DTM History

**Asp** · 16 Mar 2003, 15:35 (Ref:538125)

Motors TV are bringing the reviews of past years from the DTM as a build-up to the new season; starting tonight at 9pm with 1993.
Looks good for anyone (like me) who has no idea about the DTM before the relaunch!

TimD · 16 Mar 2003, 15:46 (Ref:538139)

Fantastic! I needed a copy of the 1993 season review!!

**touringlegend** · 16 Mar 2003, 16:39 (Ref:538170)

I've never viewed any pre-2000 DTM so I'll have to add this to my "to watch list"!

flor · 16 Mar 2003, 17:12 (Ref:538189)

the action in the 90s was a lot better than in toadys dtm

codename_47 · 16 Mar 2003, 19:38 (Ref:538272)

What an excellent Idea this is, Good old Motors TV!

Next week it will be joined by a "BTCC Story" review too....though not sure what year!

I love this channel!

Carrie · 16 Mar 2003, 21:27 (Ref:538367)

Right, I'm depressed. Everyone is going to spend all season going on about the joys of Motors TV and I'm stuck here with nothing more than the terrestrial channels to keep me happy.
Sounds like anyone who can get Motors TV is in for some good viewing this year.

**touringlegend** · 16 Mar 2003, 22:20 (Ref:538401)

Oh my god!

What an excellent 1 hour of classic DTM action. First time I've ever seen the full Nurburgring actually raced on like that, the cars getting air, that Wurstof(?) circuit and the other one round an airport...

Oh, by the way, there was an Alfa and an Opel that were considerably visually different and much slower looking, what were they doing out there? My memory can recall them having a bit of some rough with the 'proper' DTM cars...

Carrie - Sky isn't that expensive...

codename_47 · 16 Mar 2003, 23:00 (Ref:538432)

Quote:

Originally posted by touringlegend
Carrie - Sky isn't that expensive...

Furthermore (ooh, that was a big word!

) Motors Tv is free to air......meaning you don't even have to subscribe to the damned Sky if you don't want....just buy the box and you'll get it along with all the BBC stuff ETC.

Great show that was.....why don't they race on half of those tracks any more? The two airfields looked cool.....shame they don't use them anymore in favour of more trips to the usual suspects.....Hockenheim, Nurburgring etc :confused:

**touringlegend** · 17 Mar 2003, 07:56 (Ref:538641)

Probably safety - did you see the Beemer getting air at one of the, erm, airstrips...

flor · 17 Mar 2003, 08:02 (Ref:538646)

Quote:

Originally posted by touringlegend
)

Oh, by the way, there was an Alfa and an Opel that were considerably visually different and much slower looking, what were they doing out there? My memory can recall them having a bit of some rough with the 'proper' DTM cars...

that alfa was gianni guidici, he had a class 2 touring car as the only one in the grid. it was a 2litre car, you can say it was super touring car if i remember right

flor · 17 Mar 2003, 08:10 (Ref:538653)

Quote:

Originally posted by codename_47

Great show that was.....why don't they race on half of those tracks any more? The two airfields looked cool.....shame they don't use them anymore in favour of more trips to the usual suspects.....Hockenheim, Nurburgring etc :confused:

yeah it´s a shame they dont race on those airstrip circuits

, the dtm people from today think a firct class series has to drive on first class circuits

, ok the airstrips had a bit of a safety problem because of track there were landing lights and if perhaps a formula 3 car went over it its monocoque was ripped apart, and one of the airports (wunstorf or diepholz) was shut down i think

they also dropped most of the city circuits, like avus, singen and helsinki, avus due to safety reasons

flor · 17 Mar 2003, 08:23 (Ref:538662)

by the way if you like cars getting in the air you might like this Fisichella pic

http://mitglied.lycos.de/konsumidiot/Alfa.jpg

TimD · 17 Mar 2003, 10:47 (Ref:538758)

One of the problems with the airfields was that there were landing lights set into concrete housings to the sides of the runway - that is - into the grass runoffs. I recall a DTC Primera turning an innocuous slide into a spectacular triple somersault with twist when it connected with one.

As for the street circuits, well, apart from Singen being as narrow as a very very narrow thing on a diet, there was a monster startline pileup at Avus in 1995, and the manufacturers ganged up against the organisers to get the circuits dropped in favour of other tracks. The carrot, of course, was the internationally renowned tracks that made up the numbers when the series became the ITC.

That programme was an awesome trip down memory lane, though. And Carrie - I taped it. Next time you're visiting Silverstone, just shout!

KA · 17 Mar 2003, 11:53 (Ref:538797)

Quote:

Originally posted by flor
that alfa was gianni guidici, he had a class 2 touring car as the only one in the grid. it was a 2litre car, you can say it was super touring car if i remember right

The DTM included a separate class for 2-litre class 2 cars (what would eventually become Supertouring) that year (think it was the only time it happened?). There were only ever a few entries- Giudici, as you mentioned and Franz Engstler in Alfas, and a couple of Opel Astras (Marco Werner in one?) come to mind, plus when the DTM visited Donington one or two BTCC regulars joined in- Dave Pinkney's BMW 318 Coupe was one?

