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Old 4 Aug 2016, 12:32 (Ref:3663415)   #1
Danathar
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How much faster could GTE/GTLM go?

I was wondering...

If there was the desire, how much faster could the current GT cars be designed to go (and survive endurance races). By faster I'm thinking of overall lap time?

I'm under the assumption that the current GTE/GTLM cars are specifically crippled as to not run into LMP2/LMP1 speeds. Is this true? If IMSA wanted to tweak the rules could the cars break the prototype track records on tracks in the U.S.?
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Old 4 Aug 2016, 12:55 (Ref:3663418)   #2
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Without the air restrictors and with some fatter tyres, we should be able to run down P2 without too much difficulty, although the brakes would probably need an upgrade to boot.
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Old 4 Aug 2016, 13:05 (Ref:3663420)   #3
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That is a good question. In addition, I'd like to know what could be done to allow for faster times?

My take:

1)Carbon brakes
2)More aero freedom
3)Reduced minimum weight (not sure if ballast is currently being used)
4) and of course more power!
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Old 4 Aug 2016, 13:13 (Ref:3663423)   #4
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Originally Posted by joeb View Post
That is a good question. In addition, I'd like to know what could be done to allow for faster times?

My take:

1)Carbon brakes
2)More aero freedom
3)Reduced minimum weight (not sure if ballast is currently being used)
4) and of course more power!
Well, I'd imagine you would not want to go TOO far outside what is sold to consumers. I don't recall but isn't ABS and TC also banned in GTE/GTLM?

Upgrading to carbon brakes would be fine.

I think an article has been done before to compare the off the lot version of the Corvette vs the race version. But that was years ago. It would be REALLY interesting to see what the current crop of GTE/GTLM drivers could do lap time using an off the lot with all the options corvette compared to the IMSA spec version at one of the tracks they go to.
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Old 4 Aug 2016, 13:47 (Ref:3663426)   #5
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Originally Posted by Danathar View Post
Well, I'd imagine you would not want to go TOO far outside what is sold to consumers. I don't recall but isn't ABS and TC also banned in GTE/GTLM?

Upgrading to carbon brakes would be fine.

I think an article has been done before to compare the off the lot version of the Corvette vs the race version. But that was years ago. It would be REALLY interesting to see what the current crop of GTE/GTLM drivers could do lap time using an off the lot with all the options corvette compared to the IMSA spec version at one of the tracks they go to.
In 2012 Road and Track did such a comparison.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars...e-gt-showdown/

Didn't compare tech too much, but did care laptimes
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Old 4 Aug 2016, 18:58 (Ref:3663475)   #6
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Originally Posted by joeb View Post
In 2012 Road and Track did such a comparison.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars...e-gt-showdown/

Didn't compare tech too much, but did care laptimes
Clicked on it again but the sections where the stories are a dead (links don't work). Content aint there no more
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Old 4 Aug 2016, 21:28 (Ref:3663487)   #7
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IMO it would probably be very easy to get them to at least late 00's GT1 speed with more power and better tires.

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Originally Posted by Danathar View Post
It would be REALLY interesting to see what the current crop of GTE/GTLM drivers could do lap time using an off the lot with all the options corvette compared to the IMSA spec version at one of the tracks they go to.
Any GTE car would absolutely demolish it's road car counterpart at any track, even the the track version of the Mclaren P1 hypercar is slower than the GT3 650S.

Some lap times from Spa for comparison:
GTE/GT3:
Ferrari 488 GTE - 2:17.632
Ford GT GTE (including sandbag ballast) - 2:18.163
Audi R8 LMS GT3 - 2:18.505


Roadcars:
Koenigsegg One:1 - 2:33.00
McLaren P1 - 2:38.00
Chevrolet Corvette ZR1 - 2:41.69
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Old 5 Aug 2016, 00:27 (Ref:3663507)   #8
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There's a lot of untapped potential in these classes - GT3 in particular. The "Super GT3" idea briefly became a popular what if idea amongst engineers for exactly that reason - some looked at how much you could change before elevating things to an unsustainable level, some looked at how little you could get away with changing to achieve a particular performance gain.

Regardless, both classes could, without too much difficulty, be bumped up to current LMP2 speeds with a bit of work if someone wanted to go that far.

Can't recall where, but I did once(before talks of speeding up the classes began making serious rounds) read that with aerodynamic and suspension improvements(as in to the level of making the cars look VERY DTM-like) a 15% increase in GTE pace at Le Mans could be achieved on the same tires and brakes.
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Old 5 Aug 2016, 01:33 (Ref:3663510)   #9
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Would love to see what the new 488 could do with no restrictors and the boost wound up. Wouldn't sound as good as a Prodrive 550 though
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Old 5 Aug 2016, 03:48 (Ref:3663520)   #10
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If the GTE/GTLM cars go faster in the next two or three years, will it be up to par or potentially take over against LMP2 in terms of speed?
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Old 5 Aug 2016, 05:47 (Ref:3663527)   #11
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The mid-late 00's gt1's were doing sub 3:50's at LM. The tires are better today. The cars are about 100kg heavier and -100hp. I think the modern cars have plenty of upside to them (maybe not the Porsche and Aston Martin).
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Old 5 Aug 2016, 13:10 (Ref:3663567)   #12
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I think the modern cars have plenty of upside to them (maybe not the Porsche and Aston Martin).
Right, but you said modern cars!
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Old 5 Aug 2016, 13:15 (Ref:3663570)   #13
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Originally Posted by MagVanisher View Post
If the GTE/GTLM cars go faster in the next two or three years, will it be up to par or potentially take over against LMP2 in terms of speed?
P2 is supposed to make a significant step up in speed next year which might open the door for GTE/GTLM to go a bit faster as well.
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Old 5 Aug 2016, 22:44 (Ref:3663719)   #14
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Without the air restrictors and with some fatter tyres, we should be able to run down P2 without too much difficulty, although the brakes would probably need an upgrade to boot.
I highly doubt that!

GTs were 10s and 9s slower than P2s on Silv and Spa this year.

Fatter tyres would give what, 2s?

The biggest handicap of the GT cars is actually their weight. DTM probably have about the same power as GTs and they still are on par with LMP2s and the reason is obviously their 1030kg weight instead of 1250kg, or whatever, for the GTs(as DTM have spec Hankook tyres)

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Originally Posted by DistortedSmile View Post
IMO it would probably be very easy to get them to at least late 00's GT1 speed with more power and better tires.
better tires how, increasing width? Because, given their stint lengh, the current compounds are about as good as they currently can have

P2s will upgrade their power to 600HP next year, IIRC, so I guess GT500 won't be faster than them even on a place like Fuji(On Suzuka I doubt that would happen even as it is now)
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Old 5 Aug 2016, 22:57 (Ref:3663720)   #15
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Apologies for the off-topic, but ...

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P2s will upgrade their power to 600HP next year, IIRC, so I guess GT500 won't be faster than them even on a place like Fuji(On Suzuka I doubt that would happen even as it is now)
Actually Fuji would be the first track - and not the only one, Buriram would be my other choice - where I would expect 2017 GT500 to be faster than 2017 LMP2. Don't forget GT500 run at/very close to 650hp with no plans to kerb that so far, and the target 25% downforce reduction will also come with a smaller but significant drop in drag.

And I would be confident that this year's GT500 (well, maybe not the NSX-GT...) would lap Suzuka faster than this year's LMP2.
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