WEC 2012 WEC Entries - Page 3

gustavobamba · 14 Oct 2011, 13:33 (Ref:2971105)

[QUOTE=LeMans.pt;2971076]2 car/team rule? What 2 car/team rule? There ain't such a thing...

Where did you saw that?[/QUOT

In Le Mans the same team cannot have 3 car´s, so one of the team had a different name.

Example:
Audi Sport Team Joest
Audi Sport Team Joest
Audi Sport North America

Peugeot Sport Total
Peugeot Sport Total
Team Peugeot Total

deggis · 14 Oct 2011, 14:07 (Ref:2971118)

Like I said, the WEC sporting regs are not available yet. If ILMC regs are an indication, then there won't be this rule (Spa this and last year, 3xPug with no differences in the name [Audi still used the "America" banner]).

This shouldn't really concern WEC anyway, unless 3-car teams actually become the norm which I don't believe is going to happen (except for Spa).

Don't forget that also AMR did this once (2009).

The Badger · 14 Oct 2011, 14:20 (Ref:2971123)

[QUOTE=gustavobamba;2971105]

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeMans.pt

2 car/team rule? What 2 car/team rule? There ain't such a thing...

Where did you saw that?[/QUOT

In Le Mans the same team cannot have 3 car´s, so one of the team had a different name.

Example:
Audi Sport Team Joest
Audi Sport Team Joest
Audi Sport North America

Peugeot Sport Total
Peugeot Sport Total
Team Peugeot Total

And this is blatent bull**** from Pug . While a team did exist called Audi Sport North America ..... what Pug has done is just smartass . I would split up the team and put them at opposing ends of the pitlane , if in fact they are differant , then it shouldnt be an issue , but we all know the truth . I think entries are getting too big for works teams to have 3 entries .

Strakka mentioned that a two car team is possible ..... said that ages ago and mentioned it again a few weeks ago too .

Victor_RO · 14 Oct 2011, 14:21 (Ref:2971125)

Quote:

Originally Posted by deggis

Don't forget that also AMR did this once (2009).

Not exactly, one car was "entered" under the AMR Eastern Europe banner... and it was a bit too close for comfort to getting the Czech flag on the podium (it was the 007 car that finished 4th and 2 laps off the Audi in 3rd).

Simmi · 14 Oct 2011, 14:25 (Ref:2971130)

[QUOTE=The Badger;2971123]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gustavobamba

And this is blatent bull**** from Pug . While a team did exist called Audi Sport North America ..... what Pug has done is just smartass . I would split up the team and put them at opposing ends of the pitlane , if in fact they are differant , then it shouldnt be an issue , but we all know the truth . I think entries are getting too big for works teams to have 3 entries .

You can't blame Pug for the stupid regulations. If they can keep a chief sponsor in their team name then obviously they will do. No difference at all with what Audi have done.

deggis · 14 Oct 2011, 14:31 (Ref:2971138)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Badger

And this is blatent bull**** from Pug . While a team did exist called Audi Sport North America ..... what Pug has done is just smartass . I would split up the team and put them at opposing ends of the pitlane , if in fact they are differant , then it shouldnt be an issue , but we all know the truth . I think entries are getting too big for works teams to have 3 entries .

Cut the crap. Audi is doing exactly the same thing.

3-car teams are nothing new historically and in ~1999 this rule didn't even exist. I'm in favor of removing this rule completely. There are other solutions what comes to available P1 slots such as taking them from GT-Am.

Acid09 · 14 Oct 2011, 14:35 (Ref:2971144)

Indeed, the rule is stupid, we all know very well that the ACO will never turn down factory P1 entries. Even if Peugeot and Audi wished to race 4 cars each they would...they provide the main show.

AGD · 14 Oct 2011, 14:43 (Ref:2971153)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acid09

Even if Peugeot and Audi wished to race 4 cars each they would...they provide the main show.

Wha?! I thought the DeltaWing was supposed to be the show!

Seriously, that thing taking up a garage spot is looking dumber by the day. We'll have at least one serious hybrid going for the overall win. What is the DW bringing to the table that is so shocking in terms of technology?

deggis · 14 Oct 2011, 14:43 (Ref:2971154)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Victor_RO

Not exactly, one car was "entered" under the AMR Eastern Europe banner... and it was a bit too close for comfort to getting the Czech flag on the podium (it was the 007 car that finished 4th and 2 laps off the Audi in 3rd).

But it was still run by AMR?

LeMans.pt · 14 Oct 2011, 14:57 (Ref:2971161)

Quote:

Originally Posted by gustavobamba

In Le Mans the same team cannot have 3 car´s, so one of the team had a different name.

Example:
Audi Sport Team Joest
Audi Sport Team Joest
Audi Sport North America

Peugeot Sport Total
Peugeot Sport Total
Team Peugeot Total

OK... see what you mean! Not in F1 terms, where any team has to field two cars. But, let's recognized it, that's hardly a "real" rule. It's pure cosmetics has everyone knows. Even Audi is now fully Joest. Audi Sport America is not runed by Champion Racing.

LeMans.pt · 14 Oct 2011, 15:03 (Ref:2971164)

Quote:

Originally Posted by AGD

Hmm, interesting. Is there some possibility that HPD is providing some factory support to Strakka ala what they provided to Highcroft last year? If so, why not continue with Highcroft? Less potential for Highcroft to support themselves eventually maybe? Highcroft needed too much money? They'd rather support a WEC program? They just have more faith in Strakka? Ok, that's a lot of questions!

