Argentine Touring Car Series 2022

[FIRE]

Rio Hondo race was great.

[TuteZaek]

Originally Posted by FIRE

Rio Hondo race was great.

Kinda, actually was similar to previos races, but the names coming from the back and the atention they got gave some bling to It, afterall Rossi and Canapino fighting sounds better than Todino and Benvenutti figiting, and they advanced the same as ever.

[uesugi kenshin]

How is it that the JP Chevrolet's are so much faster than all the other cars?

[TuteZaek]

Originally Posted by uesugi kenshin

How is it that the JP Chevrolet's are so much faster than all the other cars?

If i had to guess, they are using Canapino's car as a base, and that build has something no other Chevy has.
Last year JP's cars were iffy, and Canapa's was a beast no slower than Wener's Ford, but he (Canapino) tried to manage the championship without gaining weight, the bad tire choice at Toay cost him the championship.

What that Chevy (and now Mangoni's) does different, who knows, but its the car to beat now, Alberto Canapino did wonders with that thing.

That said, don't be surprised if every "super TC" (JP's Máquin Part's* and Rossi's Camry) start deploying the sandbags at Rafaela

*Torino seems the stronger package, since both MP and Renault's are really solid and would be dominating if not for JP's Chevrolets

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by TuteZaek

Kinda, actually was similar to previos races, but the names coming from the back and the atention they got gave some bling to It, afterall Rossi and Canapino fighting sounds better than Todino and Benvenutti figiting, and they advanced the same as ever.

True

Although bigger names get often more screen time.

[uesugi kenshin]

What will be the future for the TC2000Series, it's cars are all rather old now and TC2000 cars can't really be passed down, will there be new cars or new regulations?

[TuteZaek]

The future of the main series Is still unknown, so for TC2000series i would not expect anything till the big one puts its feet on firm ground.

As for the cars, the chasis aren't that different from the main ones, changes are mostly on the engine.
And then, the Duratecs could be maintained and rebuilt forever since they are Berta, the basic block is used for the TR Series and/or Jr, and their reliability and parity reccord is amazing, and it's not a bad engine per se, even if ITS old.

Engine problems for the main series came with the imported engines, the series with national sourced engines (And Berta did most of them) never had problem till the current "engine crisis" on TC, that came after the pandemic while having 3 expanding series, using 150+ engines, the scale there Is stupid.

[NaBUru38]

To be honest, there's actually hundreds of well-funded drivers in Argentina.


Predicting anything in Argentina is futile.

[TuteZaek]

On another note, the Máquin Parts team, one of the current top TC teams, that fields 4 Torinos for Gini, Urcera, Todino and Agrelo, anounced the build of a Toyota Camry for 2023, with in house engines, as they always do. No words on the driver yet.

Well, Actually 3 Torinos and a temporal Dodge, after Urcera's crash with Agrelo totaled his chasis (and engine, the block cracked).
A nrew Torino is being built for Urcera, with the chasis bought by thetTeam.
The Camry could be built using the "replacement" chasis after the ACTC deemed the crashed one as totalled*

The team also has a Ford chasis, that last year won some races, but remains unused since Josito's departure from the team.

*There Is some kind of insurance for this kind of cases, were using a crashed chasis could be unsafe.

[TuteZaek]

This weekend the TC runs on Rafaela, and along the usual debate of using the full oval* (only used 4 times in the 60s) or the chicanes came a lot of new ones, from the Camry's performance, the ACTC policing the radio coms and oficially giving free reign to the TV to use them...

AND finally, the TC2000 AND, especifically Sciabattari (TC2000 resident Horner style ****-stirrer) charging, for some reason, against the CDA (ACA's sport branch) and the ACTC for causing TC2000's problems...and Carburando using this for making noise against the ACTC

A pretty normal week.

*Rafaela's oval length Is massive, arround 4.6 km, against, for example, Indy's 4 km

[NaBUru38]

A Twitter user mocked that Canapino dominating gets praise, and any other driver dominating gets criticism towards tihe ACTC.


Another user simply replied: "by crying he unloads weight"

[TuteZaek]

Never got the weight penalty criticism, its used everywhere, but the fans and, worse, the drivers ( the ones dominating) treat the issue as an "Argentina only thing" and the worst thing ever, while talking about how other series, using weight handicaps, are better for whatever...

We are a bunch of whinners.

[NaBUru38]

Some international championships use model-based balance of performance (like GT3 and TCR). This penalizes bad drivers in good cars, and helps good drivers in bad cars.


