The Historically Accurate EV discussion

[midgetman]

You think it won't happen Peter? Goodness me, how could you?

Sent from my SM-G950F using Tapatalk

[Adam43]

I don’t believe 2.4s or 75K is historically accurate

Anyway, it’s so made up it hurts. Although it has as much basis in fact as a lot of the recent posts in this thread

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Adam43

I don’t believe 2.4s or 75K is historically accurate

Anyway, it’s so made up it hurts. Although it has as much basis in fact as a lot of the recent posts in this thread

Wait - I thought all of the claims in this thread were supported by multiple online sources that exposed the real truth?

[crmalcolm]

China eases green rules to promote regular hybrids

'China re-classified gas-electric hybrid vehicles on Monday so they get more favorable treatment than all-gas or diesel counterparts under new clean car rules, making it easier for automakers to meet environment quotas and offer more choice.

China has some of the world's strictest rules regarding the production of fossil-fuel vehicles, as it battles unhealthy levels of air pollution in its crowded cities.

Those rules have pushed both domestic and international automakers to spend billions of dollars on the development and production of new energy vehicles (NEVs), such as all-electric, plug-in hybrid and hydrogen fuel cell vehicles.

Automakers in China are obliged to manufacture NEVs to win "points" to make up for a portion of the negative points they incur when they produce internal combustion engine vehicles.'

[crmalcolm]

Jaguar I-Pace to be used for wireless charging taxi fleet

'A fleet of 25 Jaguar I-Pace EVs will be used as taxis in Oslo, Norway to trial a new wireless charging system.

The Norwegian capital has launched an initiative called ‘ElectriCity’, which includes the goal of making its taxi system emission-free by 2024. As part of the scheme, tech firm Momentum Dynamics and charge point firm Fortnum Recharge are installing a number of wireless high-powered charge points for taxis.'

[Tel 911S]

As well as being very expensive to install ,[ & potentially fatal to anyone with a heart pacemaker] , Induction [ wireless] charging is very inefficient .
Even if you can get the receiver to be stationary very close to the transmitter ,
the power losses means that the cost per mile for an EV would be 2 to 5 times the cost for an ICE vehicle .
So that will not help the propaganda in trying to sell them when it shows that even the running costs of an EV is a lot more money than a normal car .

[Tel 911S]

Originally Posted by Tel 911S

If you have a couple of hours to spare , this study shows how a lot of the present situation came about .
https://www.iatp.org/sites/default/f...y_How_When.htm
The UN s agenda 21 shows how they want to form a New World Government , & invented Climate Change to frighten people into letting them take control of everything . Including everybodys freedom , money & anything they own .
They also want huge reductions in the population .

Unlike a lot of the EV adverts which keep appearing on this thread & are obviously nowhere near real , this study has links to all of the facts so it can be checked out .

Well , he must have seen my post & realised the cat was out of the bag .
https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2...al-governance/

[crmalcolm]

Weltmeister EX5 impresses with low battery capacity degradation

'To help alleviate concerns surrounding one important consideration among car buyers, the degradation of EV batteries over time, WM Motor has long promoted the benefits of high-quality thermal management and battery management systems (BMS) in EV’s to maintain the long-term stability of a battery’s capacity. Data from one of WM Motor’s EX5 models purchased in January 2019 has provided an insight into the car’s long-term battery degradation rate. The driver of this EX5 undertakes lengthy commutes between Wenzhou, Ningbo and Hangzhou, among other cities, and has averaged approximately 500km daily and accumulated over 200,000km of driving since purchasing the vehicle last year. Having been brought in for a regular check-up this week, the battery was found to have degraded by only 2.85% from its original capacity.'

[crmalcolm]

Lexus UX 300e comes with a 10-year or 1 million km battery warranty

'While most electric cars have a 8-year or 160.000 km warranty for their batteries, the upcoming Lexus UX 300e raises the bar to new levels.

