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Old 10 Aug 2018, 17:01 (Ref:3842829)   #466
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Yes, totally fixed! I'm sure the 'Works' Cadillac will hate losing to a privateer non-works Cadillac! That's exactly the same as losing to a privateer non-works supported LMP2 customer chassis. There's absolutely no difference in those. The 'Works' team still loses.

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Old 10 Aug 2018, 17:15 (Ref:3842832)   #467
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Yup, because in no way to manufacturers ever take credit, or market customer teams winning! That'd be silly and we'd never see such a thing in motorsport. Feel free to fix this post and tell me that a Caddy isn't a Caddy! I'll be sure to let Cadillac know that if JDC wins, they must never ever celebrate it.

Anyway, back in the real world - so now we have DPi and the CORE Autosport Appreciation class, supported by PR1. Is it likely anyone else will turn up? Or is this it for the foreseeable future? Not sure the 36 Hours of Florida incentive program is worth having now, unfortunately.
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Old 10 Aug 2018, 18:20 (Ref:3842845)   #468
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Yup, because in no way to manufacturers ever take credit, or market customer teams winning! That'd be silly and we'd never see such a thing in motorsport. Feel free to fix this post and tell me that a Caddy isn't a Caddy! I'll be sure to let Cadillac know that if JDC wins, they must never ever celebrate it.

Anyway, back in the real world - so now we have DPi and the CORE Autosport Appreciation class, supported by PR1. Is it likely anyone else will turn up? Or is this it for the foreseeable future? Not sure the 36 Hours of Florida incentive program is worth having now, unfortunately.
I'm hoping jdc is able to sell their Orecas to someone. I have no idea who that may be, but to me that would be a good outcome. There was talk of the open wheel team Juncos looking at prototypes. If they have a paying customer or two from junior formula, it could work out.
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Old 10 Aug 2018, 18:43 (Ref:3842851)   #469
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I can see the points that are trying to be made. I doubt that Cadillac cares who wins as long as a Cadillac wins. Same with Joest and Champion when the ran Audi R8s, Audi Sport didn't care as long as an Audi won. And when Porsche dominated GT racing in the first half of the 2000s they didn't care that much if their favored team, be it Dick Barbour or AJR won or a true customer team. All they really cared about is that a Porsche won.

Same thing here, and it still gives Cadillac strength in numbers relative to the rest of the DPI field. That's unless Acura or Mazda sell customer cars, which Mazda has seemingly ruled out per Racer and Acura at least publicly doesn't have plans right now for customer cars.

I also agree to an extent that splitting a 12 or so car class into two 6-8 or so car classes doens't make a ton of sense, but the DPIs have been hamstrung, especially in terms of engine power, compared to initial performance levels. But as I've pointed out before, that was a device of IMSA's making by allowing development in what was intended to be a BOP class in an attempt to limit development, or at least discourage the spending of so much money and resources on it. Especially given that LMP2s were held to ACO specs and the ACO, outside of joker upgrades and basic car set up, doesn't allow any noteworthy changes during or between seasons currently.
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Old 10 Aug 2018, 18:53 (Ref:3842852)   #470
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I can see the points that are trying to be made. I doubt that Cadillac cares who wins as long as a Cadillac wins. Same with Joest and Champion when the ran Audi R8s, Audi Sport didn't care as long as an Audi won. And when Porsche dominated GT racing in the first half of the 2000s they didn't care that much if their favored team, be it Dick Barbour or AJR won or a true customer team. All they really cared about is that a Porsche won.

Same thing here, and it still gives Cadillac strength in numbers relative to the rest of the DPI field. That's unless Acura or Mazda sell customer cars, which Mazda has seemingly ruled out per Racer and Acura at least publicly doesn't have plans right now for customer cars.

I also agree to an extent that splitting a 12 or so car class into two 6-8 or so car classes doens't make a ton of sense, but the DPIs have been hamstrung, especially in terms of engine power, compared to initial performance levels. But as I've pointed out before, that was a device of IMSA's making by allowing development in what was intended to be a BOP class in an attempt to limit development, or at least discourage the spending of so much money and resources on it. Especially given that LMP2s were held to ACO specs and the ACO, outside of joker upgrades and basic car set up, doesn't allow any noteworthy changes during or between seasons currently.
Reminds me of the 2014 Petit Le Mans. The factory Porsche GT was working extra hard to fight off the Dodge Viper to protect the Falken Tire Porsche which was leading at the time. Falken did subsequently win GTLM at the 14 PLM.
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Old 10 Aug 2018, 19:01 (Ref:3842854)   #471
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Detroit has been confirmed on the schedule after provisionally being on board, as the area DRC and Indy Car have agreed to a three year extension on racing at Belle Isle.
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Old 10 Aug 2018, 19:48 (Ref:3842865)   #472
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Yup, because in no way to manufacturers ever take credit, or market customer teams winning! That'd be silly and we'd never see such a thing in motorsport. Feel free to fix this post and tell me that a Caddy isn't a Caddy! I'll be sure to let Cadillac know that if JDC wins, they must never ever celebrate it.

