[Race] 2013 Singapore GP

[jsTrecu]

So Webber gets a 10 place penalty for the next race because Alonso carried him.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by jsTrecu

So Webber gets a 10 place penalty for the next race because Alonso carried him.

What? That's utterly ridiculous.

[Adam43]

Daft, I agree, but it wasn't just for that:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/24198278
It also explains why Alonso didn't get one.

[fourWheelDrift]

Originally Posted by bjohnsonsmith

What? That's utterly ridiculous.

When I saw that I knew there'd be tears, the days when you could get away with things like that are long gone. However I thought Alonso and Webber would get fined. It's not a sporting offence so it shouldn't be a sporting penalty and surely it's at least as much down to Alonso as Webber or maybe he has he been reprimanded too and the grid drop is becuase Webber has collected the set?

[Aysedasi]

Utter nonsense. The one bit of entertainment triggers a penalty.....

And no punishment for Vettel for that gruesome spangly helmet - there really is no justice.....

[bjohnsonsmith]

According to the stewards ruled Webber had broken article 30.9(b) of the sporting regulations because he "entered the track without the marshal's permission between the commencement of the formation lap and the time when the last car enters parc ferme."

What was he supposed to do stay in the car?

[jsTrecu]

Originally Posted by Adam43

Daft, I agree, but it wasn't just for that:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/24198278
It also explains why Alonso didn't get one.

Ah, thanks for that. A friend sent me a whatsapp message but did not have all the info about the issue.
Third reprimand for Webber this year, so he gets the penalty. Seems fair now.

[IceMan_PJN]

I can see where they're coming from, regarding the reprimands for Webber and Alonso, but I feel it's a bit of a shame. I didn't see video of the cars dodging Fernando's Ferrari, so all I saw was the shot of Alonso giving Webber a ride on his car, which I thought was a nice gesture. I thought, "Hey, look at this respect between fellow drivers and this good sportsmanship." I suppose Senna famously getting out of his car in Belgium in 1992 to aid another driver would have earned him a pile of reprimands for being a decent human being.

[Born Racer]

There's no point fining these extremely rich men, though.

[bjohnsonsmith]

Originally Posted by jsTrecu

Ah, thanks for that. A friend sent me a whatsapp message but did not have all the info about the issue.
Third reprimand for Webber this year, so he gets the penalty. Seems fair now.

I don't think it's fair, it's not as if he gained some unfair advantage and though what Webber did was against the sporting regulations, it wasn't unsporting in itself.

[Flat12-Aircool]

All I can say is Mr Brundle...please don't try and tell me who I can or cannot Boo.

[bjohnsonsmith]

I like what Vettel had to say about the crowd booing him,

"I think they are on a tour and wealthy enough to go to a lot of races they go around on a bus."

[Teretonga]

Originally Posted by Born Racer

There's no point fining these extremely rich men, though.

Actually there is.
A disciplinary penalty is not their to hurt a person. That would be unethical.
It is there to help modify the behaviour.
Disciplinary action is not there to be punitive, but corrective. A fine should be as large as necessary to encourage the person to change their behaviour. Any danger in stopping by the immobile car was Alonso's decision so be even handed about it. But they aren't so they make a punitive action that is directive against one party abut not the other.

The whole action is wrong judicially and in terms of fair play. That may be because some of the rule book is (an expletive). People may argue that if its a rule it should be enforced but that takes us into what things should be in the rule book and other things should not. You can write rules that deal with situations without being so rigid there is no common sense but that isn't the way current rules are being (increasingly so) written.

[bravo]

So who finished after Vettel? As soon as Seb crossed the line the director cut to shots of fireworks against the Singapore city backdrop. During the race any footage from the helicopters seemed to be mostly of highways, trees and buildings.

There was a motor race going on down there somewhere wasn't there?

[Born Racer]

Yeah, they went overboard on that stuff. I was annoyed about their doing it at the end (why do we always have to see the winner cross the line and so many seconds after it?) because I wasn't sure what had happened in that battle.

[ScotsBrutesFan]

Originally Posted by bravo

So who finished after Vettel? As soon as Seb crossed the line the director cut to shots of fireworks against the Singapore city backdrop. During the race any footage from the helicopters seemed to be mostly of highways, trees and buildings.

There was a motor race going on down there somewhere wasn't there?

Helicopter shots of Singapore are always going to be restricted for several very good reasons..
Safety night flying around skyscrapers
Allowing for the skyscrapers the helicopter was operating over an urban area so again safety restrictions
What parts of the circuit aren't between tall buildings are lined by trees and not to mention high bridges limiting the types of shots the helicopter would have been able to get anyway.

I do agree though, the cut away to fireworks for so long was unnecessary, we might even have caught on the main feed the reason for Alonso and Webber's reprimands.

[Razzzor]

Remember Mercedes telling Rosberg not to pass Hamilton after the last pit stop earlier in the year?

What happened to those orders this time? Hamilton was all over Rosberg for a couple laps trying to pass him while Rosberg was bottled behind Perez. Perhaps they're not doing orders now?

Re Webber penalty, that is pretty stupid to penalise him 10 grid spots. Didn't exactly gain any sporting advantage out of it. Only thing he gets is backstage cuddles from Alonso.

If you're to penalise for post race infractions, then let's penalise whoevers dumb decision it was to have the GP2 field do a sharp left hand turn when other cars while other cars (Leimer) are still having to go straight. Penalties aren't just for drivers.

[321Go]

A big fuss over nothing. Completely safe.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBByzQBCSXE

The others around Alonso were Kimi, Nico and Lewis. Mark obviously has enough trust in their ability. The FIA obviously doesn't, and must think these four drivers are as bad as the pay drivers they let race in F1. At least Mark waited for the only driver who'd want to run him over to pass first, then go onto the track.

[davyboy]

Originally Posted by Flat12-Aircool

All I can say is Mr Brundle...please don't try and tell me who I can or cannot Boo.

Were you one of the people in that crowd booing Vettel ?

[JamesH]

Originally Posted by 321Go

A big fuss over nothing. Completely safe.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBByzQBCSXE

The others around Alonso were Kimi, Nico and Lewis. Mark obviously has enough trust in their ability. The FIA obviously doesn't, and must think these four drivers are as bad as the pay drivers they let race in F1. At least Mark waited for the only driver who'd want to run him over to pass first, then go onto the track.

Are the Pay drivers in F1 bad? Given they all need a superlicence, all drive cars at 200mph mostly without crashing in to things, and all have a lot of experience (not necessarily in F1), I hardly think they could be called 'bad'.

[321Go]

Originally Posted by JamesH

I hardly think they could be called 'bad'.

You are absolutely correct. The pay drivers are not "bad" drivers. They are a much better driver than me. And have more money than me.

[321Go]

Here's a trick question, if Vettel had happen to do Mark and hail down a taxi ride back to the pits, do you think anyone would stop for him?

[321Go]

More footage of Mark running onto the track...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpesYL9iNRs

[Flat12-Aircool]

Originally Posted by davyboy

Were you one of the people in that crowd booing Vettel ?

No, but if I was there as a paying spectator I reserve the right to cheer or boo whichever sports person I choose.

There are plenty examples of Sports people who have dominated their respective sports for a number of years, but who still manage to keep the crowds on their side by not having an arrogant attitude. Which also involves a bit of respect for their fellow competitors and not giving duplicitous apology's.

You reap what you sow.

[321Go]

Here's a photo of the race steward who reprimanded Webber. He looks much more comfortable than Webber did.