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Old 4 Mar 2010, 05:58 (Ref:2644588)   #1
Phillip rallycross
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South African Group B History 1983 to 1988

Hi everyone

Well, as everyone knows, the Old Group B cars came and went with a bang, but here in South Africa we were lucky

The rules was only changed after 1988.

As in my previous thread, Audi used motorsport to build a brand performance

What this meant in 1983 Audi shipped over the first AUdi Quatro

but before i junp to quickly

the rules was different here.

The capacity was the same,but there was no minumum 200 units to be built as in the rest of the worl

This made a lot one of specials,where even Toyota build a Toyota Conquest,Mid-engined turbo 4x4 in the same vain as the Peugot 205 and lancia

Here is some pics to wet your appetit

Please note the blue Audi Short wheelbase,with MG Metro 64R type wings

Was further developed[/QUOTE]
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Last edited by Phillip rallycross; 4 Mar 2010 at 06:00. Reason: I want my text to look profesional.
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Old 4 Mar 2010, 10:10 (Ref:2644696)   #2
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Hi Phillip -I know very little about the South African rally scene at that time- Sarel van der Merwe comes to mind as one of the regular Audi drivers, and IIRC, quite a few European drivers visited to drive locally-prepared cars in major events- Tony Pond was a regular visitor, driving either Nissans or Toyotas from memory?

I'm a little curious about the swb Quattro Sport- When I first saw the pic, I assumed they'd used the rear wing from the Evolution version of the car, as used in the WRC,
http://www.groupbrally.com/images/audi/audi_sports1.jpg
but looking more closely, it appears to be a different, if similar, wing. I'm surprised the team went to the trouble of designing a different wing when an existing kit was presumably available from Audi- unless it was difficult to get the Evo bodykit from Ingolstadt?

The other thing that comes to mind, is the Ford Escort RS1700T, Ford's original 2wd Group B project, abandoned in favour of the RS200 when it became clear that 4wd would be needed to win in the WRC.
http://www.pistonheads.com/pics/news...00T_1982-L.jpg
Didn't the Escorts (or at least some of them- from memory, there were supposedly a lot of prototypes built- maybe a dozen or more?) end up in South Africa, and were rallied there for a while?
http://images.forum-auto.com/mesimag...84/escort3.jpg
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Old 4 Mar 2010, 10:33 (Ref:2644712)   #3
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Originally Posted by KA View Post
Hi Phillip -I know very little about the South African rally scene at that time- Sarel van der Merwe comes to mind as one of the regular Audi drivers, and IIRC, quite a few European drivers visited to drive locally-prepared cars in major events- Tony Pond was a regular visitor, driving either Nissans or Toyotas from memory?

I'm a little curious about the swb Quattro Sport- When I first saw the pic, I assumed they'd used the rear wing from the Evolution version of the car, as used in the WRC,
http://www.groupbrally.com/images/audi/audi_sports1.jpg
but looking more closely, it appears to be a different, if similar, wing. I'm surprised the team went to the trouble of designing a different wing when an existing kit was presumably available from Audi- unless it was difficult to get the Evo bodykit from Ingolstadt?

The other thing that comes to mind, is the Ford Escort RS1700T, Ford's original 2wd Group B project, abandoned in favour of the RS200 when it became clear that 4wd would be needed to win in the WRC.
http://www.pistonheads.com/pics/news...00T_1982-L.jpg
Didn't the Escorts (or at least some of them- from memory, there were supposedly a lot of prototypes built- maybe a dozen or more?) end up in South Africa, and were rallied there for a while?
http://images.forum-auto.com/mesimag...84/escort3.jpg

Hi KA

I actually wanted to go year by year from tomorow

But lets start

Yes,the RS1800t did come here,it was the first car,to beat the Audi team in 1985 in a straight fight. Unfortanatly the year after,they pulled out,and the car was run for privateers,like buy a ride. There was strong rumours that the ford RS2000 Group B would have ended here,if it wasnt for the pull out

The SWB audi was run in 1986 by the factory team,but coudnt tame its handling,and lost the title to a Nissan Skyline

So in 1987-1988 it went to a privateer team,lindsay saker Motorsport.

They had a bit of assistence from audi,but tried to do all the development themself,hence the weird aero development.

They also kept blowing head gaskets,with too much boost.

The S1 came here in 1987,but will tomorow tell its story

Tony pond piloted Nissan in rally and Toyota in the big rally bakkie.
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Old 4 Mar 2010, 13:50 (Ref:2644823)   #4
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And then there was the Opel Kadett 400 of the 'great' Tony Pond as well...



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Old 5 Mar 2010, 06:21 (Ref:2645294)   #5
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And then there was the Opel Kadett 400 of the 'great' Tony Pond as well...




