[Team] Williams: Do they have a spare tub?

[morninggents]

Originally Posted by RWill2073

Between being the former boss's daughter to being a woman in a man's world, how much do you think her situation has been made more difficult for reasons beyond her ability? I imagine every sponsor, team boss with options, etc could potentially discount her as not up to the job, as many on here do, more because of how she got her position AND FOR BEING A WOMAN. So any sponsor or engineer or whatever with options might demand more control, a better deal, play more hardball with her and go elsewhere if they didn't get what they want.

Not that I'm saying they're all sexists or whatever, just that it seems a theme even here, whereits a group of mostly very level headed people to still kind of look at her as a WEAKNESS. Maybe Frank did not set her up with a well run ship to begin with, either.

What has her being a woman got to do with her performance? Many women operate well and are successful in the business and sporting world.


I think that the performance of the team, of which she is the head honcho, indicates there is a weakness at the top.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Monesha of Sauber, did she have the same problems? Hard to tell, because she wasn’t in the main helm for long

Monisha Kaltenborn, was Sauber's CEO from January 2010 until 22 June 2017 and Team Principal from October 2012, after Peter Sauber retired from managing the team, having already transferred a third of the Sauber team to her, earlier that year.

[RWill2073]

Originally Posted by morninggents

What has her being a woman got to do with her performance? Many women operate well and are successful in the business and sporting world.


I think that the performance of the team, of which she is the head honcho, indicates there is a weakness at the top.

I thought I was clear that I didn't think it had anything to do with it. I was just throwing out there the possibility that in a profession that is more Male dominated than most, and one where dealings with businesses for funding and sponsorship, that through no failing on her part, she may have had a harder time getting her ducks in a row because of how others deal with her as opposed to if she was a man. Maybe I'm not making my point clear enough, I don't know.

If someone takes over an organization and before they even have time to implement their philosophy, or changes they want to make, you already see a downturn, that would point to me that the previous regime put it on a path toward failure. William's downturn was underway as she took over, correct?

[Skam85]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Monesha of Sauber, did she have the same problems? Hard to tell, because she wasn’t in the main helm for long

It didn't help that she signed about seven drivers to two available seats

[Casper]

Originally Posted by RWill2073

I thought I was clear that I didn't think it had anything to do with it. I was just throwing out there the possibility that in a profession that is more Male dominated than most, and one where dealings with businesses for funding and sponsorship, that through no failing on her part, she may have had a harder time getting her ducks in a row because of how others deal with her as opposed to if she was a man. Maybe I'm not making my point clear enough, I don't know.

If someone takes over an organization and before they even have time to implement their philosophy, or changes they want to make, you already see a downturn, that would point to me that the previous regime put it on a path toward failure. William's downturn was underway as she took over, correct?

Agreed but she has not turned around that slide in the 5 years she has been in the position. I would think a competent manager would do it in two years or thereabouts, Zak Brown might be an example of that.

[morninggents]

Originally Posted by RWill2073

I thought I was clear that I didn't think it had anything to do with it. I was just throwing out there the possibility that in a profession that is more Male dominated than most, and one where dealings with businesses for funding and sponsorship, that through no failing on her part, she may have had a harder time getting her ducks in a row because of how others deal with her as opposed to if she was a man. Maybe I'm not making my point clear enough, I don't know.

If someone takes over an organization and before they even have time to implement their philosophy, or changes they want to make, you already see a downturn, that would point to me that the previous regime put it on a path toward failure. William's downturn was underway as she took over, correct?

Apologies. I misread your meaning.


I think Williams did OK for a couple of seasons after she took over which was probably down to FWs actions. The downturn came after that.

[Richard C]

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/w...ector/4790805/

I don't try to keep track of "who is who". Based upon the article, his responsibilities seems large. What is left from a peer perspective (who are his peers/same reporting level at Williams)? Can anyone speak as to this being a good thing or not? Any comments on why he left McLaren in 2019?

Richard

[E.B]

Originally Posted by Richard Casto

Any comments on why he left McLaren in 2019?

Richard

His departure was very low key in media terms. My thoughts at the time were that perhaps, after he was 'promoted' post Boullier's departure to be perhaps (in his mind) the man with a future. However Seidl was then put into the top job with quite a fanfare. My feeling is that perhaps his (Robert's) future progress up the ladder was looking remote and so he quit thinking another opportunity would come up in the pre Covid-19 period.
That is just my thoughts at the time of his departure and I'm happy to be corrected.

[S griffin]

He’s not one really in the spotlight. I don’t know how much influence he had at McLaren, obviously there were some big changes then. Now McLaren have their own structure and now have Seidl doing things his way. Glad Williams have Roberts now, shame we have to wait to see what he can do. Will be very interesting, only time will tell

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by E.B

His departure was very low key in media terms. My thoughts at the time were that perhaps, after he was 'promoted' post Boullier's departure to be perhaps (in his mind) the man with a future. However Seidl was then put into the top job with quite a fanfare. My feeling is that perhaps his (Robert's) future progress up the ladder was looking remote and so he quit thinking another opportunity would come up in the pre Covid-19 period.
That is just my thoughts at the time of his departure and I'm happy to be corrected.

that sounds about as good of an explanation as any.

he has been sidelined since early 2019 though..gardening leave makes team rebuilding much harder then it needs to.

so one additional thing i infer from this is that Claire did in fact attempt to improve the organizational structure in early 2019 and probably right after Williams had its very public issues....and given the nature of gardening leave combined with F1 development cycles, it is probably fair to say that much more time will be needed in order to properly assess how she handled the 2019 testing/development crisis.

