[Official] Singapore Grand Prix - Round 15 of 21 - Grand Prix Weekend Thread

[djinvicta]

So true Adam and Ayse...diabolical and dangerous.. Maldinado did the same swipe at Spa a few years ago... Actually as Vettel did to Hamilton in Baku I believe. It needs stamping on hard..

[littleman]

Hamilton, just like Monza two weeks ago, was absolutely peerless this weekend.
He'll go on to secure his 5th World Title now and nobody can question his position as one of the greatest F1 drivers of all time.

For me,Hamilton only has one challenge left before retiring.
Could he beat Fernando Alonso to the 2019 title if they were team mates at Mercedes next year?

This is the question all motorsport fans want answered before they both retire.
Come on F1 and Mercedes, make it happen.

This "Ultimate" head to head would give F1 the shot in the arm it so desperately needs and cultivate media interest not seen for many a year.

It can only result in a win/win situation for all.

[ascarracinguk]

Originally Posted by littleman

Hamilton, just like Monza two weeks ago, was absolutely peerless this weekend.
He'll go on to secure his 5th World Title now and nobody can question his position as one of the greatest F1 drivers of all time.

For me,Hamilton only has one challenge left before retiring.
Could he beat Fernando Alonso to the 2019 title if they were team mates at Mercedes next year?

This is the question all motorsport fans want answered before they both retire.
Come on F1 and Mercedes, make it happen.

This "Ultimate" head to head would give F1 the shot in the arm it so desperately needs and cultivate media interest not seen for many a year.

It can only result in a win/win situation for all.

He’s already beaten Alonso in the same car, and would undoubtedly do it again having experience in the Mercedes already

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by djinvicta

So true Adam and Ayse...diabolical and dangerous.. Maldinado did the same swipe at Spa a few years ago... Actually as Vettel did to Hamilton in Baku I believe. It needs stamping on hard..

The weird thing is that it is most likely to damage your own car! So it’s not only childish, petulant, dangerous and borderline assault, it is stupid.

[ascarracinguk]

Originally Posted by Adam43

The weird thing is that it is most likely to damage your own car! So it’s not only childish, petulant, dangerous and borderline assault, it is stupid.

But nothing new. See Senna, Prost, Schumacher, hunt, Vettel, verstappen et al

[Razzzor]

Originally Posted by F1Guy

A bit more on tyre strategy, Vettel wanted to go through to Q3 on the ultra's. But Ferrari refused as they believed it would be short. Below is some of the team radio between Vettel and Ferrari during Q2, before Vettel's final run in Q2. As a guide, "quali" are the Hypersoft, and "option" is the Ultrasoft.


Adami: OK box, Sebastian, box.

Vettel: What is your thinking?

Adami: We move to quali.

Vettel: I have lap time left.

Adami: How much?

Vettel: With a decent out-lap I would say at least half a second.

Adami: OK, copy.

Vettel: How much do you need? Then I can tell you.

Adami: 38.1. I think it’s not possible. And both Mercs on quali, and Red Bull on quali as well.

Vettel: I can do it, a 38.1.

Adami: Understood. And box. So we believe is too tight so we go for quali.

Vettel: I am happy to go option. That was not a good lap. The out-lap was too slow. Tyres were too cold.

Adami: I’ll come back to you.

Vettel: If you believe there is strong merit to start on the option I can do it.

Adami: No we go on quali. The decision is to go on quali. The decision is too risky.

Vettel: OK I follow you. I tell you I have more than half a second.

Adami: Understood.


As it turned out, a 1:38.4 would have got Vettel into Q3. But Ferrari didn't want to risk it. Would have been very interesting if Vettel was to start the race on Ultra's, with the Merc's and the Bull's on Hyper's.

Interesting but Lulu only did a 1:39.4 on the ultras and we now know that Ferrari was 0.3-0.6sec per lap slower. So he didn't stand a chance in doing a 1:38.4.

[Razzzor]

Originally Posted by ascarracinguk

Vettel and ferrari screwed up thier tyre choice for Singapore weeks ago, Vettel screwed up Q2, and again Q3, forcing Ferrari to go down an inferior tyre strategy, Vettel screwed up the first stint, didn’t make his tyres last long enough forcing Ferrari to put him on that inferior strategy. They both screwed up....

...not sure why you can’t admit Vettel has a large part in this

Wow you've got some real Vettel hate inside you huh.


