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Old 17 Nov 2008, 11:23 (Ref:2336332)   #51
agosling
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agosling should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I think if anything having A1 there next year will have a negative impact on the event, the would have been far better off turning into a Clipsal on the Gold Coast, bought in the Fujitsu's, the Ute's etc. Very few people cared about the Indy Cars and fewer still will even know the an A1 GP car even is.

The V8's are what draws the motor racing crowd to the Gold Coast, the party is what draws the rest.
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Old 17 Nov 2008, 11:24 (Ref:2336334)   #52
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fomoco should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridfomoco should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Originally Posted by lookleft
On a positive note, we will finally get to see if Cochrane was right and all the spectators were there for the V8s. If so there will be no negative impact on the numbers next year.

He is 4 down already, I'm not paying to go to a track that has limited viewing to watch A1GP. Very disappointing, the prospect of seeing Penske, NHL, Ganassi, TA, AGR and other properly run teams go at it next year was a glimmer of the past - guess we will never know.
Ah the black wiggle, you would be suprised at how many people actually came to watch the open wheelers compared to Uncle Tony's rants. Suprisingly, not all the crowd were there for holden or ford. Tc's rants always lead to the belief, that with out V8SC's Australian motor sport would turn up it's toes and die a slow death.
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Old 17 Nov 2008, 12:13 (Ref:2336356)   #53
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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Originally Posted by agosling
I think if anything having A1 there next year will have a negative impact on the event, the would have been far better off turning into a Clipsal on the Gold Coast, bought in the Fujitsu's, the Ute's etc.
To be honest, that is the last thing the event needs. As Bartercard said, you see that (your proposed line up) at Queensland Raceway, Indycars/ChampCars it what made the event special.
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Old 17 Nov 2008, 12:35 (Ref:2336363)   #54
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alfacors should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridalfacors should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I wouldn't mind seeing the GC300 turn into a more international event.
Half the spectators wouldn't know the difference between a ChampCar or IRL car anyway. Fewer would care. They are there for a good time, to watch some racing and to party. A1 has the potential to bring in a lot of international visitors to the Gold Coast. End of the day, who cares where they came from, as long as it's a party?
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Old 20 Nov 2008, 11:20 (Ref:2338248)   #55
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Does anyone go to Indy to watch the racing? unless you are in a grandstand how much of the track can you see anyway? not a lot i bet.

A1GP at GoldCoast wont change the scene... not many trackside punters know any of the Indy drivers anyway. Hasnt the driver for the Aussie A1GP team changed a thousssandd times since it started as well?

Indy = Beer, Boobs and a big party!
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Old 20 Nov 2008, 12:37 (Ref:2338281)   #56
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alfacors should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridalfacors should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
My first year up there this year and plenty of spectators lining the fences to watch both the V8s and Indycars charging around..... plenty of partying too
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Old 20 Nov 2008, 23:43 (Ref:2338589)   #57
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Oldtony should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridOldtony should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridOldtony should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridOldtony should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Yes Surfers isabout party. Yes it does have limited viewing. But other than a few parts of the Adelaide circuit there is nowhere else in Australia that the crowd can get so close to the action and be involved in the excitement.
As for the Black Wiggle, sorry Tony, the Taxis will always be the support act.
GT, the Aussie racers and a Group N historic would keep the crowds just as happy as your circus.
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Old 22 Nov 2008, 06:53 (Ref:2339352)   #58
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Originally Posted by Peddler
Hasnt the driver for the Aussie A1GP team changed a thousssandd times since it started as well?
To be honest it hasn't changed for a while. It went from Will Power, to Christian Jones, to someone else (Karl Reindler I think), to Marcus Marshall, Will Davison I think had a steer at some stage, Ian Dyk was next and John Martin has almost lasted a calendar year.


Well according to this week's AA, the V8's might not be there at all. Look at article about page 3.
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Old 22 Nov 2008, 12:45 (Ref:2339506)   #59
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Seems abit of attention seeking from V8SA and AA has bit, how surprising

Is there any substance as to why Cochrane doesnt want to run with A1 GP?

If V8s leave, there are plenty to fill their place.
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Old 22 Nov 2008, 20:55 (Ref:2339735)   #60
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peckstar has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
according to vmag. TC is happy to run with A1

the deal has now be signed
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Old 24 Nov 2008, 06:52 (Ref:2340541)   #61
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according to vmag. TC is happy to run with A1

the deal has now be signed
just as we all knew it would be.
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Old 24 Nov 2008, 10:07 (Ref:2340633)   #62
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Would be interesting to see if AA had a quote of TC's "never running alongside A1" remark.

