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Old 9 Jan 2010, 13:54 (Ref:2610487)   #31
William Dale Jr
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William Dale Jr should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Good stuff, KA and Tim!

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Originally Posted by Tim Wilkinson View Post
Maybe there's more info on the video? I have it, but don't have a VHS player any more!
No, sadly not. The first two rounds were only briefly shown compared to the other rounds. There wasn't even a grid shot at all for the Oulton round, so that might stay a mystery.

KA's right, the TWR evolution package for the VL kept being pushed back due to homologation delays. Originally scheduled for April 1 homologation, delays in the production of the fibreglass body components prevented completion of the 500 necessary cars (750 eventually produced in total, I believe) until August. IIRC, the TWR evolution package was finally homologated on September 1.

Also, I didn't realise that Guy Edwards didn't do the whole season. I assume it was because his car wasn't ready yet?
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Old 9 Jan 2010, 13:59 (Ref:2610491)   #32
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PositionNumberDriverTeam/SponsorClassCarTime/Laps
4 #5 Tim Harvey Drury / Sumo Giants A Ford Sierra RS500 Cosworth 32m52.79s
Going back to the question of Tim Harvey's sponsors, note the presence of 'Sumo Giants' as a sponsor rather than 'Istel' at this early-season race.

I won't swear to this, but I've got a very vague memory that the story behind it was that Sumo Giants might have been a band- one of Tim's mates or someone connected to the TDR team being either a member of the band or their manager, and got their name on the car for a bit of publicity...
Anyone know any more- think there was a pic of the car in Autosport with a caption telling the story?

Last edited by KA; 9 Jan 2010 at 14:05.
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Old 9 Jan 2010, 14:20 (Ref:2610503)   #33
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Just to add a bit of confusion to the issue though, Lawrence Bristow had Istel sponsorship on his prodsaloon Cosworth in '87- (Was this a continuation of the Istel backed team that had run Istel Rovers for Harvey in Prodsaloons in '86- I think Tim did some prodsaloons alongside his BTCC Rover campaign in '87?)
Tim Harvey had Istel backing on his Prodsaloon Cosworth in '87, too.
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Old 9 Jan 2010, 15:15 (Ref:2610519)   #34
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Autosport news and rumours for '88 -

January

7th - Hodgetts rumoured to run with a Supra in '88. Robb Gravett linked to a drive in a second Supra. Dennis Leech's Rover is up for sale (and stays that way for several months). Car was built from new parts for '87, ARE shell, TWR suspension and brakes. £19500.

14th - BBC announces planned full coverage of the BTCC for '88.

21st - North Essex Motorsport (Julian May) have their RS1600i up for sale. £7000. [this car is still around somewhere, in original beige livery]

28th - A Uniroyal (Prodsaloon) Honda Prelude is up for sale by Des Winks. Is this the Martin Wray car that appears later in the year? Another RS1600i is available, for £8k. No name, but a Clacton (Essex) dialling code. CHMS have a Corolla available for sale or hire too, "last one left".

February -

4th - Pirelli announce that Andy Rouse, Graham Goode, and others, will run on their tyres in '88. Rouse says he's "completely baffled" by the announcement, but does end up on Pirellis, as do the Prodrive BMWs. Soper's Eggenberger entry continues on the tyres also.
Rouse tests his '88-spec RS500 at Silverstone, painted in bright yellow, and at least 3 cars are planned to be run by ARE in the BTCC.
Paul Harmer has his Astra GTE for sale (£4,850). Built in '85 to GrpN spec (and road registered in '87), and still pretty standard. [Paul has posted on another forum about some of his experiences in BTCC with this car]

11th - Terry Drury have the Hales / Wiffen class-winning RST from '87 for sale (£15k). [Another Essex-based BTCC team!]

18th - Dave Loudon (Metro Turbo champion) gives up on plans to run an RS500, due to lack of sponsorship, and looks to have a CHMS-prepped Corolla instead. Meanwhile, the Hodgetts / Supra challenge is still not confirmed....
Brian Chatfield is selling his ex-TWR Bastos Rover. [Is this the one that Jeff Allam bought / had for sale recently?]

25th - Mike Smith and Frank Sytner tested a Prodrive Bastos M3 rally car at Thruxton.
Eggenberger say that they expect their RS500s to be pushing 520bhp this season.
Karl Jones announces an RS500 campaign with backing from Duckhams, run by Asquith. Ford are offering a £5000 bonus per round for outright victory!
Also, features a comparison of GrpA and Prodsaloon RSTs (the Asquith pair).

