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Old Yesterday, 08:47 (Ref:4074765)   #91
S griffin
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Great win by Turkington in R3, he really needed that. Great also to see Flash back up there after a difficult season

R3 seemed quite attritional. The top 8 was the same top 8 on the grid, but plenty of drama behind. Good to see Osbourne and Smelt in the mix, shame they couldn't hold on.
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Old Yesterday, 09:14 (Ref:4074771)   #92
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Originally Posted by BTCC frog View Post
Obviously. Build a super quick car for a rival team, and then they beat you with it
In all fairness, Team Dynamics have been massively unlucky this season.
It just seems like a 'troll-like' way to refer to Dynamics' results.

BTC have Cook in his third season with the car / team, and Proctor is in his fifth consecutive season in the series. If you look at Edwards' results, you can see how well Cook and Proctor are driving.

In Dynamics, they have a driver returning to the series after a three year absence and driving the car for the first time - alongside a driver who is walking away with the Jack Sears trophy and with both cars in the top ten of the championship.
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Old Yesterday, 10:35 (Ref:4074775)   #93
S griffin
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Rowbottom is now out of the top ten though
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Old Yesterday, 10:44 (Ref:4074777)   #94
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Rowbottom is now out of the top ten though
You're right - I meant a the time Dynamics were accused of looking stupid, he was still in the top ten.
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Old Yesterday, 11:11 (Ref:4074786)   #95
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I do agree that Dynamics aren’t doing that bad. Let’s not forget they aren’t a works team anymore, so it’s not so bad BTC have done better
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Old Yesterday, 11:16 (Ref:4074787)   #96
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I guess if the kerbs were raised then there would be complaints that they were dangerous for bikes? I've only raced at Croft a coupe of times but watched a fair few events there, and its obvious from lap 1 that track limits are abused - the flexy poles go flying and there effectively ceases to be a bend between Clervaux and Hawthorne, and the Chicane isn't the tightest I've seen - although some drivers still seem to treat it as optional....
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Old Yesterday, 13:01 (Ref:4074805)   #97
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Why not remove the tyre stacks and bring back the nailed together plywood and sleepers from the old Croft. No kerb hopping then....
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Old Yesterday, 15:14 (Ref:4074822)   #98
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Originally Posted by coppice View Post
I was at the chicane too and while of course it was the drivers who hit the tyres , and not the reverse, other drivers were caught up in the ensuing carnage. I am at most Croft meetings and have lost count of the number of times those damn tyres have punished a small error by wrecking a car.

Circuits are already over sanitised in the quest to make them "safe" for drivers, but if drivers insist on pushing the limit, then they have to expect the consequences. I find it puzzling that today's drivers are incapable of negotiating the circuits without, a) exceeding track limits and b) not driving into track furniture.

I am old enough to have witnessed first hand drivers negotiating tracks like Crystal Palace which had corners/chicanes created using old railway sleepers. And I cannot recall any of those drivers not being able to get round the circuit without hitting those immobile those track walls. Or nearly all F1 and other drivers not being able to miss the barriers at Monaco.

Yes, accidents will happen, but that is not the fault of the track furniture; that is nearly always the fault of the drivers taking unacceptable risks, as I feel very strongly happened yesterday. And yes it's very unfortunate for other drivers that may have suffered misfortune because of the actions of others, but blame must be placed at the feet of the drivers responsible in the first place, especially at least one who drove almost into the centre of the middle stack, thus causing mayhem.
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Old Yesterday, 16:01 (Ref:4074825)   #99
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Originally Posted by Lancsbreaker View Post
I guess if the kerbs were raised then there would be complaints that they were dangerous for bikes? I've only raced at Croft a coupe of times but watched a fair few events there, and its obvious from lap 1 that track limits are abused - the flexy poles go flying and there effectively ceases to be a bend between Clervaux and Hawthorne, and the Chicane isn't the tightest I've seen - although some drivers still seem to treat it as optional....
Why not gravel or grass there?
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Old Yesterday, 16:30 (Ref:4074830)   #100
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Originally Posted by mattcanary View Post
Why not gravel or grass there?

Because drivers will still run over at least grass. On the entry where the first tyre stack is placed beyond the external edge of the serrated curbing - which causes the cars' tyres to make a rumbling noise as they all go over them - once an errant driver had knocked the stack out of the way, then following cars on repeated laps just ran at least two wheels over the ground beyond the curbing, which you could witness by the dust that was kicked up by many of the cars. And this meant that, when made possible by a reasonable gap before the cars came around again, the marshals would try to put the first stack back in position. They couldn't do that for the other stack because a) it would have required marshals to actually cross a live track and b) it needed too many bodies to move it because it was so heavy, which any sensible driver would realise before hitting it.

As I have tried to say, it all comes down to a complete lack of discipline by a too many of today's drivers.
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Old Yesterday, 16:33 (Ref:4074831)   #101
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Originally Posted by Mike Harte View Post
Because drivers will still run over at least grass. On the entry where the first tyre stack is placed beyond the external edge of the serrated curbing - which causes the cars' tyres to make a rumbling noise as they all go over them - once an errant driver had knocked the stack out of the way, then following cars on repeated laps just ran at least two wheels over the ground beyond the curbing, which you could witness by the dust that was kicked up by many of the cars. And this meant that, when made possible by a reasonable gap before the cars came around again, the marshals would try to put the first stack back in position. They couldn't do that for the other stack because a) it would have required marshals to actually cross a live track and b) it needed too many bodies to move it because it was so heavy, which any sensible driver would realise before hitting it.

As I have tried to say, it all comes down to a complete lack of discipline by a too many of today's drivers.
MSV's non negotiable sensors whilst unpopular seem to work
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Old Yesterday, 16:43 (Ref:4074833)   #102
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At least it’s not as bad as a couple of years ago when we had those ridiculous little soft barriers on the exit kerbs of corners. Caused about four red flags in qualifying IIRC
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Old Yesterday, 17:01 (Ref:4074835)   #103
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Croft isn't unique in using tyres stacks. Both Thruxton and Oulton Park have tyre stacks on their chicane. As I recall, Snetterton have used them on some corners as well. There are probably some other circuits as well.

Notably some circuits don't use them at club meeting but do when the BTCC is in town. Mainly because BTCC drivers don't seem to understand where the track-limits start and end.
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Old Yesterday, 18:10 (Ref:4074839)   #104
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Originally Posted by redshoes View Post
Notably some circuits don't use them at club meeting but do when the BTCC is in town. Mainly because BTCC drivers don't seem to understand where the track-limits start and end.

The odd thing is, as I wrote earlier, the BTCC guys on the whole drove sensibly through the chicane - I can't remember if any of them actually touched the tyre stacks, but I don't think that they did - and, apart from the 1st laps on the races when it was pretty frenetic at the chicane, they all drove through the chicane; the problems arose in the other races, notably the Minis (quelle surprise), the Porsches and the Ginettas. That is except Butcher who missed the chicane after sideswiping his team-mate on the way in and then gained two places by driving at full pelt straight alongside the chicane on the tarmac there, and which I don't think that he gave back.

I do hope that he was penalised for that as it was patently obvious, I thought, that there was no way that he could make the chicane because his team-mate was already alongside another car, and you certainly can't get three cars side by side through the chicane.
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Old Yesterday, 18:46 (Ref:4074841)   #105
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Twitter discussion about the tyre stacks with some input from current drivers https://twitter.com/timharvey7/statu...513396229?s=21
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