If so, such a backflip as reported by Peckstar must be a sobering reminder of how little influence he has with Gold Coast organisers.
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Old 24 Nov 2008, 10:12 (Ref:2340637)   #63
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peckstar has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
actually when your arguing a case its fair to say you should give the quote and the source

i think your just making it up or possibly misquoting.

its probably more likely he said , we will never run alongside A1 at Eastern creek

Last edited by peckstar; 24 Nov 2008 at 10:17.
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Old 24 Nov 2008, 11:27 (Ref:2340676)   #64
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
As was evident from the original post, AA cited as the source.

If your having crisis of confidence i would check the magazine.
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Old 24 Nov 2008, 22:45 (Ref:2341085)   #65
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Originally Posted by D.R.T.
If so, such a backflip as reported by Peckstar must be a sobering reminder of how little influence he has with Gold Coast organisers.
T.C has little influence???
  • The v8's set to be upgraded to the Main Pit Building
  • To have a 200K race with Fuel and Tyre stops Sat and Sunday
  • We will see some changes to the track itself to better suit the Supercars
  • And if the voices in my head are right...A1 cannot be used in the title of the "Event"

D.oesnt.R.ate.T.ony seems to be poorly informed again about the real state of play in Australian Motorsport.

I would hate to see what T.C could achieve if he had any real influence...
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Old 24 Nov 2008, 23:05 (Ref:2341104)   #66
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mac should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridmac should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridmac should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Of course Cochrane has influence. He threw a tantrum about the IndyCars and the way the V8s were "treated", and subsequently got his way.
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Old 24 Nov 2008, 23:26 (Ref:2341116)   #67
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Originally Posted by mac
Of course Cochrane has influence. He threw a tantrum about the IndyCars and the way the V8s were "treated", and subsequently got his way.
Tantrum must be a trendy way of saying "strongly negotiated" mac??

Let’s be clear of one fact, the Indy race was dying until an Aussie (David Besnard) was put into a car by WPS and C. Gore. Even in that year (2004) the crowds still only rushed to the fence when the Supercars were on track. Over the next 4 years Team Australia/WPS/Aussie Vineyards/Craig Gore worked their butts off spent a fortune supporting and promoting Champ/Indy chasing an Aussie victory on home turf.

That alone built interest in the Champcars and got the punters to the fences to watch, not because of the formula.

Back in 04 hardly any of the cars had sponsorship on them and Champcar would probably have folded and joined Tony George’s mob year’s earlier if had not been for Gores involvement.

Whether A1 is successful or not remains to be seen but you can be certain of the fact the V8Supercars house is always No1 priority in TC’s view and so it should be with any good business.
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Old 25 Nov 2008, 00:04 (Ref:2341133)   #68
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Originally Posted by bazil
Let’s be clear of one fact, the Indy race was dying until an Aussie (David Besnard) was put into a car by WPS and C. Gore. Even in that year (2004) the crowds still only rushed to the fence when the Supercars were on track. Over the next 4 years Team Australia/WPS/Aussie Vineyards/Craig Gore worked their butts off spent a fortune supporting and promoting Champ/Indy chasing an Aussie victory on home turf.

That alone built interest in the Champcars and got the punters to the fences to watch, not because of the formula.
How satisfying must it have been for Craig Gore to see a driver he burned become the first Aussie to win there...

You don't have to convince me of the importance of Craig Gore's input to any motorsport category at anytime in his history of doing so - I have been a staunch supporter of Gore's motorsport pursuits for many years. The way he went about things sometimes wasn't ideal, but his passion and his willingness to sink loads of cash into the sport I love is hugely admirable.

As for Champ Cars/ Indycars/ CART, well I remember some pretty big crowds lapping up Zanardi's donuts in the late 90s. They were also particularly interested in the Montoya/ Franchitti battles of 1999 and 2000. Things really hit hard around 2002 - when they hit hard for Champ Car everywhere (not just at Surfers). If, as you say, things began to pick up in 2004, that's only two years of lack of interest!

Frankly, this discussion is not about the past and any interest Gore's involvement obviously generated. It is about the now and the future. With the perilous state of Champ Cars in recent times, you can't tell me that Tony Cochrane was not a little nervous about the possible rise of a unified Indycar series... A series featuring big name drivers and teams, and successful Australian drivers that could ultimately take some of the V8's media profile at and authority over the event.

Far better to have a bunch of no-name drivers, in a relatively new series, that desperately needs a kick-along like the inclusion of a sexy new race. Mr Cochrane stands a far better chance of getting his own way in terms of the measures you outline in such a circumstance.

Call me cynical...

Quote:
Originally Posted by bazil
Back in 04 hardly any of the cars had sponsorship on them and Champcar would probably have folded and joined Tony George’s mob year’s earlier if had not been for Gores involvement.
I'm not quite sure how that works. It probably prevented Walker's operation from doing so, but I would have thought that the cash put up by the Kalkhovens, Forsythes and Gentilozzis of the world may have had a far greater input in keeping any other teams involved. Not sure that Newman Haas would have thought, "oh, Craig Gore is sponsoring Walker and calling it Team Australia, we might stick around."