[Richard C]

Thoughts on his role? What he owns and maybe more more importantly, what he doesn't own. Article says

Roberts will join Williams on 1 June to oversee the team's F1 technical, operations and planning functions, as well as racing and factory operations.

He will also take overall responsibility for the car design and development process.

That seems like a lot. What is left?

The team opted against hiring a direct replacement for Lowe midway through last season, instead giving greater responsibility to chief designer Doug McKiernan, head of design Adam Carter, and head of vehicle performance Dave Robson.

So Roberts is the Lowe replacement and those mentioned above will slot under him?

I will not tiptoe around my core question. I am trying to understand what Claire does today, and how much that might change with Roberts coming onboard. Will she be offloading some duties or is it more of those mentioned in the quote directly above (McKiernan, Carter, etc.) lose responsibilities and Williams will be less of a committee run org? I say all of this without really having a strong idea of the typical internal structure of an F1 engineering team.

Richard

[Armco Bender]

Williams has effectively been sold,the old guard are quietly shuffling out the back door.
Its not the first time Williams F1 has been sold,to a Candian as well...
Maybe a new Williams team will make a come back with wealthy Saudi sponsors,and I'll dig up my old fruit of the Loom tee shirt to wear as well...

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Armco Bender

Williams has effectively been sold,the old guard are quietly shuffling out the back door.
Its not the first time Williams F1 has been sold,to a Candian as well...
Maybe a new Williams team will make a come back with wealthy Saudi sponsors,and I'll dig up my old fruit of the Loom tee shirt to wear as well...

I thought Williams sold a majority equity stake in sister company Williams Advanced Engineering, to an independent private equity firm controlled by EMK Capital?

[Casper]

It might be fair to say that a change of management and structure might have been one of the conditions of the loan they were advanced. In fact it would surprise me if some conditions of this nature were not part of the deal. If money is loaned then the lender at least wants a fair chance to get it back.

[bjohnsonsmith]

I must admit I've been out of the loop on the Williams F1 saga. So as it stands, Williams have not only sold a majority stake in Williams Advanced Engineering to EMK Capital Ltd. but they also have a loan from Michael Latifi's owned Latrus Racing Corp, as part of a major re-financing of the team. I wonder what they have as surety for the loan?

[Casper]

As I said earlier in this thread you can bet the lender has a plan to get his money back or at least a ROI with very little risk to him.

[midgetman]

Security for the loan? It's all out there. The factory, the classic F1 cars, the family farm.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by midgetman

Security for the loan? It's all out there. The factory, the classic F1 cars, the family farm.

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

Classic F1 cars are a very specialised market and seem a speculative way of guaranteeing a loan. The F1 factory is the most logical, with the value of the equipment/plant in the factory, plus there is the value of the land. However, in the current climate and who knows how long this will last and the repercussions felt, commercial property prices have dropped. I don't know about the farm and I would have thought this was a family asset, though I could be wrong.

If indeed this is what is being put up for surety and Williams don't deliver, then they could lose everything and Williams will be no more, unless Latrus Racing Corp go racing and buy the Williams Grand Prix Engineering name.

[Moneyseeker]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

Classic F1 cars are a very specialised market and seem a speculative way of guaranteeing a loan. The F1 factory is the most logical, with the value of the equipment/plant in the factory, plus there is the value of the land. However, in the current climate and who knows how long this will last and the repercussions felt, commercial property prices have dropped. I don't know about the farm and I would have thought this was a family asset, though I could be wrong.

If indeed this is what is being put up for surety and Williams don't deliver, then they could lose everything and Williams will be no more, unless Latrus Racing Corp go racing and buy the Williams Grand Prix Engineering name.

Collateral also includes their F1 entry apparently, so yep should the worse happen they will get just over half an F1 team for a song...

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

If indeed this is what is being put up for surety and Williams don't deliver, then they could lose everything and Williams will be no more, unless Latrus Racing Corp go racing and buy the Williams Grand Prix Engineering name.

Yes, this basically the conclusion everyone reached when this was discussed awhile back (I think about a month back).

Richard

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by Richard Casto

Yes, this basically the conclusion everyone reached when this was discussed awhile back (I think about a month back).

Richard

I did say I had been out of the loop on this one, 6 posts back. Anyway I'm up to speed now.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

I did say I had been out of the loop on this one, 6 posts back. Anyway I'm up to speed now.

Sorry, mostly calling out a month ago if you wanted to scroll back and see where the discuss for this exists in this thread.

I think if we didn't have a lot of craziness going on right now due to the pandemic, that this topic would get more time. I think it shows the rough situation Williams is in.

I think everyone has focused on how Latifi basically has potentially put Williams in his pocket. But what is not know is Latifi's intent. It very well may be to keep Williams solvent and independent. And he may very well just want future payment vs. collateral on a defaulted loan. But... if things go south, he gets the assets vs. someone else.

Richard

[Greem]

Well now. This is a plan, but probably not the plan we were looking for...

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/w...-team/4798066/

[peebee2]

Sad but always thought Rokit had zero real money and it was an incredibly high risk strategy.

[EastonNeston]

Giving notice to the current sponsor would suggest that either thay have a new sponsor wanting to come onboard or they have a potential investor/purchasor that wants a clean canvass to apply their branding.