Buying fuel

[Derwent Motorsp]

I was in my local Sainsburys yesterday filling up the road car and there is a notice on the pump that says: Fuel regulations: You can only fill 2 x 5 litre plastic or 2 x 10 litres metal cans.
Now most people carry 20 litre cans. Are we no longer allowed to fill them?

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by Derwent Motorsp

I was in my local Sainsburys yesterday filling up the road car and there is a notice on the pump that says: Fuel regulations: You can only fill 2 x 5 litre plastic or 2 x 10 litres metal cans.
Now most people carry 20 litre cans. Are we no longer allowed to fill them?

Those regulations have been in force for years. It's the quantity you are allowed to carry in your car that they refer to. Google them, and see how much (little) you are allowed to store at home as well.

Some retailers turn a blind eye, Sainsbury usually don't! Luckily the local Shell station here adopts the former attitude, and I only ever need Sainsbury petrol in small quantities for generator.....

[Tim Falce]

These may help

http://www.hse.gov.uk/fireandexplosi...ssociation.htm
http://www.hse.gov.uk/fireandexplosi...containers.pdf
http://www.hse.gov.uk/cdg/

So you can use 20ltr Jerry cans and you can carry up to 30 ltrs in your car or store the same amount at home. Garages may have different rules or interpretations as to what they will sell you

[zefarelly]

So I shouldn't have a 25L drum and 20l jerry in the boot of my car for testing tomorrow then . . . . . but I could put 60L in the car ?

F in g daft

[GORDON STREETER]

There are restrictions on carrying fuel on the chunnel and ferries but I don't know if they are ever enforced, I expect some jobsworth might try it though !

[Tim Falce]

Originally Posted by GORDON STREETER

There are restrictions on carrying fuel on the chunnel and ferries but I don't know if they are ever enforced, I expect some jobsworth might try it though !

I've been asked how much fuel I had on my trailer before going on the ferry but the guy didn't seem bothered when I told him.
I know some bloke who once took a jet car with quite a lot of hydrogen peroxide in drums onto a ferry once and caused quite a bit of consternation.

[Colin McKay]

Last time I checked ?3 years ago? P&O Dover/Calais and the Shuttle (and probably most other carriers if you read the small print) don't allow empty containers either unless they have been evacuated and certified as such, but I've never known it to be checked

[Mike Bell]

Thanks Tim, I couldn't be arsed to look them up! From 'discussions' I've had at Sainsbury in the past, their H&S and Fire Regs are strict.

Interesting regarding containers- that it / they should have a capacity 10-15% GREATER than the the nominal capacity. 20 litre Jerry can certainly doesn't! The '5 litre' marked can I use for generator fuel takes 6 litres- now I know why.....

The requirement for warning labels seems to be almost totally ignored, by me included. Best I get some organised!

Yes, ferry and tunnel have regs for full fuel containers and gas bottles. Best keep them out of sight if you're carrying more than allowed. Colin, I didn't realise that empty containers were regulated as well. Next stop P&O freight website.....

[Colin McKay]

Nothing would surprise me but surely even the most conscientious jobsworth wouldn't take issue with empties, but it would only take 1 incident to raise awareness and regs to be enforced, and the tunnel has had it's share of fires in the past......

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by Colin McKay

it would only take 1 incident to raise awareness and regs to be enforced, and the tunnel has had it's share of fires in the past......

Precisely. I once carried some drums of Sunoco, but certainly wouldn't now!

The P&O general 'contract' terms say that one shouldn't carry fuel cans, full or empty, onto the ferry. Obviously overlooked most of the time! The Freight T&Cs are vague, but guess fuel in containers would be covered under 'hazardous goods'.

They have specific requirements for transporting Ferrets as well......

[DaveGT6]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

They have specific requirements for transporting Ferrets as well......

Presumably they must be stored down your trouser leg the bottom of which must be secured with a length of bailing twine and inserted into a welly?

[GORDON STREETER]

I don't know if they still do it but in the 60s they used to pump out most of the fuel in the tanks on our motorbikes when catching the ferry from Liverpool for the IOM TT races !

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by DaveGT6

Presumably they must be stored down your trouser leg the bottom of which must be secured with a length of bailing twine and inserted into a welly?

How'd you guess! Think they come under 'dangerous goods'.....

Gordon, assume the fuel drained went straight into a ship employee's car?

[Colin McKay]

Trouble with ferret regs is that they've got you by the short & curlies

[Mike Bell]

[GORDON STREETER]

Originally Posted by Mike Bell

Gordon, assume the fuel drained went straight into a ship employee's car?

Heaven forbid ! it was obviously got rid of

[Rikki Cann]

Originally Posted by GORDON STREETER

There are restrictions on carrying fuel on the chunnel and ferries but I don't know if they are ever enforced, I expect some jobsworth might try it though !

Can be a pain in a^%& when you have to take enough fuel with you for a 6 hr race for a car that burns 1.5 ltrs per minute, better keep quite about it .

[Colin McKay]

Last time out at Spa I risked the empty jerry cans and bought V power in Belgium, cheaper that way too. I noticed it was crystal clear rather than the yellow tinge we get over here, but assume its same stuff. Add octane booster if you're nervous and either use it all up or brim the race car for the journey home. I gave up carting 150 litres of the stuff around years ago, the consequences of an accident don't bear thinking about and you won't see your insurance company for dust if the unthinkable happens.

[Nial McCabe]

It's interesting to read this. All of the race tracks I've seen in the northeast USA have leaded racing fuel available on site. And since decent fuel isn't available anywhere else, we have no choice (it is not legal to buy leaded fuel at retail gasoline dealers in the US).

Our very best unleaded "high test" gasoline for street cars is only 93 octane (RON method). And much of our street gas is 10% ethanol, which is OK for detonation but can be a pain in the neck for long term storage (as sometimes happens with race cars in off-season).
So I never carry much fuel, except what is in the fuel cell. I always buy at the track.

It is technically possible to buy 100 octane "LL" (low lead) fuel at some airports, but the airports folks don't always like to do it and the fuel isn't that great anyway....and it's expensive.

When I was just at the Summit Point race track last weekend, I paid about $11 a gallon for 110 octane leaded racing fuel. In your numbers, I think that's about 2 GBP per liter.
Most other tracks are similar except Watkins Glen which just switched to 98 octane unleaded gas only at their track pumps (Watkins Glen is owned by NASCAR and this is part of a NASCAR initiative). My car is probably OK on 98 octane, but I'm not sure how some of my other friends will deal with it. I've been told the octane boosters we have here are not really very effective.

[JasperClan]

I got pulled for a check by customs at Dover about 3 years ago and was informed that I was not allowed onto the ferry with the full jerry can attached to my trailer. I only managed to get about a third of it into the cars tank and customs had no qualms in putting the rest into one of their cars. Fortunately they didn't see the other can in the car.

Pete Richards

[FISCracer]

Originally Posted by Colin McKay

Last time out at Spa I risked the empty jerry cans and bought V power in Belgium, cheaper that way too. I noticed it was crystal clear rather than the yellow tinge we get over here, but assume its same stuff. Add octane booster if you're nervous and either use it all up or brim the race car for the journey home. I gave up carting 150 litres of the stuff around years ago, the consequences of an accident don't bear thinking about and you won't see your insurance company for dust if the unthinkable happens.

Colin, it's not the same stuff. Formulation varies by country. Be very careful at Zandvoort as V Power is only 97 from memory

[PeterMorley]

Originally Posted by FISCracer

Colin, it's not the same stuff. Formulation varies by country. Be very careful at Zandvoort as V Power is only 97 from memory

98 in Belgium according to the pump.