"F1 in its worst state for years". Discuss.

[Dani Filth]

F1 at the momment isn't as good as it can be .. but is much better than other single seater series ..

[alesi95]

Mr M Schumacher should retire.

[BootsOntheSide]

The rules definately need changing. A return to slicks, less aerodynamic downforce, more mechanical grip from wider tyres, less chicanes at the circuits, less cookie-cutter tracks, and ideally more charismatic drivers. Maybe it was reduce safety, but I think that's a neccessary consequence, as long as its not like the old days

[Minardi fan]

Slicks.

Stop destroying great tracks.

End the Ferrari domination. (Dunno how...)

Give more money to the tail-end teams.

Oh, and the beryllium being banned? It screwed Minardi as well... The year it was banned was the year they were due to get the new Supertec engine, and guess what it had in it...

[Neil C]

End Ferrari domination? Yes
How? There are 9 teams of engineers, mechanics, managers and drivers working on that as we speak. If Ferrari domination ends, it will be due to the success of their competitors. You are not going to legislate away or wish away Ferrari. In spite of the politics involved, Ferrari worked hard for many years to reach this point. Their dedication to success won't dissapear just because F1 fans want it to.

[JohnSSC]

Interesting discussion! Thank you to Liz and Alesi95 for resolving the whole issue by getting rid of TGF! Just once I would like to engage in a discussion of the merits of racing without some sort of reference to how we need to be rid of TGF - and he is not my favorite driver, either! I mean, geez, how about we stick to topic?? One driver is not and cannot be the root of all evil!

I would like to follow some of the more constructive comments such as: the growing number of generic tracks, going back to slicks, getting rid of the V-10 rule and changing the overall dimensions of the cars.

I am not sure that changing aero rules will help a lot unless it is a radical change. The engineers always seem to be able to make this year's car faster than last, even when there has been tinkering with wing sizes, etc. What about a return to slicks, decrease wheel diameters, eliminate the multiple-element rear wings and remove the barge boards?

As far as tracks go, absolutely remove the chicanes! Let 'em race!

[racing_guru]

JohnSSC, I agree with your first paragraph completely and , there is little discussion on solutions other then blame Schumacher. Pathetic really . . . but coming from some members, not too surprising . . .

[TimD]

Okay, okay. Now focusing on two posts out of thirty-plus is the way threads spin out of control. But point taken.

Now, on with the constructive comments. JohnSSC, I mentioned in my suggestions a dramatic reduction in wings and venturi. My theory being that a smaller aerodynamic area will make the cars following less susceptible to the "dirty air" phenomenon. Not only would it mean that the cars have less aerodynamic grip to start with, but the designers would have to look at other ways to mess up the air in the first place. It's recognised that one of the extra little tweaks a good designer will utilise is his ability to make the turbulence behind his car just that little bit choppier than it could be. Limiting what they could do at the back of the car might mitigate against this just a little bit.

[JohnSSC]

TimD, I think you make an excellent point about the dirty air. That may go aways to resolving the lack of passing issue. Can't blame the drivers there - if one has no grip, how can they get'round the car in front? Removing intentionally placed turbulence would allow closer racing and (hopefully) more passing.

I think stuff like this would still allow the engineers to engineer, just give different parameters that would hopefully encourage closer racing. Not implying that cars are not strong or safe now, but perhaps a longer, wider car would allow for more driver safety improvements.

[freud]

Great suggestion, TimD. I read an article by Adrian Newey a few years ago in which he proposed a few changes in the current regulations of F1 Car designs. He mentioned the theory of smaller aerodynamic area of cars. Basically if you look at the amended rules introduced by FIA since 1998, the aerodynamic areas of cars have gotten less and less every year. E.g. Notice the F2002 is even lower & slimmer than F2001. Adrian Newey did say that one major problem with dramatically reducing aerodynamic areas is the loss of 'downforce'which would make cars highly unstable and prone to crashes.

[Inigo Montoya]

There is a significant amount of good racing taking place in the middle of the pack? Doesn't this imply that there is no problem with the current rules, but only that the smaller teams have to catch up with the bigger ones (and everyone has to catch up to Ferrari)??

[JohnSSC]

But maybe instead of decreasing the overall surface area, then get rid of "intentional turbulence" and decrease the size of the wheel/tire package - make the corners entertaining again.

[freud]

I cannot say for sure as I am not aware of the scientific and technical aspects of formula-one aerodynamics & car design... I have learned only from reading various articles & books and discussions with others. Right now the priority of the designer is to stick those grooved tyres to the track & make the cars stable. Legalising traction control does that, but its like taking sport in the wroong direction. You put in gooves first and then you want to stabilise those grooves with TC?? Instead, bring back slick tyres first and start from there. TC is not bad but it makes a drivers job too easy. If its removed then there must be strict & fair control to check otherwise some teams will cheat (and they always have]. There should be more leeway in the aerodynamic laws [as TimD says].

