john cleland

daz90 · 24 Dec 2002, 16:36 (Ref:456854)

one of the best, i beleive cleland was and always will be a touring car legend, and would be my choice as best driver in the last ten years. do u agree?

argybargy · 24 Dec 2002, 17:24 (Ref:456894)

Amongst the British drivers, I would agree, but if you open the field to International drivers, my money would go on Jo Winckelhock or Alain Menu

rdjones · 24 Dec 2002, 19:36 (Ref:456940)

The guy is a legends..............

MikeH · 24 Dec 2002, 19:45 (Ref:456946)

No other British driver comes close - I've gone for Legend.

Sherman · 25 Dec 2002, 00:19 (Ref:457057)

He was Scottish, but apart from that he was brilliant!

(joke, all people from across border-dont get angry!)

AndyP · 25 Dec 2002, 18:25 (Ref:457273)

John is definitely one of the best Touring Car drivers ever. Such a shame we don't see much of him nowadays!

rick vaux · 25 Dec 2002, 21:10 (Ref:457325)

ANDY P, welcome to the forum. Indeed john is up there with the best of them.

DAVID PATERSON · 25 Dec 2002, 21:39 (Ref:457341)

I'm in the midle of the '95 BTCC season review video. Clealand sure does have a go doesn't he?

O'Schumacher · 26 Dec 2002, 00:08 (Ref:457412)

Legend
Legend
Legend
Legend

The best ever. A tough man on the track, and his loyalty to Vauxhall was never in question. Pity that. He could have gone to Renault in '96 and taken another few titles. He could have waited with triple 8 until 2001 and beaten Thompson, Muller, Plato et All to the last 2 championships.

Never mind.

LEGEND!

BootsOntheSide · 26 Dec 2002, 11:55 (Ref:457604)

I think he's one of the best of the modern era. He almost always outdid his team-mates, whoever they were, and put three different types of Vauxhall right in the mix for winning races and titles. He was great off-track as well, clearly a serious competitor with a great attitude to the racing.

daz90 · 27 Dec 2002, 00:38 (Ref:457905)

Quote:

Originally posted by DAVID PATERSON
I'm in the midle of the '95 BTCC season review video. Clealand sure does have a go doesn't he?

95 what a season!! yes cleland was awesome and he sure did give it a go he just seemed so up for it and he seemed to be more concentrated on taking a good quantity of points rather than pushing too hard all of the time.even though menu and rydell kept on putting major presure on his title hopes he came through it, great season.

silvervsix · 27 Dec 2002, 01:48 (Ref:457921)

From only seeing limited BTCC races I reckon the guy can drive. He has done the last few Bathurst and proven he can mix it with some of Australia's best.

racer69 · 27 Dec 2002, 07:02 (Ref:457983)

I'd only vote a a 'good driver'

He seemed to be very motivated and competitive when he had a good car under him, like 91,92,95, even 1998 he put in some great drives. When the car wasn't so good though, he didn't seem to have the same fire about him.

It also has to be remembered that his first championship win was luck more than anything else. How strong was class C in the 1989 BTCC? All he had to aim to do was win his class, while the likes of Rouse, Gravett and Harvey battled up front for race victories but really didn't have much hope of a title.

He drove superbly in 1995 though.

Mocko · 27 Dec 2002, 09:58 (Ref:458035)

Quote:

Originally posted by racer69
It also has to be remembered that his first championship win was luck more than anything else. How strong was class C in the 1989 BTCC? All he had to aim to do was win his class, while the likes of Rouse, Gravett and Harvey battled up front for race victories but really didn't have much hope of a title.

He wasn't too keen about winning the championship that way. He felt he cheated and he wanted to win from the front and he did (hence the tears).

Anyway, LEGEND (stop selling Volvos, come back Cleland!!)

**Peter Mallett** · 27 Dec 2002, 11:01 (Ref:458067)

How come there isn't an @rse category to vote for?

Crash Test · 28 Dec 2002, 11:07 (Ref:458797)

Legend

After a very long chat with him at the Q500 last year, definately a legend. Come to think about it, I've met him a few times now, dating back to Bathurst 97, really nice bloke

Ditto Patto: I also recently acquired a copy of the 95 BTCC review, and the missers asked if it was one of those Havoc videos, because there was a rollover ever 35sec

speedy king · 28 Dec 2002, 22:36 (Ref:459191)

Quote:

Originally posted by Mocko
He wasn't too keen about winning the championship that way. He felt he cheated and he wanted to win from the front and he did (hence the tears).

Anyway, LEGEND (stop selling Volvos, come back Cleland!!)

Selling Volvos?

SPARK XracingUK · 28 Dec 2002, 22:50 (Ref:459216)

Hi all,
John was a star driver in his day, but i think in 1999 he was starting to show his age (Like Damon Hill). I think it would b nice if he could do a 1 off race for Vauxhall again, say last race of the season, Triple 8 and Vauxhall give him a car so he can have a 1 off race in the new spec Touring Cars. That would b nice to c!

**touringlegend** · 30 Dec 2002, 00:43 (Ref:459857)

Quote:

Originally posted by speedy king
Selling Volvos?

He owns a few Volvo dealerships in the Borders, has done for a while...

Carrie · 30 Dec 2002, 20:50 (Ref:460431)

Weren't the Volvo dealerships the family business. I was wondering if he still had those.
I won't bore you, I'm sure most people around here know what I think of Mr Cleland already

KA · 31 Dec 2002, 11:20 (Ref:460808)

Quote:

Originally posted by racer69

It also has to be remembered that his first championship win was luck more than anything else. How strong was class C in the 1989 BTCC? All he had to aim to do was win his class, while the likes of Rouse, Gravett and Harvey battled up front for race victories but really didn't have much hope of a title.

I can see totally where you're coming from re the 1989 championship win- the Astra was the dominant car in class C, which was weak enough in numbers that Vauxhall ran a third car at times to ensure enough starters for JC to be able to claim full points- but those were the rules current at the time, and the record books will always list him as winning two championships, whatever the circumstances.

However, I'd still regard Cleland as one of the all-time heroes in the BTCC- a brilliant aggressive racer (sometimes too much so), capable of taking on the best of the European stars who appeared in the BTCC, and never afraid to express an opinion off-track- in short a real entertainer.

If nothing else, he was guaranteed BTCC immortality for his part in probably one of the most famous incidents in BTCC history- the clash with Soper at Silverstone 1992- 'the man's an animal....'

daz90 · 31 Dec 2002, 18:05 (Ref:461095)

thanks fo all your replys this poll only has a few more days to run, thanks to all who have voted and who have veiwed the poll.

racer69 · 1 Jan 2003, 08:23 (Ref:461428)

Did Cleland do much Touring Cars prior to 1988 or '89, was he with Vauxhall, where did he race?

**Peter Mallett** · 1 Jan 2003, 09:04 (Ref:461448)

He did a lot of production saloon racing. I believe he also raced in Tuscans.

redshoes · 1 Jan 2003, 11:26 (Ref:461477)

Started in rallying and hillclimbing. Did 7 years of production saloons then three seasons in Thundersaloons (was champion in 1986 and 1988).

View Poll Results: is cleland a legend?
legend?	29	54.72%
truly great?	10	18.87%
good driver?	11	20.75%
lucky driver?	3	5.66%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 53. You may not vote on this poll

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