[WEC] Peugeot Sport returning to WEC

[Steve McQ]

Now they really need to sort out their transmission. I am pretty sure they have performance (and reliability of course) to unlock right there.

[S griffin]

Their result here, following on from their performance at LM, will be the boost they need to convince them they are heading in the right direction and their own concept is not a waste

[kdr]

I know they're only short glimpses but after the WEC Full Access thing i found myself warming to them. The head honchos seemed quite down to earth, phlegmatic and self aware about their chances. Still wish they'd kept the car Nardo grey though.

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by kdr

The head honchos seemed quite down to earth, phlegmatic and self aware about their chances.

You mean they are French? Yes, they are. Very much. And dangerous Carlos was in situ, racing a Ralt RT3 in the F3 Classic grid.

Now they really need to sort out their transmission. Or whatever is the origin of the issues. Over the years we've alwyas heard about transmission for Pug and spark plugs for Renault. Typical BS from PR people and this in not only french!
I've been looking for some videos from LM on YT and it seems that at least two teams have had some deleted, Porsche on-board, and Pug when they lost the front end in the straight. Big business and the stakes are very high.

[KlBD]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

You mean they are French? Yes, they are. Very much. And dangerous Carlos was in situ, racing a Ralt RT3 in the F3 Classic grid.

Now they really need to sort out their transmission. Or whatever is the origin of the issues. Over the years we've alwyas heard about transmission for Pug and spark plugs for Renault. Typical BS from PR people and this in not only french!
I've been looking for some videos from LM on YT and it seems that at least two teams have had some deleted, Porsche on-board, and Pug when they lost the front end in the straight. Big business and the stakes are very high.

Considering the #94 was stuck in gear when it straight lined the first chicane yesterday and JEV was on the radio asking about fixes with the shifting, I think this time we can reasonably believe it was the transmission which had a problem.

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by KlBD

Considering the #94 was stuck in gear when it straight lined the first chicane yesterday and JEV was on the radio asking about fixes with the shifting, I think this time we can reasonably believe it was the transmission which had a problem.

To be fair, yes. Just yes. In the other hand, remaining fair, it could be the steering wheel and/or wiring loom issues. And nothing proves that they are in the same troubles than were at LM. Even?

[KlBD]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

To be fair, yes. Just yes. In the other hand, remaining fair, it could be the steering wheel and/or wiring loom issues. And nothing proves that they are in the same troubles than were at LM. Even?

You are right to point this out. I used "transmission" as shorthand in this case to refer to components of the car responsible for shifting gears - the gearbox itself, actuation systems, the electrical systems and software, etc. As fans, we would never know the full story just from TV broadcast so it happened to be easier to refer to generalities

[joeb]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

To be fair, yes. Just yes. In the other hand, remaining fair, it could be the steering wheel and/or wiring loom issues. And nothing proves that they are in the same troubles than were at LM. Even?

Originally Posted by KlBD

You are right to point this out. I used "transmission" as shorthand in this case to refer to components of the car responsible for shifting gears - the gearbox itself, actuation systems, the electrical systems and software, etc. As fans, we would never know the full story just from TV broadcast so it happened to be easier to refer to generalities

Twas the gearshift actuator on the 94 that needed changing at Monza

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...-pace-to-find/

The lengthy garage visit for the No. 94 car driven by Gustavo Menezes, Loic Duval and Nico Mueller was caused by a problem with the car’s gearshift actuator system.

Peugeot replaced the actuator and the car continued to reach the checkered flag in 19th overall, nine laps down on the winning No. 7 Toyota.

[Gerard C]

May be they are the innocent victims of cost killers always asking for bargains when buying a component as is the case for their poor road cars? Do you imagine they have to go back to a conventional gear shift and have to cope with double declutch? More seriously I've been impressed by JE Vergne as he was not too hard on the car, rather carefull in the trafic and pretty much consistent all weekend long. So, joeb and KIBD, tout est bien qui finit bien!

[skycafe]

Originally Posted by joeb

Twas the gearshift actuator on the 94 that needed changing at Monza

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...-pace-to-find/

They had changed from elecric to hydraulic after Sebring, and they are still having issues...
would seem to point to issues with the g-box itself? Software?

[Gerard C]

As said above, we'll never know I fear. The first reason being they actually cant find how to fix those issues themselves! What's strange is that several cars and teams have to change what is much more than a simple steering wheel. Then i'm with you when you suggest it might have several origins.

[skycafe]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

From the poor images I saw it seemed that the gurneys are higher than were in LM. Anyone to correct this?

Is the term "gurneys" being used in reference to the 'winglets' that are mounted on the rear outboard fender tops, above the tail lights? See attached photograph.

https://sportscar365.com/?attachment_id=116907

[Gerard C]

Oui, oui, tout a fait. To avoid anyone using Google to translate I used gurney because you all know what it means. But TBH, I cant remember when the last and even the first I saw this. I don't even know how they are named in my own language. So winglets, thanks for suggestion, seems pretty much appropriate. If not, could be something like "air trap boxes". I know what a gurney is supposed to be! Abuse of language sometimes?

[skycafe]

In videos by aerodynamicists they have called them 'winglets,' so that is why I use the term.

