RIP Baby Bertha - for now

[David Stallard]

Warning: if you are a real fan of Baby Bertha and are of a nervous disposition I suggest you look away now.

Mr Steven's get's past Mr Ronchetti in the Lotus



Hear a missed gear from somewhere and the next thing is Mr Ward has caught the the grass in Bertha and is spinning towards the Foggy Esses (re named a couple days before - sorry missed the new name) and the next thing. . .



I'm shouting 'noooooooo' by this point but in true photographer style I fight through the tears. . .



By now Pete Stevens in the Carlton has gone leaving the carnage behind him



Trust me - full sized this is NOT the face of a happy man



Joe Ward get's out to take a look - I am weeping like a girl by now. . .



I managed to speak with Joe on Sunday morning and it seems that he found a handful of neutrals (which is what I heard) had to really stamp on the brakes, touched the grass and that was it - 3 seconds later and it was all over.

He did however confirm that it looks a lot worse than it really is (on first inspection) and luckily he has the original molds for the bonnet etc and that the motor etc is fine, although he was a little miffed that the new radiator he had fitted for this season is destroyed.

For me - at least he was okay and BB can and will be back next season.

Full set of shot's HERE from photo # 0930

.DAVID.

[Peter Mallett]

Hopefully BB will be back to health soon. It is a racing car after all, so good to see Joe peddling it with verve. Mechanical breakages are a part of the sport. Not so those sausage kerbs IMO, which probably did as much damage to both cars as the initial impact!

[David Stallard]

Have to agree with you, it was probably the best I had heard BB sounding for a while, not a pop or missfire anywhere as for the curbs - seems that most of the damage done to various cars over the weekend was helped along by it.

Blue Mustang was funny - go over it once and through the gravel you 'know it's there' lap or 2 later you do it again, okay maybe it got forgotten but after the forth time . . . .

"when all else fails - throw stones at them"


.DAVID.

[JimW]

Originally Posted by David Stallard

. . .

Blue Mustang was funny - go over it once and through the gravel you 'know it's there' lap or 2 later you do it again, okay maybe it got forgotten but after the forth time . . . .

"when all else fails - throw stones at them"


.DAVID.

But that's the sort of driving which needs an immediate black flag, exclusion from the meeting and a fine of considerable size. He is spoiling other people's race, delaying the programme and probably causing pebble damage to windscreens.

It's not the BTCC, it's not big and it's not clever. If he can't drive competently, he ought not to be there.

Jim

[Al Weyman]

Originally Posted by JimW

But that's the sort of driving which needs an immediate black flag, exclusion from the meeting and a fine of considerable size. He is spoiling other people's race, delaying the programme and probably causing pebble damage to windscreens.

It's not the BTCC, it's not big and it's not clever. If he can't drive competently, he ought not to be there.

Jim

I think I was just out of shot as we headed to the Chicane together I braked in a straight line and got it round he tried but didn't, he didn't do it deliberately he just locked up its not fair to slag him off for trying his hardest they are not the easiest things to pull up from high speed these yank tanks and he was driving OK and I wouldnt hesitate to race with him again, no BTCC tactics here AT ALL and you know me if there was I would have said so!!!. I will be posting video up for tomorrow and you can see the incident unfold and judge for yourself.

Shame about Bullet and Bertha as it was a cracker of a race up till then I must say I was surprised to read on FaceBook he uses a Muncie 4 speed in Bertha same as I do and whereas they are tough they can play up especially if you chuck it through the gears too hard. Catch Frank Gardeners video at Oulton in the Camaro and he will tell how it is with these things. I admire the owner for using the Muncie if its for originality though but if not there are far better boxes out there if rules are free, I have to use them! Thank God Pete's lovely Carlton didnt cop it as well as that would have been three of my favourite saloons of all time out in seconds!

[Peter Mallett]

Once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, third time is enemy action! If this was done four times then clearly the driver has no idea of the capability of either his driving or the brakes on his car. Either way under those circs I'm surprised he wasn't black flagged.

Originally Posted by JimW

But that's the sort of driving which needs an immediate black flag, exclusion from the meeting and a fine of considerable size. He is spoiling other people's race, delaying the programme and probably causing pebble damage to windscreens.

It's not the BTCC, it's not big and it's not clever. If he can't drive competently, he ought not to be there.

Jim

[Al Weyman]

I don't recollect him going through 4 times if he did what can I say, but he definitely did twice as I see that myself as we were in close proximity for a while. I tll you who else when through there as well and you will see that on the video, Jackie Cochran as he did it while trying to overtake me so maybe some oil down there as he has experience!

[JimW]

It was the four times which triggered my comment. If not, then my observations are not deserved.

Jim

[Al Weyman]

No probs Jim, I just followed him for a few laps till I caught him up and he seems a sensible guy on the track. BTW I think Berthas damage will be a reasonably easy repair as I read he has all the moulds and it looked like the fibreglass only, not sure. Worse off was the guy who shunted the rear of the Mk 2 Jag that looked very bad and steel of course.