I haven't seen anything about Harvey & Sumo Giant, but will post it when I do.
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Old 9 Jan 2010, 16:22 (Ref:2610543)   #35
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Autosport news and rumours for '88 -

Brian Chatfield is selling his ex-TWR Bastos Rover. [Is this the one that Jeff Allam bought / had for sale recently?]
I think the Jeff Allam car is the one that was kept as part of Walkinshaw's collection, and sold off when TWR went into liquidation a few years back?
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Old 9 Jan 2010, 16:52 (Ref:2610558)   #36
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I'm trying to think who his team-mate was in the production Rover- I'm sure was definitely a 2-car team, though plans were messed up when Tim broke his ankles in an FF shunt. Possibly Bristow, but I'm sure a couple of other drivers appeared.
Tim Goss, with occasional appearances from Chris Chiles (from Istel). Tim Harvey came back for the Wilhire, and shared with Goss, Chiles, and David Sears.
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Old 9 Jan 2010, 18:10 (Ref:2610602)   #37
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March -

3rd - ADR have Mike O'Brien's '87 BTCC Commodore VK for sale or hire "due to late change of plans" [See March 17th, also. As an aside, a Commodore appeared in Thundersaloons a few years later that was ex O'Brien, but had only been tested for BTCC, and not raced. Anyone have any info on this?]
Dave Carvell's Rover from '87 is for sale, too - enquiries to Tim Harvey, no less!
More rumours about the MIL Motorsport Supras, with Hodgetts and John Llewellyn ('87 Saab Turbo winner) most likely to drive, Gravett still linked, and Rad Dougall had been testing with the team at Oulton.

10th - BMW announces two-car team for BTCC - Sytner and Mike Smith to drive M3s for Prodrive run "BMW Finance Racing with Mobil 1". Sytner to test with Marc Duez at Vallelunga this week.
Steve Soper to run a limited (6 rounds) BTCC programme in Eggenberger RS500, starting at r2 at Oulton Park, on Pirelli rubber and run from the Eggenberger base in Switzerland. [which caused problems for Oulton, as the car couldn't get to England due to ferry strikes]
Jerry Mahony confirms full BTCC, and UK ETC rounds, programme in RS500 with Arquati and Evans Halshaw backing. He'll carry an in-car camera for the BTCC.
ADR have bought an ex-Brock Commodore VL, and are selling the ex-Grice VK [see March 3rd]
A pair of Maserati Biturbos are rumoured.

17th - An Escort Turbo is for sale, from what I think is a Harlow / Bishops Stortford number [another Essex car, what a surprise!] No photo or other info.
A nice picture of Paul Radisich with an incredibly dodgy 'tache.
An ex-Rouse Sierra has ended up in Sweden with Ulf Granberg and Christer Simonsen.
GGR test thier RS500 at Mallory Park. Listerine backing will continue, Goode will build his own engines, and run his car and a planned second car for Mike Newman on Pirellis. Goode and Newman to pair up for the TT.

24th - Season preview (nothing new except for Win Percy's Nissan coming over later in the season)
Dave Wallis ('87 Monroe runner-up) to appear in the ex-Hales RST
Alan Minshaw to be out in an M3, and to sponsor prodsaloon graduate James Kaye in a Golf. [Kaye ran in Novas, previously, iirc]
MIL finally announce Hodgetts in a shell-backed Supra Turbo. 2nd car rumoured to be for Llewellyn, and a possible 3rd later on.
Richard Belcher swaps from his planned Escort RS1600i to a CHMS-run Corolla GT as a result of new backing from AJG Transport. Corolla is ex-Minshaw, and is to be updated to '88 spec. [Belcher lost this drive after round 1, with Mark Hales in the car for round 2]
Robb Gravett has tested the MIL Supra, and is linked to a TOMs GB Supra to back up their Corolla effort (Dowsett). Gravett was also linked to an ARE Kaliber drive which instead goes to Guy Edwards, starting at round 3, with both Edwards and Rouse using Pirellis [see February 4th]. Edwards didn't seem to have been looking for a drive, instead concentrating on his sponsorship finding business.

