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29 Jun 2006, 11:23 (Ref:1644097) | #51 | |||
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29 Jun 2006, 11:47 (Ref:1644113) | #52 | ||
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Ha Ha, my car probably has about 540bhp now I have set up the ignition correctly and I could outdrag the KAD Mini at Rockingham but he slaughtered me in the twisty bits and under braking, its not all about power. In fact if I had not braked for the chicane I would have got past him easy enough and made him work for his supper. Would have added a bit of spice don't you think instead of them just disappearing off into the distance.
Trouble is Mig if he qualified lower he would end up way at the back of the grid so he still needs to qualify as high as he can. I wonder what start format DTRC will be running at Brands, thats if I am in of course. |
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29 Jun 2006, 13:06 (Ref:1644153) | #53 | |||
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race 1 he stayed ahead of me and race 2 i got ahead of him, which suggests as we all know there are other factors at work and if you re-ran the same start several times you would probably get several different results |
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AKA Guru its not speed thats dangerous, just the sudden lack of it! |
29 Jun 2006, 13:44 (Ref:1644171) | #54 | ||
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Watching the in car video we have you can see how the old boy was overpowered at the start still he had a good days racing
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29 Jun 2006, 14:20 (Ref:1644199) | #55 | |||
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i think as you a 50/50 split between the two start methods is fairest to all, mind you we could then get into a which start at at which venue question, lydden by way of nature favours small cars, so maybe a rolling start there evens things up a little, as might a standing start at snet which definatly favors big horsepower cars. but as i said earlier, to get a true picture of which start is best you would have to take out lots of variables or analyse a lot of race starts |
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AKA Guru its not speed thats dangerous, just the sudden lack of it! |
29 Jun 2006, 16:23 (Ref:1644278) | #56 | ||
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By virtue of the torque arm suspension on my car it will infact take off like a veritable drag car from a standing start controversaly and for the same reason if you do not get things correct it will axle hop on heavy breaking, swings and roundabouts again so I am not advocating rollers as a particular personal advantage.
I think the point is more safety than any disagvantage or advantage gained. Maybe it is because I hit a car square on once that was avoiding a stalled car or maybe I just got a real buzz from the rollers we did at the Rock as the car seemed so good midrange with the new dizzy, either way I'm now a staunch rolling start advocate! |
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29 Jun 2006, 16:40 (Ref:1644297) | #57 | ||
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Brands on 23rd July is a rolling start.
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29 Jun 2006, 19:15 (Ref:1644382) | #58 | ||
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Excellent, I will look forward to it even more (if I am in of course),
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29 Jun 2006, 22:24 (Ref:1644496) | #59 | |||
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Again, ChampCar do it that way, although at Cleveland it did mean that the yellows were out again before half the field had reached the start line! |
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2 Jul 2006, 21:59 (Ref:1646838) | #60 | ||
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Just to show that I wasn't going completely do-lally.... I was talking to a driver today who raced at Zandvoort last year. He said that in the driver briefing they were told very clearly that on their rolling start, the green light indicated that the formation was intack, the race was go, and that the pole position driver had control of the grid. They said that the race start would be as each car crossed the start line, and that if any car that broke formation before it had crossed the start line it would receive a 10s stop go penalty..... The same driver then went to Rockingham and was told that when the lights changed to green it was "game on"!
Guess it just goes to show that you need to check the regs for each track! |
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2 Jul 2006, 23:50 (Ref:1646897) | #61 | ||
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dtype38 - yep your Zandy rule is what I said back in post #36 - FISC is all mainland European circuits. An excellent example of the purpose of driver's briefings - and asking questions if unsure :-)
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3 Jul 2006, 12:36 (Ref:1647272) | #62 | |||
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The rules for starting in UK club racing seem to be the same for both types of starts otherwise you wouldn't be allowed to overtake anyone until you went past the gantry on a standing start. |
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3 Jul 2006, 15:34 (Ref:1647404) | #63 | ||
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>>>>>>we have been told you start racing when the red light goes out no matter where you are on the grid, exactly the same as a standing start.