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

they are not the easiest things to pull up from high speed these yank tanks

So drive to the brakes your car has or drive something else!

Sorry but I am firmly in the camp that consistent corner cutting should be punished, regardless of whether it be due to lack of brakes or just trying to gain an advantage. I am not aiming this comment at any particular incident as was not at the event above!

Anyway, we digress. Sorry to see the damage to BB, but am sure Joe & Mass will have her sorted without too much trouble. From memory the front end is all one piece? Always a risk racing a unique and historic car, so full marks to Joe for continuing to exercise BB and keep the GM memories alive.

[JimW]

Having watched BB race since the first outing, I suspect that it may well share some of the characteristics of "my Grandfather's hammer". Good to hear that the damage this time may not be too extensive.

Jim

[grantp]

Originally Posted by JimW

Having watched BB race since the first outing, I suspect that it may well share some of the characteristics of "my Grandfather's hammer". Good to hear that the damage this time may not be too extensive.

Jim

If the bodywork moulds are original that's good enough isn't it?

The rest is just comsumable items.

[Al Weyman]

Well the engine is no longer original, it now sports a Small Block Chevy. Mike reserve judgment until you see my video.

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

Well the engine is no longer original, it now sports a Small Block Chevy. Mike reserve judgment until you see my video.

No problem Al, I was clear to say that am not in a position to comment on that race....

BTW as do not know one end of a V8 from another- What is the difference between a 5l Repco Holden and a Chevy, or are they not related?

[Al Weyman]

The Holden engine was GM Australia's own unit and fitted to all the early Commadores including the Brock car that raced with us in Modprods, it wasnt till later they went over to the Chevy unit. They are a totally different family of engines.

[Robyn Slater]

I crossed those kerb twice at our hscc meeting in march (got the pics to prove it),there is certainly no advantage if it happens. I was overdriving having found more power over the winter break.
And YES i was black flagged and had an appointment with CoC.

No Excuses.

[Mike Bell]

Originally Posted by Robyn Slater

I crossed those kerb twice at our hscc meeting in march. And YES i was black flagged and had an appointment with CoC.

No Excuses.

[Moosehead]

Must admit I had to cut that corner once as well! However, that was because the Porsche that was cruising along the main straight suddenly picked up as I was alongside it, I knew I didn't want to go over the kerbs so aimed to the left and went straight through the gravel. Think the Porsche had a serious cutting out problem as it suddenly slowed on the apex of the Old Hairpin, managed to avoid him again and got by.

[Moby]

The kerbs were not there when the corner was built.

They are a legacy of the Touring Cars and their consistent lack of ability to keep to the track. They were put in to stop them continually going half across the corner and showering gravel all over the track.

They have caused a lot of damage though to other more fragile cars that the owners care about. Which is a shame. Best course is to just keep off of them.

[grantp]

Originally Posted by Moby

The kerbs were not there when the corner was built.

They are a legacy of the Touring Cars and their consistent lack of ability to keep to the track. They were put in to stop them continually going half across the corner and showering gravel all over the track.

They have caused a lot of damage though to other more fragile cars that the owners care about. Which is a shame. Best course is to just keep off of them.

Indeed they did seem to be the worst culprits but I have shots of the Revived meeting with many an historic cutting the corner (mostly through slight misjudgements or over enthusiasm by the looks of it) and showering the track with gravel. Hooligans the lot of them!

I can't think of anything good to say about the kerbs as they are but neither can I imagine anything to replace them effectively. At least not without trashing some other aspect of the turn (now called "Roberts" ?)

[Robyn Slater]

Perhaps a concrete wall with horizontal metal spikes would concentrate the mind.

[Moby]

Yeah, we did try to sneak that one through, but the FiA wasn't too keen!!

[Al Weyman]

Looking at my incar that I have linked on the V8's post I think he was locking up the rear wheels.

[Clive Brown]

Originally Posted by Al Weyman

I must say I was surprised to read on FaceBook he uses a Muncie 4 speed in Bertha same as I do and whereas they are tough they can play up especially if you chuck it through the gears too hard. Catch Frank Gardeners video at Oulton in the Camaro and he will tell how it is with these things.

But Al, you've got to remember that Frank's second generation Z28 was a Group 2 car, and thus could only have the same number of ratios including reverse as the homologated car, unless a box with more speeds was specifically homologated for the car. Hence the Muncie Rockcrusher, because it was homologated as part of the original car....

[Al Weyman]

There is nothing fundamentally wrong with the Muncie its tough but don't like fast shifting too much or gobs out the syncho slipper plates as i found out but in the unlimited Special Saloons I am sure there would be far better boxes to use. I want to retain some sort of originality in my older car as someone one day may come and make me an offer for it I cannot refuse so it has to be a Muncie or a T10 and I can live with that.