31st - News added to Silverstone results post (Absence of Karl Jones and Geoff Kimber-Smith, progress of ADRs Holden VL SS)
Ex-CHMS & Paul Taft RS1600i for sale (previously Brooklyn Motorsport car), £8,500. Aylesbury dialling code. [This was the "69" Hodgetts car, then Taft in '86, bought by AJG, and run at end of '87 for Belcher and then Mark Goddard - I suppose Gaunt was selling the car to pay for the Corolla effort - loads of info here - http://www.rsiontour.net/index.php?view=brooklyn]

Last edited by Tim Wilkinson; 9 Jan 2010 at 18:38. Reason: Added RS1600i info
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Old 9 Jan 2010, 19:18 (Ref:2610641)   #38
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March -

3rd - ADR have Mike O'Brien's '87 BTCC Commodore VK for sale or hire "due to late change of plans" [See March 17th, also. As an aside, a Commodore appeared in Thundersaloons a few years later that was ex O'Brien, but had only been tested for BTCC, and not raced. Anyone have any info on this?]
Dave Carvell's Rover from '87 is for sale, too - enquiries to Tim Harvey, no less!
More rumours about the MIL Motorsport Supras, with Hodgetts and John Llewellyn ('87 Saab Turbo winner) most likely to drive, Gravett still linked, and Rad Dougall had been testing with the team at Oulton.
Got a vague memory that Dougall's name continued to be linked with the project for some time... Llewellyn would end up driving for MIL, but in a Class D Corolla

10th - BMW announces two-car team for BTCC - Sytner and Mike Smith to drive M3s for Prodrive run "BMW Finance Racing with Mobil 1". Sytner to test with Marc Duez at Vallelunga this week.
Steve Soper to run a limited (6 rounds) BTCC programme in Eggenberger RS500, starting at r2 at Oulton Park, on Pirelli rubber and run from the Eggenberger base in Switzerland. [which caused problems for Oulton, as the car couldn't get to England due to ferry strikes]
Jerry Mahony confirms full BTCC, and UK ETC rounds, programme in RS500 with Arquati and Evans Halshaw backing. He'll carry an in-car camera for the BTCC.
ADR have bought an ex-Brock Commodore VL, and are selling the ex-Grice VK [see March 3rd]
A pair of Maserati Biturbos are rumoured.

17th - An Escort Turbo is for sale, from what I think is a Harlow / Bishops Stortford number [another Essex car, what a surprise!] No photo or other info.
A nice picture of Paul Radisich with an incredibly dodgy 'tache.
An ex-Rouse Sierra has ended up in Sweden with Ulf Granberg and Christer Simonsen. Have a feeling this ended up being a new car built from a Rouse 'kit' . Think it debuted at the TT, then went to Bathurst (fairly distinctive silver car)
GGR test thier RS500 at Mallory Park. Listerine backing will continue, Goode will build his own engines, and run his car and a planned second car for Mike Newman on Pirellis. Goode and Newman to pair up for the TT.

24th - Season preview (nothing new except for Win Percy's Nissan coming over later in the season)
Dave Wallis ('87 Monroe runner-up) to appear in the ex-Hales RST
Alan Minshaw to be out in an M3, and to sponsor prodsaloon graduate James Kaye in a Golf. [Kaye ran in Novas, previously, iirc]
MIL finally announce Hodgetts in a shell-backed Supra Turbo. 2nd car rumoured to be for Llewellyn, and a possible 3rd later on.
Some early-season testing pics were published in Motoring News in Feb, showing a white Supra testing at Donington with Hodgetts and Alex Moss, the Supra carrying sponsorship from 'Brown Group International'. Obviously before the Shell deal was done or announced
Richard Belcher swaps from his planned Escort RS1600i to a CHMS-run Corolla GT as a result of new backing from AJG Transport. Corolla is ex-Minshaw, and is to be updated to '88 spec. [Belcher lost this drive after round 1, with Mark Hales in the car for round 2]
Robb Gravett has tested the MIL Supra, and is linked to a TOMs GB Supra to back up their Corolla effort (Dowsett). Gravett was also linked to an ARE Kaliber drive which instead goes to Guy Edwards, starting at round 3, with both Edwards and Rouse using Pirellis [see February 4th]. Edwards didn't seem to have been looking for a drive, instead concentrating on his sponsorship finding business.

31st - News added to Silverstone results post (Absence of Karl Jones and Geoff Kimber-Smith, progress of ADRs Holden VL SS)
Ex-CHMS & Paul Taft RS1600i for sale (previously Brooklyn Motorsport car), £8,500. Aylesbury dialling code. [This was the "69" Hodgetts car, then Taft in '86, bought by AJG, and run at end of '87 for Belcher and then Mark Goddard - I suppose Gaunt was selling the car to pay for the Corolla effort - loads of info here - http://www.rsiontour.net/index.php?view=brooklyn]
Gaunt obviously had trouble selling the RS1600i, as by July, Goddard was back out in it, appearing at the two Brands rounds.
Graham who now owns the car occasionally posts on here as 'RacingRSi'.
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Old 10 Jan 2010, 00:57 (Ref:2610777)   #39
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Gaunt obviously had trouble selling the RS1600i, as by July, Goddard was back out in it, appearing at the two Brands rounds.
Graham who now owns the car occasionally posts on here as 'RacingRSi'.
..the fact the Group A homologation of the car was to expire at the end of the year probably provided a minor hazard with the then owner.