The winglets came along when there was a need for more tailfin area (the cars central tailfin that runs along the rear cover is significantly smaller then the conventional cars because its size relates to a relationship with the rear wing, which the Pug does not have. So, the additional vertical elements sprouted on the vertical inner face of the rear fenders, giving needed surface to help prevent 'yaw,' and also providing a handy support for these winglets).

There are no clear views of these elements, but it does look like there is a gap between their bottom edge and the top surface of the fender.

Notice the top edge of the winglets always slopes down toward the outside of the car. The air blowing over would spin, thus creating vortices in the wake which would pull the outer edge air out and keeps the airflow down the center section-around the teardrop of the cockpit/rear engine cover-a pure stream blowing over and off the rear deck and extracting the airflow from the diffuser.

OR, I'm full of it and haven't a clue.

The winglets at Monza look larger or at more on an angle of attack then the configuration at LeMans. To me, anyway. I think they use them for downforce and also balancing of aero forces.

I think the car is very elegant from an aero standpoint.

[Adam43]

Good summary.

They are obviously finding a benefit in the winglets. To make them bigger as they go to Monza hints at that.

Each team is allowed an aero piece they can adjust to balance - is that the winglet for Peugeot?

[skycafe]

Originally Posted by Adam43

Good summary.

They are obviously finding a benefit in the winglets. To make them bigger as they go to Monza hints at that.

Each team is allowed an aero piece they can adjust to balance - is that the winglet for Peugeot?

I am guessing they are bigger, or run at a steeper angle, or both. I wish someone would show a closeup photograph as those things are almost camoflaged.

I guess the winglet is that element. The original presentation did not have those rear outboard elements. They would be good drag generators too.

There are some under car slots which I have seen mentioned. I wonder if those have adjustability? If they do than the winglets can't, as per the rules.

[Gerard C]

As you I noticed some changes for Monza but cant say how it works. Adding drag, they don't care that much because the car must stay within the envelop fixed by rules. I wont say that the winglets are a good substitute to a rear wing but together with a silight different rear end, called here spoiler, they are going to improve the car which could end up with a not-really-wingless design.

And spot on, the painting is very familiar as a camouflage when it comes to road test a new model. May be accurate views of the car racing/testing in the wet could show vortexes. Or not…

[Gerard C]

As to the pictures posted by joeb -thanks- I dunno if those "boxes" have holes drilled on their sides as Adam saw ont the Ferrari at LM. Painting, my eyes or screen may be.

[Gerard C]

Yes! Since last night was wondering "where did I see this before". Don't you think that the rear part of the Chevron B16, one of the most elegant racing car of its era, reminds this kind of square box at rear. Neither gurney nor winglet.https://www.newsclassicracing.com/Pl...La-Chevron-B16
https://www.ascottcollection.com/chevron-b16-04 Il n'est de nouveau que ce que l'on a oublié…

[skycafe]

My use of the word "camouflage," (which is now spelled correctly...) was not meant to imply that they are trying to hide something- although these winglets are in the open the color schemes of the car plus the bodywork lines of the car; the rear fender tops slope down and these winglets are mounted there, so not fully visible in a front view, hidden by vertcal elements in profile, and just sort of blend into obscurity from the rear because of the black color and shadows.

I found this article and photograph from Monza where you can discern some of the shape when viewed from the front

https://us.motorsport.com/wec/news/p...ezes/10493488/

[Gerard C]

Thanks for the link(s) skycafe. And sorry for my misspelling of "camouflage"! Still couldn't find if they are allowed to homologate several different aero elements to be used during the same season.

[skycafe]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

And sorry for my misspelling of "camouflage"! Still couldn't find if they are allowed to homologate several different aero elements to be used during the same season.

I misspelled the word originally. (its a talent)

From trying to understand the regulations-the bodywork, which includes the aero device, is homolgated. Only one aero element may be adjusted, and it must meet all regulations (i.e. dowforce and drag limits and ratios) throughout its range of adjustment. So, you commit to a wing design and that is what you get-presumably you can use a "joker" to change that.

I can't figure out if, pertaining to the aero holes above the wheels (to help prevent blowovers) can be spanned by an aero element-if you look at this early 9X8 photograph showing the rear from a high angle, the shape of the rear aero hole is clearly visible, and I am sure meets requirements for area. The photo is pre-winglets. I think the bottom edge of the winglets spans the areo hole, which would be why you can see daylight under from very specific angles...

If so, then air going over the winglet is going to act to extract air from the inner fender area and blow it up and out. Because of the spinning tire that is turbulent air, and the winglet helps to extract and 'toss' it up and out and away from the central stream from the underbody and the upper centerline flow. The smaller rear wheel option they are running seems like it enhances that type flow.

https://www.racetechmag.com/2021/07/...-wec-hypercar/

[skycafe]

Derek Bennett's Chevron B16 coupe was a very elegant shape, perfect visually in every way.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

…sorry for my misspelling of "camouflage"!

Originally Posted by skycafe

I misspelled the word originally.

I didn’t notice.

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by skycafe

Derek Bennett's Chevron B16 coupe was a very elegant shape, perfect visually in every way.

Sure t'was! To stick to this thread (yeah, I know…) two B16's were used for the Le Mans film.
http://www.speedsportblog.com/2020/0...-stars-of.html

I do recommend you this too https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_...an_%26_Le_Mans
Ha yes, as to the aero holes above the front wheels, its a requirement! (14 July, here, does not help to keep all the brain together!).