They didn't really screw up their tyre choice, they screwed up the decision to use ultras and instead of the softs for the race. They had a set to use. However it would have made absolutely no difference to the race anyway. Kimi had no pace on them.


You've got to just admit, the Ferrari was not the quickest package at Singapore. They had straight line speed but the Merc especially with Lulu was the better car. Lulu made a bit of difference in quali, but Vettel's 2 lockups didn't cost him 0.6sec. The car setup not being as good cost him that. Lulu's lap was some magical godlike lap, he just had a better car! We just didn't know it at the time because the media paints the picture that the Ferrari is so much better and going to dominate the weekend after practise. But Merc were clearly just sandbagging practise or found the sweet setup before quali.


His tyres not lasting long enough in the first sting... he was dropped tenths per lap and it was increasing, he wasn't using the tyres hard and never got close to attacking Lewis. So how do you blame him for screwing up? That's not a screw up mate, it's a car using it's tyres too hard in an attempt to keep up with a faster car.


If we keep saying this was a poor performance for Seb, then what does that say about the fan favourite Kimi being 15secs behind him on the better strategy, and Bottas the same in what should have been the better package. Sebs race was fine, they just didn't have the car this weekend to beat Lewis.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by ascarracinguk

But nothing new. See Senna, Prost, Schumacher, hunt, Vettel, verstappen et al

I’m not defending those previous examples, or saying that they’re all guilty, but the Vettel and Perez ones are a little different. They were just a shot at the other driver because they were annoyed. The Senna and Schumacher ones weren’t that for instance. Not saying it makes it OK, of course.

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by Razzzor

Wow you've got some real Vettel hate inside you huh
.

I’m not getting that from the users posts. He just thought he had a poor race!

[ascarracinguk]

Originally Posted by Razzzor

Wow you've got some real Vettel hate inside you huh.


They didn't really screw up their tyre choice, they screwed up the decision to use ultras and instead of the softs for the race. They had a set to use. However it would have made absolutely no difference to the race anyway. Kimi had no pace on them.


You've got to just admit, the Ferrari was not the quickest package at Singapore. They had straight line speed but the Merc especially with Lulu was the better car. Lulu made a bit of difference in quali, but Vettel's 2 lockups didn't cost him 0.6sec. The car setup not being as good cost him that. Lulu's lap was some magical godlike lap, he just had a better car! We just didn't know it at the time because the media paints the picture that the Ferrari is so much better and going to dominate the weekend after practise. But Merc were clearly just sandbagging practise or found the sweet setup before quali.


His tyres not lasting long enough in the first sting... he was dropped tenths per lap and it was increasing, he wasn't using the tyres hard and never got close to attacking Lewis. So how do you blame him for screwing up? That's not a screw up mate, it's a car using it's tyres too hard in an attempt to keep up with a faster car.


If we keep saying this was a poor performance for Seb, then what does that say about the fan favourite Kimi being 15secs behind him on the better strategy, and Bottas the same in what should have been the better package. Sebs race was fine, they just didn't have the car this weekend to beat Lewis.

Not at all. I’ve said it’s jointly Vettels and ferraris fault, just some on here can’t seem to apportion any blame to Vettel

Ferrari screwed up on tyre choice. Same as monza they bought 1 set instead of 3 like Mercedes, meaning they couldn’t learn from them in practice. Because of this their ultimate strategy would have been to start on the ultras (short run down to turn 1 would have allowed this) but Vettel screwed up his lap in Q2 so they were forced to go again and start on hypers. Vettel then didn’t get the lap in Q3, meaning that they were on the back foot going into the race.

Ferrari had 2 choices in the race, 1 stop or 2 stop. The optimum strategy was to 1 stop, putting on the softs, but because they had no data, they chose not to risk it, so had to use the ultras....which meant they should have 2 stopped, but because Hamilton was controlling the pace up front there wasn’t a big enough gap to 2 stop Vettel, so instead he had to nurse the tyres to the end.

So as I’ve said before, it’s a catalogue of errors from choosing the tyres several weeks ago, to poor performances by Seb in qualifying, forcing Ferrari to run a less than optimum strategy

You say they didn’t have the car....they certainly did up until qualifying, were fastest down the straights and all the way through practice. Even Vettel admitted they ballsed up, it’s a race they should have won, and yet again haven’t

[Gingers4Justice]

Blue flags need to go.

Some of the best LMP1 battles have come from two leaders coming across traffic together. Likewise, the closest the two leaders got was when a driver effectively completely ignored the rule.