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Old 10 Jan 2010, 01:33 (Ref:2610786)   #40
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Mike O'Brien was planning to debut an updated ex-Brock VL-SS Commodore at round 2.
Does this mean that O'Brien raced his/Alan Docking's ex-Grice '87 BTCC car at the Silverstone opener?

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Old 10 Jan 2010, 02:18 (Ref:2610804)   #41
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Class D

Still can't swear I've got the MIL & CHMS Corollas 100% right....

60 CHMS Toyota Corolla GT: Mark Hales/Patrick Watts
61/69 MIL Motorsport Corolla: Kevin Eaton/Alex Moss/John Llewellyn
61 CHMS Corolla: Dave Loudoun/Nick Whale/Mark Goddard/Richard Belcher
63 Tony Crudgington Corolla: Tony Crudgington/Alistair Davidson
70 TOM'S GB Corolla (fwd) : Phil Dowsett/Tiff Needell
74 North Essex M'sport Ford Escort RS1600i- Vic Lee/Jeremy Rossiter/Barbara Cowell
75 AJG Transport RS1600i- Mark Goddard
77 AGK Motorsport Corolla: Geoff Kimber-Smith/Barbara Cowell
Interesting if Chris Hodgetts still got interests in the small class fry by 1988, as he was promoted to the class A Supra. His 1986 champion car was wacked preddy good during Spa 24h 1987.

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Old 10 Jan 2010, 04:28 (Ref:2610822)   #42
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Does this mean that O'Brien raced his/Alan Docking's ex-Grice '87 BTCC car at the Silverstone opener?

Jesper
It was definitely a VL that O'Brien used in round 1, so it was more than likely the ex-Brock VL. Did we ever come to a conclusion on the "Commodores in Europe" thread about where that car had come from?

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Steve Soper to run a limited (6 rounds) BTCC programme in Eggenberger RS500, starting at r2 at Oulton Park, on Pirelli rubber and run from the Eggenberger base in Switzerland. [which caused problems for Oulton, as the car couldn't get to England due to ferry strikes]
Including the Oulton round that they missed, I only count 5 rounds that the Eggenberger team were scheduled to appear at. Were they also supposed to do the cancelled Birmingham round?
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Old 10 Jan 2010, 10:19 (Ref:2610887)   #43
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Interesting if Chris Hodgetts still got interests in the small class fry by 1988, as he was promoted to the class A Supra. His 1986 champion car was wacked preddy good during Spa 24h 1987.

Jesper
I think it was his bread and butter. He had a lot of knowledge of the cars, and people willing to pay him to run them (or hire them from him).

Interestingly (?!!?!) MIL seems to have been run by Alex Moss - I suppose the teams were run pretty closely?
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Old 10 Jan 2010, 10:48 (Ref:2610903)   #44
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It was definitely a VL that O'Brien used in round 1, so it was more than likely the ex-Brock VL. Did we ever come to a conclusion on the "Commodores in Europe" thread about where that car had come from?
I don't think we ever did

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Including the Oulton round that they missed, I only count 5 rounds that the Eggenberger team were scheduled to appear at. Were they also supposed to do the cancelled Birmingham round?
Yes, Eggenberger were at Birmingham. Motoring News did print the qualifying times in their report of the abandoned race- Soper was on pole from Rouse, Guy Edwards, Lawrence Bristow and Walkinshaw's Commodore
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Old 10 Jan 2010, 11:01 (Ref:2610913)   #45
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I think it was his bread and butter. He had a lot of knowledge of the cars, and people willing to pay him to run them (or hire them from him).

Interestingly (?!!?!) MIL seems to have been run by Alex Moss - I suppose the teams were run pretty closely?
My thought too, but how did it end? Hodgetts returned to his former employer Brooklyn Ford for a Sierra ride late 1988. Chris Hodgetts must have been disapointed by the performance of the Supra as it seems to have moved him up just a few places on the grid from his former Corollas.

Early 1988 reports suggest that as many as three cars were supposed to be run by MIL. Two cars were as many as they would ever run by my knowledge.

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