Anyway, back in the real world - so now we have DPi and the CORE Autosport Appreciation class, supported by PR1. Is it likely anyone else will turn up? Or is this it for the foreseeable future? Not sure the 36 Hours of Florida incentive program is worth having now, unfortunately.



https://racer.com/2018/08/10/esm-to-...vity-for-2019/


Yeah, and anybody who buys these, is a 'Works" team, as it is a DPi .....
















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Old 10 Aug 2018, 19:52 (Ref:3842867)   #473
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So is that ESM to LMP2? It doesn't say that. In fact, worryingly, it doesn't even make mention of next years plans at all. It's basically a classified ad to sell the cars.

Yeah, and anybody who thinks a Cadillac winning won't be celebrated or credited by Cadillac because they aren't a works team...

Edit: When is a Cadillac not a Cadillac? Whenever your post gets fixed for you!

Last edited by Akrapovic; 10 Aug 2018 at 19:57.
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Old 10 Aug 2018, 19:58 (Ref:3842868)   #474
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Detroit has been confirmed on the schedule after provisionally being on board, as the area DRC and Indy Car have agreed to a three year extension on racing at Belle Isle.
I think it's pretty awesome that the worst track on the calendar is Belle Isle...and it's still pretty awesome.
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Old 10 Aug 2018, 20:02 (Ref:3842870)   #475
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So is that ESM to LMP2? It doesn't say that. In fact, worryingly, it doesn't even make mention of next years plans at all. It's basically a classified ad to sell the cars.

Yeah, and anybody who thinks a Cadillac winning won't be celebrated or credited by Cadillac because they aren't a works team...

Edit: When is a Cadillac not a Cadillac? Whenever your post gets fixed for you!

Well repeatedly by your logic, anyone in a DPi is a 'Works' team and there is no such thing as a privateer .... !









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Old 10 Aug 2018, 20:04 (Ref:3842872)   #476
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Nope, and that isn't what MaskedRacer was meaning, which we all know. But cool, no problem
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Old 10 Aug 2018, 20:29 (Ref:3842881)   #477
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Nope, and that isn't what MaskedRacer was meaning, which we all know. But cool, no problem

Then what is it? Because Caddy would tout it as a Caddy win? Hell, everytime one of the 4 P2 costructors cars win they tout it too. What in the hell is the difference, other than it is DPi rather than P2 constructors? NOTHING! Check their twitter feeds.











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Old 10 Aug 2018, 20:38 (Ref:3842883)   #478
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Do I really need to explain why Cadillac would like a Cadillac JDC car to win over an ORECA JDC car? And why that's a good thing for Cadillac? I'm not sure how to actually word that, it's such a simple concept.

Next up: I'm going to explain why I prefer earning more money, rather than less!

Anyway, real discussion:

What are ESM Actually going to do? They aren't continuing with the Nissan and I can't imagine anyone taking those cars and paying the Nissan entry fee. There are a couple of ORECA chassis kicking about, so that's an option. Other than that, GTD? The RACER article has worryingly little detail.
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Old 10 Aug 2018, 20:47 (Ref:3842884)   #479
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Kinda missing what he's saying. He's saying Cadillac don't want beaten by privateer teams. If JDC are a Cadillac team, they are no longer a privateer team, are they?

Anyway, now we have the DPi class, and the CORE Autosport Class. Sounds almost as fun as when Rebellion and ByKolles got to run around on there own behind the big guys and everyone absolutely loved it! Wait, I think I miss-remembered that last bit.
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Do I really need to explain why Cadillac would like a Cadillac JDC car to win over an ORECA JDC car? And why that's a good thing for Cadillac? I'm not sure how to actually word that, it's such a simple concept.

Next up: I'm going to explain why I prefer earning more money, rather than less!

Anyway, real discussion:

What are ESM Actually going to do? They aren't continuing with the Nissan and I can't imagine anyone taking those cars and paying the Nissan entry fee. There are a couple of ORECA chassis kicking about, so that's an option. Other than that, GTD? The RACER article has worryingly little detail.

So which is it? The argument was, they would no longer be a PRIVATEER TEAM, in your own words! Or is it gonna change again?
















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Old 10 Aug 2018, 20:55 (Ref:3842885)   #480
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Ohhhhh. I see what you're getting at. Deliberately missing the point to try and look smart. Very good. Doesn't change what the intention was since we were discussing LMP2 v DPi, making the point kinda obvious, but we're going to ignore that because we need a chance to score some internet points! Awesome.

Anyway -

DPi -

Acura x2
Caddy x5
Mazda x2
Nissan x0 (unless a sale comes in).

LMP2
CORE x1
PR1 x1
PerfTech x1

Any likely expansions or is this what we're looking at next year? Any chance of the LMP2 teams expanding to a second car? We know United aren't returning, but could we see anyone else run Daytona?
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