Getting past backmarkers should be part of a driver’s race craft. It might even incentivise engineers to design cars which can cope with turbulent air.

[EffectiveSprinkles]

Originally Posted by Adam43

I’m not getting that from the users posts.

I did, and I'm not alone it seems. But that's what the ignore list is for, although it apparently doesn't help when someone else qoutes the offender.

[ascarracinguk]

Originally Posted by EffectiveSprinkles

I did, and I'm not alone it seems. But that's what the ignore list is for, although it apparently doesn't help when someone else qoutes the offender.

The offender? Wow.....I write a balanced view apportioning fault at both Vettel and ferrari and I’m an offender because one person agrees with your view. Somewhat laughable. Hey here’s an idea, why not debate with someone rather than putting them on an ignore list because you don’t agree with them.

Maybe someone can quote this for me lol!

[peebee2]

Originally Posted by ascarracinguk

The offender? Wow.....I write a balanced view apportioning fault at both Vettel and ferrari and I’m an offender because one person agrees with your view. Somewhat laughable. Hey here’s an idea, why not debate with someone rather than putting them on an ignore list because you don’t agree with them.

Maybe someone can quote this for me lol!

Done!

[ascarracinguk]

Originally Posted by peebee2

Done!

Thanks lmao ;-p

[littleman]

I thought the bloke who finished 7th in that dreadful McLaren drove a fantastic race. Why aren't the top teams trying to sign him?

He looks like a phenomanal talent to me.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by littleman

I thought the bloke who finished 7th in that dreadful McLaren drove a fantastic race. Why aren't the top teams trying to sign him?

He looks like a phenomanal talent to me.

You would have thought and yet, it doesn't look like his IndyCar venture is a given.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by ascarracinguk

But nothing new. See Senna, Prost, Schumacher, hunt, Vettel, verstappen et al

True, though there was something exceptionally brutal about the Schumacher Chop.

[Skam85]

If there is one positive we can glean from this race, is the statistic that the Big 3 teams took up the top 6 finishing positions in the race for only the second time this season.

[wnut]

Originally Posted by djinvicta

I am just amazed there is not a thread/talk about Perez who blatantly put his teammate in the wall..(you could see the wheel move as he did it).
Then lost his cool with Sirotkin with a side swipe.
Absolute diabolical racing in any Formula except Bangers...
What are we bringing youngsters into racing for with actions like this?

Agreed, just unbelievable!

[sizzle]

Originally Posted by Gingers4Justice

Blue flags need to go.

Some of the best LMP1 battles have come from two leaders coming across traffic together. Likewise, the closest the two leaders got was when a driver effectively completely ignored the rule.

Getting past backmarkers should be part of a driver’s race craft. It might even incentivise engineers to design cars which can cope with turbulent air.

Go to the top of the class Sir

[littleman]

Seriously, if I were Liberty Media I'd be doing whatever it takes to put Alonso in a Mercedes for next year.

They've spent a fortune to secure the commercial rights to F1 so commercially, in the short term at least, this is the best decision they can make for their business.

Hamilton has now conclusively defeated Vettel so everything is ready for the "Fight of the Century" - I'm using Las Vegas talk of course but somehow I rather like it !

[Akrapovic]

The last time Lewis and Fernando were in the same team it didn't go that well. Given Mercedes couldn't make Lewis and Nico play well together, I doubt they'd be happy with Fernandos influence there.

[TrapezeArtist]

Huge tyre/Ferrari debate on the preceding pages that I've followed with interest. There just seems to be one point that hasn't been chewed over:

Soft tyre is a lot slower (1 second, maybe) than the Ultra, but it's more durable.
Drive the Ultra below it's optimum and (about 1 second per lap) and it can be made to last about as long as a Soft.
So in reality, Soft and Ultra achieve more or less the same effect, but in different ways.

[Akrapovic]

Originally Posted by TrapezeArtist

Huge tyre/Ferrari debate on the preceding pages that I've followed with interest. There just seems to be one point that hasn't been chewed over:

Soft tyre is a lot slower (1 second, maybe) than the Ultra, but it's more durable.
Drive the Ultra below it's optimum and (about 1 second per lap) and it can be made to last about as long as a Soft.
So in reality, Soft and Ultra achieve more or less the same effect, but in different ways.

Not according to Pirelli, who said during the broadcast that Vettels tyre wouldn't be able to go the distance Ferrari asked it to.

Does raise another point about teams ignoring the Pirelli guidelines again. If you do that, you shouldn't be allowed to complain about any issue you have.