Driver-based balance of performance avoids that situation. If X driver has a good Ford Falcon and Y driver has a bad one, the latter doesn't get penalized.

[TuteZaek]

TN and TC have both, in the case of the TN, every car model has an homologation ruleset (thats why, for example, Santero's Corolla sucks this year, being heavier, but Merlo's doesn't, being an older gen car with different homologation)
That and succes ballast is also applied, since forever

The TC was similar, balancing the brands acording the results/performance, but after complains from everyone, they freezedd the ruleset for the 4 classic brands, and nobody can complain.
Then Toyota happened.

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

Some international championships use model-based balance of performance (like GT3 and TCR). This penalizes bad drivers in good cars, and helps good drivers in bad cars.


Driver-based balance of performance avoids that situation. If X driver has a good Ford Falcon and Y driver has a bad one, the latter doesn't get penalized.

GT3 and TCR cars are from the same builder. In (theory at least) performance is the same so model based BoP makes sense.
TC has different chassis and engine builders with different performance.

In my opinion weight penalties are a unwanted necessary.


About Rafaela. I am not a fan of the track.

[uesugi kenshin]

Argentina is the home of the touring car but seems to have little interest in sportscars, why would this be?

[NaBUru38]

Most Argentinian "fierreros" only care about national championships and Argentinian drivers in F1.


There has been very few GT championships around here for decades, much less Le Mans prototypes.

[NaBUru38]

In Top Race, Baltaser Leguizamón was excluded from his Neuquén victory by the ACA CDA due to rollcage anchor changes. His father claims that the changes were done by Top Race mechanics rather than his team, and withdrew from the championship.


Top Race boss Alejandro Levy denies any wrongdoing and encouraged the team to return to the championship.


https://carburando.com/notas/caso-le...evy-y-pianetto

[NaBUru38]

Top Race - Buenos Aires results:

* 1. Josito di Palma (Fiat)
* 2. Jorge barrio (Chevrolet)
* 3. Gastón Rossi (Mercedes-benz)
* 4. Diego Azar (Lexus)
* 5. Lucas Guerra (Ford)

Standings after Buenos Aires

* 1. Diego Azar (Lexus), 131 pts
* 2. Marcelo Ciarrocchi (Ford), 127
* 3. Facundo Aldrighetti (Lexus), 122
* 4. Josito di Palma (Fiat), 109
* 5. Lucas Guerra (Ford), 95
* 6. Ian Reutemann (Lexus), 93

[TuteZaek]

The TRV6 races were a shitshow, they are killing the (imho, most useless) series with the amateur bullshit they're doing, i fear for the TC2000 (as i did for the last 5 years tbh)

The Leguizamon issues doesn't inspire conf?*dence either, weird things after a week with the Levys & co. pointing fingers to everyone but them.

[NaBUru38]

Also there's rumours of the TC adopting Mustang, Camaro and Challenger bodykits for 2024.

[hondafan37]

Originally Posted by NaBUru38

Also there's rumours of the TC adopting Mustang, Camaro and Challenger bodykits for 2024.

Actually the rumor is about the Corvette and the Mustang. I guess maybe it's because the Camaro is going out of production soon.
In the TV program MAXIMA VELOCIDAD they said that 3 people from the ACTC traveled to the USA to see molds of doors and trunks of Mustang and Corvette.

https://www.facebook.com/permalink.p...59772084148822

[TuteZaek]

Not saying that on MV lie, but grain of salt on that, especially since the "doors and trunks" comment, taking into account that the Camry has almost every panel from the pontoons up closely based on the street modell except for, the front and doors (that were made bigger for helping the drivers to get in, since the seats are too far back)
Also the Corvette is a central engined car...

Maybe new models are coming, but there is a lot of smoke on that MV anouncement

[uesugi kenshin]

Just how crazy was todays TN C3 race?

[TuteZaek]

Originally Posted by uesugi kenshin

Just how crazy was todays TN C3 race?

It was a mess, i mean, as a show was crazy... But half of the 41 cars ended damaged in stupid and unnecesary friction and more stupid crashes, it's fun till someone ends hurt, and every race seems worse, especially in the TN and TRV6 (Last TR race was a mess almost as bad as today's TNC3 race) the CDA (the ones in charge of fiscalizing both, and the TC2000, where isn't as bad, proving that the racing could be cleaner) should stop this before something bad happens.