Again, I'm not bagging Gore - I have huge respect for him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bazil
Whether A1 is successful or not remains to be seen but you can be certain of the fact the V8Supercars house is always No1 priority in TC’s view and so it should be with any good business.
And I don't have a problem with that. Anyone running any sporting code should have the interests of his series as absolutely paramount. I'm just disappointed that the Queensland Government and the Indy organisers seemed so willing to land on the side of Mr Cochrane in any negotiations despite the (in my opinion) better interests of the event.
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Old 25 Nov 2008, 00:57 (Ref:2341142)   #69
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by mac
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How satisfying must it have been for Craig Gore to see a driver he burned become the first Aussie to win there...
I have no doubt he was gutted to see Power crash out after pole and the lead of the race 3 years in a row. However, the fact remains that an Aussie ended up winning the race (which was his goal). Although for a different team, and in spite of the sarcasm, I am sure CG is very proud of the fact it happened.

Quote:
As for Champ Cars/ Indycars/ CART, well I remember some pretty big crowds lapping up Zanardi's donuts in the late 90s. They were also particularly interested in the Montoya/ Franchitti battles of 1999 and 2000. Things really hit hard around 2002 - when they hit hard for Champ Car everywhere (not just at Surfers). If, as you say, things began to pick up in 2004, that's only two years of lack of interest!
The Gold Coast Event was not what was struggling or what I was referring to, it was Champ Car and its series. It, like the IRL where both suffering sponsor loss and lack of crowds. NASCAR was smashing them both from a commercial perspective and a public interest position. Having been to many Gold Coast Indy events over the years, it was always a case of everyone to the fence when the Supercars were on and only when the Indy race was on did people really watch or be bothered with the Champcars until there was an Aussie involved.

Quote:
With the perilous state of Champ Cars in recent times, you can't tell me that Tony Cochrane was not a little nervous about the possible rise of a unified Indycar series... A series featuring big name drivers and teams, and successful Australian drivers that could ultimately take some of the V8's media profile at and authority over the event.
Why would he be?? Are suggesting that they would have been so popular that they would have asked Supercars to go away?? Come on mac, they can’t even pull a crowd in the US with the so-called big name drivers in the unified series. Many of whom (big-name Indy drivers) have gone to NASCAR and got their butts kicked, unlike our very own Supercar driver Marcos Ambrose, who is now in the Big Leagues of Nascar while stars like Franchitti, Carpentier and Villeneuve have struggled...


Quote:
I'm not quite sure how that works. It probably prevented Walker's operation from doing so, but I would have thought that the cash put up by the Kalkhovens, Forsythes and Gentilozzis of the world may have had a far greater input in keeping any other teams involved. Not sure that Newman Haas would have thought, "oh, Craig Gore is sponsoring Walker and calling it Team Australia, we might stick around."
I was only suggesting that it was a tipping point for some confidence returning to the class, that commercial support may come back. As for Newman-Haas they were close to going back over to George’s side many times as were several other teams. In the end they all had no choice but are still a long way from being the premier open wheel class after F1 they use to be.


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And I don't have a problem with that. Anyone running any sporting code should have the interests of his series as absolutely paramount. I'm just disappointed that the Queensland Government and the Indy organisers seemed so willing to land on the side of Mr Cochrane in any negotiations despite the (in my opinion) better interests of the event.
The fact remains that the Gold Coast Event was second only to the Indy 500 on their calendar as a spectacle and in team popularity and yet they chose (Tony George and team) to play hard ball about dates and cost. Tony George appears to care only about oval racing and more importantly to him, his track, Indianapolis. On the other hand V8 Supercars has been steadfast in its support to the QLD government and the Event and deserve what ever they negotiate.
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Old 25 Nov 2008, 01:16 (Ref:2341149)   #70
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Originally Posted by bazil
Why would he be?? Are suggesting that they would have been so popular that they would have asked Supercars to go away??
Please read my post again. The 2008 Indycar Series was a hastily thrown together series designed as the first step to re-build open-wheel racing. I never suggested that V8Supercars would go away. I merely suggested (I thought quite obviously) that Tony Cochrane might not welcome the possibility of the IRL growing into a thriving series and hogging more of the limelight and having more say about the way the event is run.

