but it was a Tilke design. Both Apex Circuit Design and D3 Motorsport Development submitted original concept designs for Singapore, but Tilke's was the one that got the green light.

The last track added to the F1 calendar that was definitively NOT a work by Tilke was Melbourne back in 1996.

I figure that the track could, theoretically, be designed by any of the four, officially FIA-recognized design firms: Apex Circuit Design (Clive Bowen), D3 Motorsport Development (Ron Dickson), Tilke GmbH (Hermann Tilke), or Wilson Motorsport (Alan Wilson). Since we're talking about the US here, I think Bruce Hawkins and Bob Barnard might also have a shot, with outside chances going to Tony Cotman, Elliott Forbes-Robinson, and Derek Daly.

[jab]

Originally Posted by F1 Prospects

I will always remain skeptical until the flag is dropped but something tells me that things are different this time around and certainly nobody wants to screw things up and give us something like the fiasco that was Las Vegas or Phoenix.
.

But it's always different. Every time it happens they say it's going to be different. Indy was supposed to be different and look where that went. Donington was supposed to be different. I just don't buy it until the hard evidence is there for all to see

And I'm not convinced Bernie does necessarily want this. He's stated several times that he has no interest in going back. It's the manufacturers who have been pushing for this, and funnily enough have now gone. I wonder if this is just clever tactical work by Bernie, as has been alleged about his handing of the race to Donington to blackmail the BRDC into improving Silverstone. I just wonder if this is his way of, in 12/24 months time when it's all gone wrong yet again, saying "look, we tried again, but the American thing just isn't going to happen"

We shall see

[Born Racer]

Originally Posted by jab

And we've seen plenty of times that Bernie (although he may be gone by the time it's been established on the calendar for a few years) don't see it absolutely necessary to race in the US

I don't think that's true. Bernie says a lot of things he doesn't mean. Probably just some bargaining strategy.

[gttouring]

Originally Posted by tux1234

Why spend all that money building a new circuit when there are many fine us tracks? I know they would need changes to run off areas etc but surely that is cheaper than building an entirely new circuit. Hopefully this new track will be used by Wtcc, World GT1, Alms etc.

this is exactly what i thought.
if the money was poured into Road America or even Road Atlanta, which is awesome,
or VIR or Monticello any one of these already wickedly cool tracks would grow in awesomeness- this Austin deal is just a head scratcher

but yay for a US GP!

[bjohnsonsmith]

I hope they build an F1 friendly oval.

[deletraz]

I always just sort of shake my head when I see Indy held up as proof that F1 won't work in America.

Indy was a Mickey Mouse infield course in a not-terribly-exciting destination. In 2005 it had a fiasco that would turn away all but the most fanatical race enthusiast. And still, at they end, they were still attracting 100,000+ to the race. How many other GPs worldwide get that level of attendance? You could count them on one hand. And from my experience, relatively few of them were locals.

It died because Bernie was demanding a flat out absurd sum to hold the race. No one could pay that money without government support, and IMS has a long-standing policy of not accepting government support. Bernie has slashed to event fee in other key markets, and he'll do it for Austin to get back in the US. He needs it to work.

Austin is a great city. It's the 15th largest city in the US, and it's the capital of Texas. It's not exactly some remote outpost. If they can actually get the track built, they'll be fine. The people who traveled to Indy will travel to Austin instead. And the weather will be fine -- it will be paired with Montreal, likely putting it in early to mid June.

And not to beat a dead horse here, but the existing US road courses everybody loves are far below the FIA's standard... and if someone was willing to drop the tens or hundreds of millions of dollars to bring them up to the standard, they would cease to be the courses we love.

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by jab

Also I gather Austin is quite an eco city as well. Yet another reason why it ain't gonna happen

It isn't nearly as bad as Los Angeles or New York.

[ptclaus98]

Originally Posted by gttouring

this is exactly what i thought.
if the money was poured into Road America or even Road Atlanta, which is awesome,
or VIR or Monticello any one of these already wickedly cool tracks would grow in awesomeness- this Austin deal is just a head scratcher

but yay for a US GP!

If the money was poured into them, they would cease to be awesome.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by ptclaus98

If the money was poured into them, they would cease to be awesome.

They would lose their character and be ruined.

[Fish_Flake]

Austin is a wonderful city: it's emerging as a major high-tech business center, has a vibrant culture and nightlife, and its eclectic population that takes pride in its uniqueness. Despite all of that, it's not generally thought of as a major city domestically or internationally, and that's certainly why they'd want to use an event like the USGP to raise its global profile.

I'd be interested to know when the new race will appear on the calendar. I'd think the ideal time would be in early May, before the start of Indianapolis 500 practice and during a period when NASCAR has recently been inclined to hold its races on Saturday nights.