Hi MG


thanks for pics


What year was this Opel?
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Old 5 Mar 2010, 06:58 (Ref:2645304)   #6
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'83 or'84? A couple of those ended up in the UK; Murray Grierson ran one for a few years in the 80s, and one turned up in circuit racing too.
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Old 5 Mar 2010, 07:22 (Ref:2645307)   #7
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Opel Kadett 400 driven by Tony Pond/Richard Leeke on the Nissan Rally in Cape Town, April 1984

History of the Kadett 400

The Opel Kadett was a rear-wheel drive version of the GT/E that underwent testing and rallying in South Africa where events are open to non-homologated cars. The first car, one of three that was built in Germany before being taken to pieces and air freighted to South Africa in March 1984, was part of a project that was schrouded in secrecy.

The car itself utilised the normally aspirated 2400 cc engine, gearbox, suspension, axle and transmission from the Manta 400, but differed in looks in that it did not have a boot. Weighing in at just over 1000 kgs, it was also a little lighter than the Manta despite still having steel doors and panels. Its aerodynamic devices included a tongue that protruded from the front spoiler and a lip that was attached to the top of the hatch.

At the time of its first appearance in South Africa, it was speculated that the car could be a basis for a future four-wheel drive challenger, although the engine might change.

In Tony Pond's hands, the Kadett 400 showed its handling potential in the Nissan Rally, although the car seemed slightly top-heavy and the car lifted its front wheels rather easily. Pond was able to maintain second place behind van der Merwe's Audi Quattro and even set three fastest times out of the nine stages he completed, but retired on the tenth stage after the oil pump drive failed.


Here are a couple of links for you Phillip, after just searching for 'Opel Kadett 400' on Google - I hope European languages is a forte of yours...

http://www.der-gte.de/kadett%20ralley%201.htm

http://www.manta400.nl/kadett_400.htm
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Old 5 Mar 2010, 07:38 (Ref:2645312)   #8
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Hi MG


Well


English my second language, speak it everyday at work,just sometimes my spelllings lets me horriblely down

Im afrikaans,close to netherlans and flaams

But back to the cars

here is 2 videos you will like
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHY49KEq9HA

1983 rally and

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkwVNGzFGlk
1987


i got all ingo from basically 1985,before that im still hunting for,but never knew about the opel, even tho i got a video of it,and the oke said its from South africa, i thought he was confused,lol
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Old 5 Mar 2010, 08:37 (Ref:2645332)   #9
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Hi guys

Okay,another car

The Nissan Skyline 4x4

With a 3Lt Turbo Nissan

Okay,i know what you guys are thinking

Its to big and long to take on the Audi S1 Quatro

Well,the thing is,it did beat the Audi in 1 rally on pure speed,and a lot of stage wins

The thing is,here in Africa,the stages is long and straight,favouring the Stronger cars against the less powerfull but more nimble Toyota conquest 4x4 Turbo and even the AUdi S1
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Old 1 Aug 2010, 09:38 (Ref:2737059)   #10
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That are some great stories and photo's you've got there!

I did not know much about the African rally scene but it's keeps surprising me
A couple of friends of mine recently brought a couple of Opel Ascona's 400 back from Kenia,all former Works cars

Amazing to see that these cars lived on and were driven for many years over there.

Does any of the group B's you posted still exist?

Greetings

Gerard
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Old 12 Dec 2010, 21:35 (Ref:2803483)   #11
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Ooh I like this thread
I helped put together an article for Irish Pacenotes Magazine a good few years ago on the Opel Kadett 400

Opel in Russelheim built 3 cars and shipped them in containers to SA.
One car was the one you see above, the other was a spare car and the third car was a spare shells with the parts used for the first two.
The spare car burnt out apparently.

Malcolm Wilson of M-Sport or Malcolm Wilson Motorsport as he was known then bought the Pond car and the spare shell with a vast amount of spares including wheels / tyres, suspension of all different rates of spring.
Propshafts and anything else he could ship to the UK.

Scottish driver Murray Grierson had an ex Vatanen MK2 and wanted a GM product for the bonus money they offered, so he went to Malcolm's place which he thought he was going to see a Kadett GT-E Coupe car and not what we call the MK1 Astra / Kadett shape
He bought that along with the spares and used the car to good use over the years. he sold that on in the late 90's and I think its now in Holland being restored.

The bare shell Malcolm had was bought by another Scottish driver called Bernie Rooney and he re shelled his Ascona 400 into the Kadett shell and used the reg number from a scrap car he seen in a scrap yard.
That car was used in Thundersaloon by Billy McMillan then converted back to Rally spec and bought by Michael Black in Ireland. Roy Haslett bought it there after with a view to putting in Manta 400 engine, but I hear its been sold on again.

Hope this helps
I am going to make the Kadett 400 as a model as its a car I have always liked and only ever seen those pics I have too above and no video or other competing photos.
The RS1700T was bought by Simon Nutter of Kendal in Cumbria in the late 80's before being sold to a German Collector and its been sold again and come back to the UK.
Brian Bell bought a road car in the 80's to build as a rally car but when he seen it he kept it as a road car.
Malcolm Wilson now owns the Blue one in his museum
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