Cochrane has already achieved:

Quote:
Originally Posted by bazil
- The v8's set to be upgraded to the Main Pit Building
- To have a 200K race with Fuel and Tyre stops Sat and Sunday
- We will see some changes to the track itself to better suit the Supercars
- And if the voices in my head are right...A1 cannot be used in the title of the "Event"
Things he would never have been able to achieve had a stronger IRL returned.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bazil
Come on mac, they can’t even pull a crowd in the US with the so-called big name drivers in the unified series.
Remember the hastily cobbled together series? It is year one. If we were five years into the "merger", I'd happily admit this. Indycar has said from day one that this year was a building year, and they aren't too concerned with things like crowd numbers, as long as they build on it year after year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bazil
Many of whom (big-name Indy drivers) have gone to NASCAR and got their butts kicked, unlike our very own Supercar driver Marcos Ambrose, who is now in the Big Leagues of Nascar while stars like Franchitti, Carpentier and Villeneuve have struggled...
Not quite sure what this has to do with the topic - but many of those open-wheel types have been thrown into the Cup series in big teams and had big results demanded of them immediately. Unlike our Marcos, who has been given a very softly softly entry to NASCAR in comparison.

I would also argue about how much Carpentier has struggled - he's done very well in some road races.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bazil
On the other hand V8 Supercars has been steadfast in its support to the QLD government and the Event and deserve what ever they negotiate.
Ha ha! Yeah, Tony Cochrane has never held a gun to the organiser's head and threatened to walk away from the Gold Coast event... Pull the other one bazil.
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Old 25 Nov 2008, 01:59 (Ref:2341169)   #71
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Originally Posted by mac
Please read my post again. The 2008 Indycar Series was a hastily thrown together series designed as the first step to re-build open-wheel racing. I never suggested that V8Supercars would go away. I merely suggested (I thought quite obviously) that Tony Cochrane might not welcome the possibility of the IRL growing into a thriving series and hogging more of the limelight and having more say about the way the event is run.
Agreed, my mistake about you’re never suggesting the "go away" remark, but I don’t have the same confidence you have in the IRL growing into a thriving series again. Certainly not to its former glory and Tony G appears hell bent on getting his way, which appears to be with blinkers on. Maybe TC would not have got the changes he has now if Indy remained, but sooner or later he would have.




Quote:
Not quite sure what this has to do with the topic - but many of those open-wheel types have been thrown into the Cup series in big teams and had big results demanded of them immediately. Unlike our Marcos, who has been given a very softly softly entry to NASCAR in comparison.
In a weaker team compared to the Big names, I bet he would give his left one to race for Rousch, Hendricks or Joe Gibbs. As for being on topic, I just saw an opportunity to highlight the quality of our big name drivers compared to theirs.

Quote:
I would also argue about how much Carpentier has struggled - he's done very well in some road races.
Yes, but struggled on most ovals.


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Ha ha! Yeah, Tony Cochrane has never held a gun to the organiser's head and threatened to walk away from the Gold Coast event... Pull the other one bazil.
Do you have any photos (of the gun) to prove this mac?? If not then will have to put it down to good negotiating skills eh??
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Old 25 Nov 2008, 02:22 (Ref:2341173)   #72
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Originally Posted by bazil
Do you have any photos (of the gun) to prove this mac?? If not then will have to put it down to good negotiating skills eh??
Cochrane rather famously (I thought) threatened to walk when he was trying to get the V8 paddock moved up to the main area.

I find it hard to believe that this was the only time such a threat has been made in a period of over a decade on the Gold Coast...

Again, I must point out that I'm not bagging Tony Cochrane for doing everything he can in the interests of V8Supercars.
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Old 25 Nov 2008, 03:35 (Ref:2341191)   #73
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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Originally Posted by bazil
T.C has little influence???

The v8's set to be upgraded to the Main Pit Building

To have a 200K race with Fuel and Tyre stops Sat and Sunday

We will see some changes to the track itself to better suit the Supercars

And if the voices in my head are right...A1 cannot be used in the title of the "Event"
Pit buildings, race formats, ripple strips were not my thoughts when talking about influence, Baz. Be sure to pat him on the back for me the next time you see him.

Is there likely to even be change to the event name? I wouldnt think there needs to be, Indy 300 (or however many km's A1 GP will do over the weekend) is such a strong brand Australia and worldwide that it doesnt need to change.
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Old 25 Nov 2008, 06:43 (Ref:2341210)   #74
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sponsors queue to the left ...

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Originally Posted by D.R.T.

Is there likely to even be change to the event name? I wouldnt think there needs to be, Indy 300 (or however many km's A1 GP will do over the weekend) is such a strong brand Australia and worldwide that it doesnt need to change.
Compelling argument for a potential sponsor ... hardly !!

The 4-X 400 would have more appeal in certain circles, etc.
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Old 25 Nov 2008, 07:11 (Ref:2341226)   #75
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Originally Posted by D.R.T.
Is there likely to even be change to the event name? I wouldnt think there needs to be, Indy 300 (or however many km's A1 GP will do over the weekend) is such a strong brand Australia and worldwide that it doesnt need to change.
How about the "Nikon Gold Coast V8SC 400" with support features including world cup of motorsport cars and stuff...
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