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Old 20 Dec 2017, 12:39 (Ref:3788332)   #91
Woolley
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Surely the correct method of measurement is whatever it is defined as in the regulations which apply to that particular meeting, venue or series. People can offer alternatives but if the judge of fact measures it in a defined method then it's the same for all.

In other words, 'thank you for your input, but we do it like this'. End of discussion.
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Old 20 Dec 2017, 20:33 (Ref:3788412)   #92
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Problem is Penske has shown their (questionable) data, which has seeded doubt amongst some. This could have potentially been mitigated by the release of data from Supercars itself.

The perception amongst some seems to be coverup - yesterdays release only strengthed that spurious argument.
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Old 20 Dec 2017, 20:47 (Ref:3788415)   #93
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Problem is Penske has shown their (questionable) data, which has seeded doubt amongst some. This could have potentially been mitigated by the release of data from Supercars itself.

The perception amongst some seems to be coverup - yesterdays release only strengthed that spurious argument.
Im struggling with what data is expected. Are you able to define what you mean when you say this.

As far as i can see there is only one bit of data that can be given. the speed over the distance. ie 43kmh (or whatever speed it is)
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Old 20 Dec 2017, 22:38 (Ref:3788426)   #94
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Sorry I don't mean data in the sense that you or I would recognise, more something that the viewers could identify with. That's where I believe Penske did so well - presentation. They had pretty pictures with speed overlayed etc and it seemed to be effective in swaying people. I don't like to say it, but maybe the message needs to be dumbed down ala Penskes pretty pictures presentation to really penetrate viewerland.
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Old 20 Dec 2017, 22:47 (Ref:3788427)   #95
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Sorry I don't mean data in the sense that you or I would recognise, more something that the viewers could identify with. That's where I believe Penske did so well - presentation. They had pretty pictures with speed overlayed etc and it seemed to be effective in swaying people. I don't like to say it, but maybe the message needs to be dumbed down ala Penskes pretty pictures presentation to really penetrate viewerland.
ok. I think ist pretty hard to show a number ona computer screen in any special way because thats all a timing loop data is

I guess we could jazz it up to look like this, but thats all there is (i used shell colours )


43 km/h
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Old 22 Dec 2017, 21:02 (Ref:3788765)   #96
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Originally Posted by Compromised View Post
Sorry I don't mean data in the sense that you or I would recognise, more something that the viewers could identify with. That's where I believe Penske did so well - presentation. They had pretty pictures with speed overlayed etc and it seemed to be effective in swaying people. I don't like to say it, but maybe the message needs to be dumbed down ala Penskes pretty pictures presentation to really penetrate viewerland.
Sorry, what data beyond the razzle dazzle F1 style, uber tech, ten times better than perfect puffed up PR statement have they released?
Would have thought it's easy enough for V8SC to publish the time taken to cover the 5m.... and if you're system is that accurate, what is the use of the leeway Baird spoke of?
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Old 22 Dec 2017, 22:28 (Ref:3788776)   #97
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What are the known variables in the whole system?
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Old 22 Dec 2017, 22:50 (Ref:3788780)   #98
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Sorry, what data beyond the razzle dazzle F1 style, uber tech, ten times better than perfect puffed up PR statement have they released?
Would have thought it's easy enough for V8SC to publish the time taken to cover the 5m.... and if you're system is that accurate, what is the use of the leeway Baird spoke of?
I would have thought that if someone really needed the data they would know exactly how long its takes for a car travelling 40 km/h to travel 5 meters.

If they dont know that, really the data is wasted.

If it also helps, if you are calling into doubt the time travelled over the timing loop, you are also calling into doubt if Scott got all those pole positions legitimately, and especially the accuracy of those 1000th of a second they use to separate the cars
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Old 23 Dec 2017, 01:28 (Ref:3788793)   #99
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I would have thought that if someone really needed the data they would know exactly how long its takes for a car travelling 40 km/h to travel 5 meters.

If they dont know that, really the data is wasted.

If it also helps, if you are calling into doubt the time travelled over the timing loop, you are also calling into doubt if Scott got all those pole positions legitimately, and especially the accuracy of those 1000th of a second they use to separate the cars
I'm not sure what your first point is.... but pretty easy to explain that the magic number is 0.45s and Scott travelled the distance in X. Given how much V8SC have to lose (which is somewhat highlighted in your second point) it's interesting that all they've presented in public is hyperbole..... perhaps presenting the data raises that's less about the infalable technology and more about the human adjudication of a 'tolerance'.... especially given that apparent lack of need for it.
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Old 23 Dec 2017, 03:37 (Ref:3788797)   #100
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I'm not sure what your first point is.... but pretty easy to explain that the magic number is 0.45s and Scott travelled the distance in X. Given how much V8SC have to lose (which is somewhat highlighted in your second point) it's interesting that all they've presented in public is hyperbole..... perhaps presenting the data raises that's less about the infalable technology and more about the human adjudication of a 'tolerance'.... especially given that apparent lack of need for it.
so all you are really saying is you want to know what speed they were doing?
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Old 23 Dec 2017, 19:37 (Ref:3788885)   #101
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so all you are really saying is you want to know what speed they were doing?
No, I'm saying I'm surprised they haven't released what they measured..... especially considering the timing system is potentially being called into question.

As for 'speed they were doing' that's not measured, so there's no point asking for it. Average speed is derived from the time taken to transit 5m, the penalty derived from the assumption that an average speed above the limit means peak speed had to be above..... a small but important difference, given it's absolutely possible for a car entering pit lane at 60km/h to not be penalised, where a car enter ring the lane at 45km/h is..... but that's an issue for another day.

For removal of doubt, what I'm saying is: DJR with the presentation of their data has likely raised a fair amount of doubt in Average Joe Punters mind. To me it's surprising that the official response in public has been more deflect and obfuscate than what you'd expect from an organisation with absolute faith in their data..... why wouldn't they publish every transit time from the race? As you've alluded to, it's hard to argue against the system that gave you pole....
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Old 26 Dec 2017, 08:23 (Ref:3789165)   #102
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Lock her up, close the thread.

This has been done and dusted
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Old 26 Dec 2017, 18:32 (Ref:3789223)   #103
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says who?
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Old 27 Dec 2017, 00:35 (Ref:3789247)   #104
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Says everyone not hung up on an event that happened a month ago.
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Old 27 Dec 2017, 12:07 (Ref:3789312)   #105
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Says everyone not hung up on an event that happened a month ago.
Exactly,

Flogging a dead horse

he said she said

shoulda coulda woulda
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