Craner Curves · 17 Mar 2003, 14:24 (Ref:538959)

I've got the Donington Autosport preview supplement from 1993 here. The FIA Class 2 cars entered were: Gianni Guidici and Franz Engstler in Alfa Romeo 155s, Marco Werner and Martin Wimmer in Opel Astra saloons and Ian Khan in his Vauxhall Cavalier. I think Pinkney did join in as well.

I think I remember Warren Hughes barrel rolling his Mondeo in 1995 at one of the airfield tracks as well, Tim.

Rob29 · 17 Mar 2003, 14:25 (Ref:538961)

Just to correct a few technicalities.None of the the german circuits were at Airports, they were military airbases which it seems required only the base comanders permission to use,no local planning. Singen's problem was that it was TOO popular and there was no room for more stands.Helsinki was successful for DTM not for F3000.Most popular current DTM venue is Norisring-must be a message for the DTM promoters there-get rid of the the boring new Nurburg & Hockenheim.

kmchow · 17 Mar 2003, 17:57 (Ref:539208)

Ka wrote:

>The DTM included a separate class for 2-litre class 2 cars (what would eventually >become Supertouring) that year (think it >was the only time it happened?).
>
But they raced at the same time on the track? I'm suprised there weren't more Class 2 cars racing?

Craner Curves wrote:

>The FIA Class 2 cars entered were: Gianni Guidici and Franz Engstler in Alfa Romeo >155s, Marco Werner and Martin Wimmer in Opel Astra saloons and Ian Khan in his >Vauxhall Cavalier. I think Pinkney did join in as well.
>
Ditto for when the DTM appeared at Donington? I don't see any Works cars entered?

You guys are so lucky to be able to watch some classic DTM races. The only races I've watched is the 94 season, available from Duke Video. Does anyone know where I can buy some cheap DTM videos in NTSC format?

joey1 · 17 Mar 2003, 18:41 (Ref:539263)

the cars looked great nice box shapes great. also seen some nascar live on motors, this was not their own production though and theyu used another chanels commentators. does anyone know what other championships we are going to see live on motors.

Kid Prozac · 17 Mar 2003, 19:50 (Ref:539357)

Quote:

Originally posted by TimD

As for the street circuits, well, apart from Singen being as narrow as a very very narrow thing on a diet, there was a monster startline pileup at Avus in 1995, and the manufacturers ganged up against the organisers to get the circuits dropped in favour of other tracks. The carrot, of course, was the internationally renowned tracks that made up the numbers when the series became the ITC.

the avus crash at avus 95 was horrific, pretty much the entire field was involved, iirc the first three cars got through then i think someone got sideways effectively blocking th track and everyone piled on. i remeber seeing pictures of the cars, not much left of them at all.

it was dangerous though, lest we forget this was the place that Keith Odor was killed at, and also the horrific accident which befell JOhn Winter in i think 1994.

Singen i thought was always a highly entetaining race. Certainly the hairpins which were effectuvely two lanes of a dual carriageway with a bit of armco down the middle provided plenty of action, cars using the walls to straighten themselves up on the exit of the corners!!! also they always had qualifying late at night which was always spectacular, glowing brake discs and plenty of sparks fromt he splitters and the armco

codename_47 · 17 Mar 2003, 23:59 (Ref:539643)

Quote:

Originally posted by joey1
the cars looked great nice box shapes great. also seen some nascar live on motors, this was not their own production though and theyu used another chanels commentators. does anyone know what other championships we are going to see live on motors.

*here comes the Walking Motors TV Advert!*

Live:
DTM,
BTCC,
Selected Nascar: Busch rounds
Some Bike Racing.

Full Races delayed:
V8 supercars (Race 1 on Friday nights....race 2 Saturday)
The Nascar Busch races that aren't live!

I'm trying to work out if they're attempting to become the
european equivilant to the american Speed channel.

codename_47 · 18 Mar 2003, 00:03 (Ref:539646)

Quote:

Originally posted by Kid Prozac
it was dangerous though, lest we forget this was the place that Keith Odor was killed at, and also the horrific accident which befell JOhn Winter in i think 1994.
[/B]

Wasn't Keith O'Dor the man who went over the barrier at Donington
in a clip that has made EVERY crash video going? :confused:

Never knew what happened to him after he left BTCC, that's a damn shame

dretceterini · 18 Mar 2003, 00:53 (Ref:539682)

At the time the DTM first started, I think the supertouring series in Italy was still for 2 liter turbos and most of the other european series were for 2 liter N/A cars.

Would be nice if we actually got some of this stuff on US TV...

racer69 · 18 Mar 2003, 06:37 (Ref:539828)

Quote:

Originally posted by dretceterini
At the time the DTM first started, I think the supertouring series in Italy was still for 2 liter turbos and most of the other european series were for 2 liter N/A cars.

The DTM started in 1984 though remember, Group A was the big thing then.

I've seen some of the very early 90s DTM races, with the likes of Biela Stuck and Rohrl in Audi's, Cecotto, Soper etc.. in M3's, the Eggenberger Opel Omega's, great stuff. I wouldn't mind seeing some of the early DTM stuff.

alesi95 · 18 Mar 2003, 11:15 (Ref:539976)

Does anyone remember the early satellite channel Screensport? They used to show shed loads of Motorsport.
I think they were eventually bought by Eurosport.

Speedworx · 18 Mar 2003, 21:33 (Ref:540557)

I saw ITC in 1996, but nothing before that.

The 1993 review was good. Roll on 1994.

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