Haven't got a Blue Book with me to check the car section, but in karting the rule is perfectly clear - you maintain position at the rolling start until you have crossed the start line. In standing start races, speed eventers have a massive advantage but normally get tired after one lap and drop back again! |
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3 Jul 2006, 15:47 (Ref:1647415) | #64 | ||
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Like I said, the rule seems to be different depending in where you are and what you're racing. General concensus, though, seems to be that for UK club meetings, don't worry about the start line. :-)
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3 Jul 2006, 17:20 (Ref:1647474) | #65 | ||
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Just got back and checked the Blue Book. Whilst under "karting" it says "it is an offence to break formation before crossing the start line itself" there is nothing at all under the car racing section. IMHO it is unacceptable to have different procedures for different clubs, races or tracks. How can a governing body that is so precise about one thing be so lax when it comes to another safety-related element?
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Midgetman - known as Max Tyler to the world. MaxAttaq! |
3 Jul 2006, 17:29 (Ref:1647478) | #66 | ||
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you are right max !
there seems to be very little continuety on this ! not just down to rules, but interpretation by COCs ! again, not just in uk ( to my expierience ) but all across europe. this resulted in me being the most hated individual on any briefing, as i need to put the same questions to every individual COC to test the waters of his interpretation. wouldn't want to loose out on the start for being too cautious, and same for being too agressive. down to this, my prefered start is a standing one ! the difference in regard to karting surely remains from th etimes where the starter was in the middle of the track, having one line flying past either side of him at the start. then fewer starters were suicidal, and they moved to the side of the road. still mr. buser didn't want to rewrite the rulebook it seems... |
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3 Jul 2006, 19:56 (Ref:1647553) | #67 | ||
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Well I think as the start finsh straight at the Rock is probably as wide as the M25 I think it perfectly safe and acceptable on the other hand at Lydden for example it may not be on.
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3 Jul 2006, 23:19 (Ref:1647654) | #68 | ||
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I've only just caught up with this thread. From my point of view as a Clerk of the Course - rolling starts - I love 'em.
I think they're safer on balance, much kinder on the cars (which is very relevant with historic cars) and a great time saver from an organiser's perspective. By the way, my instruction at drivers briefings for rolling starts is that everybody holds position until they cross the startline and I've never had any competitors (including series/championships which race in Europe) raise an objection to that. As far as I'm concerned, breaking formation before the startline is an 'out of position' start. |
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4 Jul 2006, 06:40 (Ref:1647732) | #69 | |||
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hmm intersting, i've done quite a few rolling starts but only ever one in the way you describe john, every other one when the lights go out you race, irrespective of where you are in the grid. so in a standing start race are you not allowed to pass each other until you reach the line? i think not and dont see why a rolling start should be any different |
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4 Jul 2006, 08:45 (Ref:1647822) | #70 | |||
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John Smith Clerk of the Course and MSA Steward Race Director for 360MRC |
4 Jul 2006, 09:47 (Ref:1647864) | #71 | ||
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How about when a car in the midfield fluffs his rolling start (wrong gear maybe) so when the front half of the grid accelerates away the cars behind the slow starter are stuck waiting for him/her to build up speed or eventually get to the startline by which time the front half of the pack is over the horizon.
I've only done rolling starts at Rockingham when the rule has been that once the green light is on then racing starts, which has seemed to work well (except for that time I was in the wrong gear) Andy |
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4 Jul 2006, 09:58 (Ref:1647877) | #72 | |||
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John Smith Clerk of the Course and MSA Steward Race Director for 360MRC |
4 Jul 2006, 10:50 (Ref:1647901) | #73 | |
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It is different becuase earlier you said:
"By the way, my instruction at drivers briefings for rolling starts is that everybody holds position until they cross the startline " So in this scenario, would the other drivers be expected to slowly creep behind the 'wrong gear car' until it passes the S/F line? My only rolling start experience is again Rockingham, where once the lights are out you can race -no need to wait - and it worked well. |
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4 Jul 2006, 11:21 (Ref:1647912) | #74 | |||
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4 Jul 2006, 12:57 (Ref:1647990) | #75 | |||
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