Official: Mass damper banned (MERGED)

Marbot · 23 Aug 2006, 13:51 (Ref:1689624)

They're banned,mid season as well. http://www.fia.com/mediacentre/Press...230806-02.html

luke · 23 Aug 2006, 14:01 (Ref:1689630)

The winners of the 2006 championship:

Scuderia FIA Marlboro Ferrari

Knowlesy · 23 Aug 2006, 14:40 (Ref:1689655)

A real shame that they couldn't just let it go and then ban it in the off season.

A real shame.

pole2pole · 23 Aug 2006, 14:49 (Ref:1689663)

Yet again this could be another championship decided in court rather than the track.

ensign14 · 23 Aug 2006, 14:53 (Ref:1689665)

One of the FIA Court of Appeal was Anthony Scrivener QC. I have confidence that he would not have been susceptible to influence from the FIA, Ferrari or anyone. A very sharp legal mind.

RT · 23 Aug 2006, 15:10 (Ref:1689684)

Quote:

Originally Posted by luke

The winners of the 2006 championship:

Scuderia FIA Marlboro Ferrari

Based on the last few races, I totally agree with Luke. I'd like to know more about the "mass damper" technical and performance-related aspects. The forum has a lot of technical expertise. I hope to hear more from our "technocrats" on the issue.

The damper appears to have given the Renault cars an "unfair " advantage. The question is if it was also truly illegal........

Cheers,

RT

SALEEN S7R · 23 Aug 2006, 15:17 (Ref:1689688)

For my money this is the right decision, Renault flew a little bit too close to the wind and now they are paying the price. Cant really knock the FIA for enforcing the rules, Renault arent the only top team to have been penalised this year lets not forget. Anyone remember the conraversial Ferrari rear wing?

Inigo Montoya · 23 Aug 2006, 15:19 (Ref:1689691)

They must have had their reasons, as ensign as pointed out, this is a totally impartial body. I agree its sad, but if its illegal, its illegal.

MikeBz · 23 Aug 2006, 15:22 (Ref:1689697)

The hotbed of motorsport competition and technology has resulted in an ingenius, non-polluting, unpowered device which could be beneficial in other automotive arenas. So it's banned

OK, I guess if it really does contravene the current wording of the rule then it simply isn't legal, but if so the rule is an ass and should be addressed (for next season...).

Mike

Knowlesy · 23 Aug 2006, 15:22 (Ref:1689698)

But it wasn't illegal for a long time. And this is what really grates with a lot of people I guess.

Time and again this happens, but I guess it will continue to do so.

newoutsider · 23 Aug 2006, 15:50 (Ref:1689718)

Quote:

Originally Posted by ensign14

One of the FIA Court of Appeal was Anthony Scrivener QC. I have confidence that he would not have been susceptible to influence from the FIA, Ferrari or anyone. A very sharp legal mind.

He may be independent, he may be a legal wiz - but does he have any technical know-how? I somehow doubt it. And if not, he will have based his decision on the legal argument, not the technical or sporting merit.

With due respect to all concerned its a poor decision IMHO

maltafan · 23 Aug 2006, 15:57 (Ref:1689725)

Will they remove Renault's 2005 championship, since Mass dumpers have been found to be illegal now?

Knowlesy · 23 Aug 2006, 15:57 (Ref:1689729)

No chance, as they were legal up until today.

Kempi · 23 Aug 2006, 15:59 (Ref:1689733)

Quote:

but does he have any technical know-how? I somehow doubt it. And if not, he will have based his decision on the legal argument, not the technical or sporting merit.

And that is exactly what judges do: They have experts who tell them what the stuff does and the judge then reads what the law says and decides on wether the description of the device fits the law or does not.

A judge does not need how to murder a person to find a murderer guilty.

maltafan · 23 Aug 2006, 16:00 (Ref:1689737)

Quote:

Originally Posted by knowlesy

No chance, as they were legal up until today.

I do not think they were illegal up till today, because they would have used them in Hungary if they were allowed till today.

newoutsider · 23 Aug 2006, 16:02 (Ref:1689739)

I have a personal difficulty with the concept of legal 'experts' making decisions on matters they don't understand. But as you say, that's what they do.

Knowlesy · 23 Aug 2006, 16:04 (Ref:1689738)

They could have used them under appeal in Germany and Hungary, but the FIA would have the power to remove their results as they have now been deemed illegal.

Marbot · 23 Aug 2006, 16:05 (Ref:1689743)

Quote:

Originally Posted by maltafan

I do not think they were illegal up till today, because they would have used them in Hungary if they were allowed till today.

If they'd have used them in Hungary when originally told that they were illegal prior to that race,any team doing so would run the risk of penalties.

pole2pole · 23 Aug 2006, 16:15 (Ref:1689754)

Quote:

Originally Posted by knowlesy

But it wasn't illegal for a long time. And this is what really grates with a lot of people I guess.

Time and again this happens, but I guess it will continue to do so.

100% right. This is what i don't understand. Why did they decide to ban it now and not when renault started using the system which i think was in brazil last season

Schummy · 23 Aug 2006, 16:15 (Ref:1689755)

I don't know if FIA pays or name Court of Appeal's members. If so, I don't necessarily believe in their independence.

What I positively believe is this mid-season ban is disappointing. FIA was aware of this device from the start of the season, and many teams copied it. I don't understand the urgency of this change of mind before the end of the season. If a team develops a car using a certain device, banning it unexpectly damage its perfomance.

I'm sorry, but just now I think this affair is a comedy. Or worse.

For a change, I would want Alonso wins this WDC otherwise I'll have doubts about the outcome.

pole2pole · 23 Aug 2006, 16:35 (Ref:1689782)

I wish it was the racing in formula one which was unpredictable not the decisions made by the FIA

Rex Judicata · 23 Aug 2006, 17:11 (Ref:1689807)

Quote:

Originally Posted by pole2pole

I wish it was the racing in formula one which was unpredictable not the decisions made by the FIA

At least Renault was able to use the mass dampers for more than a season, and were able to recover some of the development costs. Brabham was not so luck with it's fan-car. That was outlawed after only one race. I can only imagine following it on a course like Zandvort!

Pingguest · 23 Aug 2006, 17:48 (Ref:1689834)

Quote:

Originally Posted by pole2pole

Yet again this could be another championship decided in court rather than the track.

We might expect this to happen more times in the future.

Pingguest · 23 Aug 2006, 18:01 (Ref:1689846)

The interesting fact is that the FIA actually banned any sort of springs.

M Coupe · 23 Aug 2006, 18:07 (Ref:1689851)

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeBz

The hotbed of motorsport competition and technology has resulted in an ingenius, non-polluting, unpowered device which could be beneficial in other automotive arenas. So it's banned

Have a look under most new cars and you will find mass dampers, the road cars were there first.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rex Judicata

Brabham was not so luck with it's fan-car. That was outlawed after only one race. I can only imagine following it on a course like Zandvort!

It wasn't banned.

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