Its seams that Strakka will have the same support Highcroft had... but i can't be 100% certain. It was all "paddock talk"...

Simmi · 14 Oct 2011, 15:08 (Ref:2971166)

I'm hopeful that this ambitious assault from Toyota over a short period of time will encourage the likes of Nissan to try something similar. No need to necessarily wait for 2014 if the marketing people want to go racing.

LeMans.pt · 14 Oct 2011, 15:12 (Ref:2971168)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Simmi

No need to necessarily wait for 2014 if the marketing people want to go racing.

That's exactly what a Nissan Europe source said during Silverstone at Radio Le Mans.

Simmi · 14 Oct 2011, 15:15 (Ref:2971172)

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeMans.pt

That's exactly what a Nissan Europe source said during Silverstone at Radio Le Mans.

Yeah that was what got me hoping they could pull a programme together. Like Hindy just tweeted, they are the only ones missing from the party in LMP1 next year as it stands.

The Badger · 14 Oct 2011, 17:17 (Ref:2971228)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acid09

Indeed, the rule is stupid, we all know very well that the ACO will never turn down factory P1 entries. Even if Peugeot and Audi wished to race 4 cars each they would...they provide the main show.

3 works Audi
3 works Pugs
2 works Toyota
1 semi works Pug
1 semi works Audi

ALMS Champions

Exactly how many P1 places do you expect ?

Look at Le Mans 1998 ..... wasnt that good enough .

Im ****ed off with diesels winning all the time . Ive been going to Le Mans long enough to remember when it was an open race and not a Pug and Audi prosession .

2 works and 1 privateer is plenty good .

LeMans.pt · 14 Oct 2011, 17:31 (Ref:2971235)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Badger

3 works Audi
3 works Pugs
2 works Toyota
1 semi works Pug
1 semi works Audi

Exactly how many P1 places do you expect ?

Don't forget Strakka... will it be a semi works Honda or a private Honda, the truth is that they will score points for HPD. If (a very big if) they win the 2012 WEC Championship, the Manufacturer World Title will go to HPD/Honda.

The Badger · 14 Oct 2011, 17:31 (Ref:2971236)

Take into consideration

ALMS champions and 2nd placed car . P1 and GT ..... 4 cars invited .
LMS champions and 2nd placed car . P1 , P2 , GTpro & Am . 8 cars invited .
ILMC champions and 2nd placed cars . P1 , P2 , GTpro & Am . 8 cars invited .
Le Mans winners and 2nd place . P1 , P2 , GTpro and Am . 8 cars invited .
PLM class winners . P1 , P2 , GTpro & Am . 4 cars invited .

thats 32 auto invitations for 55 places as I wont count the Delta wing rubbish .

That leaves 23 invites for others . Time to start limiting works entries for fairness , if for no other reason . I also feel that manufacturers should be made supply a privateer . By limiting the works effort , they would have to supply a privateer . 2 works Pugs and 1 private Pug is enough for anyone .

Michelin greenX challange not sure .

Not many places left eh !!!

LeMans.pt · 14 Oct 2011, 17:35 (Ref:2971237)

Making it even more confusing... can a semi workd team be consider a privateer team, and fight for the best privateer Cup?

LeMans.pt · 14 Oct 2011, 17:38 (Ref:2971241)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Badger

That leaves 23 invites for others

And WEC full season entries are auto invited? I believe they will...

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Badger

Time to start limiting works entries for fairness , if for no other reason .

Not many places left eh !!!

Agree... but how?

The Badger · 14 Oct 2011, 17:49 (Ref:2971246)

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeMans.pt

And WEC full season entries are auto invited? I believe they will...

Agree... but how?

Limit the factory team to 2 entries , and let them supply a privateer . That gives 3 entries .

deggis · 14 Oct 2011, 18:04 (Ref:2971249)

In theory 32 auto invites but in practice many of those are duplicates and some of them will be be taken (at least the Dyson one).

I feel like GT Am is wasting entries because there has to be certain amount of cars to call it a class... If it was a cup inside unified GT class it would, in my opinion, save few spots because the entries could be then split 1/3 between the three classes. Plus I just don't see the point inviting "rich amateurs" in an era with plenty of pro entries (includes 3rd cars).

The Badger · 14 Oct 2011, 18:41 (Ref:2971265)

The rich amateur was always in sportscar racing , please dont turn it into an elitist sport like your suggesting either .

Simmi · 14 Oct 2011, 18:53 (Ref:2971272)

I agree that the 2+1 privateer team is the way to go in the future. But I think it would be a shame to jump the gun now and start limiting entries during a period of growth.

It does pose questions about whether HPD's are works entries etc.
Like many others I'd prefer to see GT-Am trimmed but I recognise it is unhealthy to do that. All in all it is a nice problem to have. But as others have said what it does do is demand that the 56th entry is credible.

AGD · 14 Oct 2011, 18:56 (Ref:2971274)

Is it time to reconsider bringing back Prequalifying? I feel that some very good teams are going to be left on the sideline this year particularly in LMP2 and GTE-Pro.

deggis · 14 Oct 2011, 19:01 (Ref:2971277)

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Badger

The rich amateur was always in sportscar racing , please dont turn it into an elitist sport like your suggesting either .

I wasn't eliminating rich amateurs but a class specifically made for them. It makes no sense when there are better teams and better entries available (right now this concerns only Le Mans of course). Reality probably is that these rich amateurs will pop up like mushrooms whenever they're needed again (so to say). Good pro* teams do not.

* I don't mean only manufacturers

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