BTCC 2018 in-season discussion

[S griffin]

Shame Sabine never gave it a go with the Jaguar(?) engined Transit

[Evantra]

Another blow for HARD...

"In a carry over from Knockhill, Carl Boardley has been excluded from the results of all three races in Scotland, where he joined the grid in the Team HARD Volkswagen CC now being driven by Hammerton.

Boardley had taken a best finish of 23rd on his one-off with the team, but was thrown out of the results for a non-homologated part. Team HARD with Trade Price cars have also been docked 40 championship points for the infringement and drop to -17 points as a result."

[Alfisti]

And it's taken a fortnight to announce this? Or did the news trickle out a while back and nobody noticed? What was the part cock up? Points isn't bad as penalties go, Penske recently got fined 30 grand in Oz Supercars for accidentally fixing a prototype component on a car for race weekend.

[medius]

Was the non-homologated part a chequebook?

[Racer65]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

And it's taken a fortnight to announce this? Or did the news trickle out a while back and nobody noticed? What was the part cock up? Points isn't bad as penalties go, Penske recently got fined 30 grand in Oz Supercars for accidentally fixing a prototype component on a car for race weekend.

The officials only meet at the race weekends so if it was something that took a bit of checking this weekend would have been the first time they would be able to finalise it all.

[BobJones]

Here's the thing, I really enjoy the BTCC but is it me or has it become predictably unpredictable?

What I mean by that is, you know that if someone has championship or race result ballast and the harder tyre, then they are going backwards, and conversely, if they have the softer tyre and less weight, they are going forward. In many ways then, you can now predict an Ingram 'charge' or at least expect certain cars/drivers to be quick given the tyre and weight combo – which takes away the excitement, for me, of what would normally be an incredible spectacle.

Can you have too much of a good thing? Yes, I think you can. A new track would help, but it's not possible. Thus, ditch the tyre compounds – or at least make the difference between them smaller, or have three compounds and set which one is to be used at each track e.g. soft at Brands, hard at Donington, extra hard at Thruxton etc.

[S griffin]

Could be worse, could have the two compound per race we have in F1

[btccbloke]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Could be worse, could have the two compound per race we have in F1

Now a pitstop race where both compounds have to be used could add something. Not necessarily something the sport needs but look at the scenario quoted of Tingram coming through on the softer tyre with no weight which was described as predictable, now add in that he will have to change to the harder tyre whilst those starting on the harder compound are now on the preferred tyre and able to catch back up before the end.

Not something I'd be massively for or against, and I know the current format wouldn't really allow pitstop or feature races but in its context of this tyre situation making things predictable it may be a consideration

[Evantra]

Originally Posted by btccbloke

Now a pitstop race where both compounds have to be used could add something. Not necessarily something the sport needs but look at the scenario quoted of Tingram coming through on the softer tyre with no weight which was described as predictable, now add in that he will have to change to the harder tyre whilst those starting on the harder compound are now on the preferred tyre and able to catch back up before the end.

Not something I'd be massively for or against, and I know the current format wouldn't really allow pitstop or feature races but in its context of this tyre situation making things predictable it may be a consideration

I just think they should get rid of it. Really doesn't add anything; the ballast / reverse grids do a good enough job of mixing up the grid on their own.

[Matt K]

This predictable unpredictability point is very good and I also feel it this way and the rules are to blame for that. Reversed grids (with ridiculous draw), different tyres, ballast and sometimes boost adjustments. This all makes the championship look like it's one big draw game where you don't need to be anything special in order to win races. The teams and engineers don't have to be anything special as well. Of course that's the exaggaration but sometimes it is felt this way.
Then all these discussions start - is [add driver] really that good or is it boost, ballast, RWD/FWD and so on. The thing is when such huge charges through the field happen too often, it's not anything amazing anymore. And the same, multiple winners is not something that really thrills people as it's predictable that it'll be this way and so on.
Through all this, BTCC seems artificial at times and leads people to hold strange claims that it's not motorsport but just entertainment.

I'd say the format should be changed - maybe it should look like this year's Snetterton with two quali sessions for Race 1 and Race 3 (longer one). They should scrap performance weights as well. Second race's grid could be reversed (I mean Top 10 of it) like in old WTCC days to spice things up a bit. This would really change things. For the better. I'd rather see 4 great drivers who fight for title and maybe 3 more who win races than the whole Top 10 artificially in the title fight with half of the field winning races.
But it's all just a wishful thinking. Unfortunately.

[antnee]

Aren't charges through the field a part of the closeness of the competition though? You make a mistake in quali/R1 and end up near the back but you have front running pace, then you are likely to be able to charge through the field. Now if you fluff your quali lap in F1/other championships and loose 0.5, you are still likely to be on the first 3 or 4 rows of the grid.

[crmalcolm]

My own opinion - there is not too much wrong at the moment.

Take a look at the table, down to 10th place, and you would expect any of those drivers to be performing well:

Goff, Cook and Morgan could be seen as the 'newer' faces at the top of the table, and each of them has proven their ability over a few years now.

Lower down the table, you have the teams and drivers that would be expected to be in the back half of the grid (Plato excepted).
The multiple race winners shows that - on a given day - get it right and your team can have some glory. The best way to ensure continued backing to run in the BTCC.
But over the course of a season, the consistent results are what sees the cream rise to the top.
It's on the days when carrying ballast, and with the harder tyre, that putting your car in the points is making the difference. Not when you are ballast free and cruising at the front.

[S griffin]

Exactly, I think the closeness of the grid helps. The drivers and cars are of more equal performances now

[GT6]

The organisers have in my opinion got it pretty well perfect, over half the field has won a race, last round and still plenty to race for including overall champion and different cars doing well each round. I think a big congratulations to all involved is in order. Will be sitting at druids in 13 days to enjoy it.

[porsche962fan]

and something overlooked, now over half the grid actually won a race this season

[S griffin]

And a few more have won races in previous seasons, just not this season ATM. Austin, Cole, Plato, Jelley, Boardman and Nash

Anyway, what a plonker moment for Team HARD. Losing all three finishes at Knockhill with Boardley for a technicality, plus getting -40 points. There is some potential in the team, drivers and car, shame the management is letting them down

[850Estate]

Do we know that Hard's non-homologated part was yet?

[Alfisti]

Pink bobble hat? 😁

The info is not in the public domain that I can find, which seems odd.

[bella]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

The info is not in the public domain that I can find, which seems odd.

must be embarrassing for both the series and the team, in that case.

[BobJones]

Originally Posted by bella

must be embarrassing for both the series and the team, in that case.

...like...let's say as an example....maybe...a road car part when race car parts weren't there....possibly.

[S griffin]

Wheel arches, like the Rover Vitesses?

[Robin Marriott]

Which car was it on?

[swooshiain]

Originally Posted by Robin Marriott

Which car was it on?

Boardley's.

[Pdh]

The reason it’s not in the public domain is because it doesn’t need to be, not everything that goes on needs to be made public

[Alfisti]

Other series would state an investigation was being conducted and the crime and the punishment if applicable; the way TOCA do things at times appears frankly amateur.

It takes them two weeks to make known a decision to exclude a car and dock some points - why? They clearly had found the suspect part at Knockhill during scrutineering and either determined it was a no no on the spot or confiscated it for further checks.

On that form what if driver A wins the championship at Brands but a part is found suspect after scrutineering? Brush under the carpet? A quiet announcement a fortnight later A isn't champion and B is? The handling is worse than the FIA farce over barge boards on Eddie Irvines Ferrari 20 years ago...