[Legend]

Originally posted by freud
TC is not bad but it makes a drivers job too easy.

Schumacher said that TC makes cares actually be able to drive faster, ergo his conculsion was: It makes it harder to drive with TC than without!

[freud]

Dont you know that TGF often says words that are music to Max and Bernie's ears??
TC makes a driver's job harder?? That must be a joke.

[Guy Goddard2]

F1 at present is like watching paint dry but like many fans we all hope the next race will be different.
Austria 2002 goes down as the day F1 lost its credibility and followed on by France where an unworthy champion was crowned.
You only have to watch a review of the 80's or early 90's and you suddenly realise the two are miles apart.
I stay watching the sport hoping that another Australia would happen to Minardi and bring back a human side of emotions rather than watch a robotic Ross Brawn or TGF giving an interview.

Watch Touring cars for motor racing and stick to F1 for the advertising boards driving around in a queue...




Guy

[Minardi fan]

Originally posted by Guy Goddard2

I stay watching the sport hoping that another Australia would happen to Minardi and bring back a human side of emotions rather than watch a robotic Ross Brawn or TGF giving an interview.

Exactly. Why do I still watch F1? Because Minardi *might* score a point... because Heinz and his Arrows (not anymore... ) *might* have made it onto the podium... because Enrique *might* have bagged his first points in F1... and because Kimi *might* win a race...

[Valve Bounce]

This is the first time ever that I have gone to bed half way through a race, and not even bothering to watch teh rest of th race the next morning. I just find the race so boring. Perhaps if someone like massa or Bunsen starts to win races, I could be interested again.

Valve

[slicktoast]

If the "right" people are still making tons of cash, NOTHING will change to make the races less boring. Until the "right" people start losing money we can wish for slicks & etc. all we want. Witness the past handfull of seasons.

[DNQ]

I can't believe how B-O-R-I-N-G Formula 1 is this year. 2001 was actually reasonable, in that there was some promise, and there was someone reasonably close to Schumahcer most races. This year, the Ferrari package is just sooo much better that racing is non-existent.

This is definantly the worst Formula One season I have watched - you will disagree if you like Ferrari of course, in which case you'll love it

Imola, Barcelona, Montreal and Hockenheim have been SUPER boring this year, only Monaco, Austria and Britian have been interesting races.

It is really annoying me that the sport is in such a state that you can tell your friends who won the race on Thursday...before the race.

Hungarian GP results:
1. Michael Schumacher



Ferrari have done a sensational job this year, and it would be unfair to peg them back - of course its up to the other teams to improve their game, despite not being a Ferrari fan, I am against weight-penalties - I would prefer concessions being given to the backmarkers in the form of more TV money etc. In Ferrari getting more TV cash than Minardi, the gap only widens.

[Legend]

Originally posted by DNQ


It is really annoying me that the sport is in such a state that you can tell your friends who won the race on Thursday...before the race.

Hungarian GP results:
1. Michael Schumacher

Sometimes you can tell your friends that in a Monday too.


And what is more boring if statuesque next year!

WDC 2003 Michael Schumacher

[Sodemo]

Its gone down the ****ter for the simple fact that F1 has lost a lot of its excitement, I used to get nervous before the start of a GP, I don't anymore.

F1 has lost the spectacle of racing, its only really this year and last, with the softer tyres that the racing is slightly improving.

We only have effectivly 20 cars, that isn't good enough, I'd like to see a grid of 26 cars.

Where have the sparks from the undertrays gone?
Where are the daring overtaking manoovers?

[Tristan]

I don't know why, but I still find F1 hugely entertaining. EVEN AFTER TODAY!!! OH YES!!! But then I'm (we're) not normal.

[Minardi fan]

Yawn... what an awful race... again... Thank GOD for the McLarens and Fisichella and Massa who managed to inject a *little* life into the proceedings... Kimi, you're a st*r...

[AllonFS]

I am in the middle of decorating, and as the race was so dull, I left it halfway through and went back to see if the first coat was dry enough to paint on. Yup, it has come to the point where watching paint dry is literally more interesting than F1. What a sorry state.

Someone above said that they don't get nervous before the race - I think that puts is perfectly. I used to watch the start of the race with butterflies in my stomach, now it is with a sense of resignation. F1 can't be described anymore as the pinnacle of motorsport (it's a business not a sport) or as the pinnacle of motor-racing (there is so little racing). Very sad.