Offering a 10-year or 1 million km warranty on its battery, Lexus ensures that the UX 300e maintains at least 70 % of its initial battery capacity for a long time, providing peace of mind to its customers.'

[Lancsbreaker]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

You did read the caveats in the article didn't you?

I do find this amusing........you post an article , and highlight the great news that all 29 vehicles exceed the WLTP range......although the article is somewhat vague about the methodology......and completely ignore the (hidden in a link) part of the caveat that says that tests in cold weather show that all vehicles performed worse than the WLTP, many of them by 25% or so. The article then makes the somewhat unscientific assertion that in the real world things will balance themselves out........so cars won't beat the WLTP figures, then?



And then you ask if people have seen the caveats

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Lancsbreaker

I do find this amusing........you post an article , and highlight the great news that all 29 vehicles exceed the WLTP range......although the article is somewhat vague about the methodology......and completely ignore the (hidden in a link) part of the caveat that says that tests in cold weather show that all vehicles performed worse than the WLTP, many of them by 25% or so. The article then makes the somewhat unscientific assertion that in the real world things will balance themselves out........so cars won't beat the WLTP figures, then?



And then you ask if people have seen the caveats

That's why the link is provided.

The quoted text is just a snapshot.

[Lancsbreaker]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

That's why the link is provided.

The quoted text is just a snapshot.

Not exactly a balanced view, however, to highlight only the part of the article that supports your viewpoint. Its a sloppy, arguably biassed report at best, and your cynical headlining of one aspect does your credibility no good.



I see why you need an anode.......


I'm not anti EV - just anti false, biassed views that don't present a full picture.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Lancsbreaker

Not exactly a balanced view, however, to highlight only the part of the article that supports your viewpoint.

It's not my viewpoint.....

[Adam43]

It’s like the Jeremy Vine show with crmalcolm and Tel 911S as the guests.

Nothing is ever achieved by getting two extremes that both talk extremes. Quite often both points of view just end up looking foolish on that show.

[Paul D]

Perhaps we could set them up with their own little thread, maybe call it the 'Yes it is... no it isn't!' thread.

Maybe we could get Jeremy Vine to adjudicate? Mind you, he's gone a bit holier than thou these days, riding everywhere on his bike and shouting at car drivers, so he'd probably come down in favour of the EV...

[S griffin]

How about his brother Tim then? That would be a good laugh

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by Paul D

Perhaps we could set them up with their own little thread, maybe call it the 'Yes it is... no it isn't!' thread.

We could call it the Cherry Picked EV discussion.

Maybe we could get Jeremy Vine to adjudicate? Mind you, he's gone a bit holier than thou these days, riding everywhere on his bike and shouting at car drivers, so he'd probably come down in favour of the EV...

But the EVs we are talking about are cars!

IIRC the video I saw of this it was the car driver that was the tool.

[crmalcolm]

How much does EV charging save you compared to gas? Up to $10,500 says DOE

https://electrek.co/2020/06/23/how-m...0500-says-doe/

[John Elwin]

Originally Posted by Lancsbreaker

Not exactly a balanced view, however, to highlight only the part of the article that supports your viewpoint. Its a sloppy, arguably biassed report at best, and your cynical headlining of one aspect does your credibility no good.



I see why you need an anode.......


I'm not anti EV - just anti false, biassed views that don't present a full picture.

Ah good - somebody's finally rumbled him!

[Tel 911S]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

How much does EV charging save you compared to gas? Up to $10,500 says DOE

https://electrek.co/2020/06/23/how-m...0500-says-doe/

Another bit of cherry picking .

In Germany , which has the highest electricity prices due to the large amount of renewable generation , it is cheaper to run on petrol than to even charge an EV from home . And diesel is 15 to 20% cheaper than petrol .Which is probably why , even after a massive pro EV propaganda campaign by the politicians & media , the total number of EVs is less than 2%

At the moment in the UK , home charging is slightly cheaper than running an ICE , [ although most roadside chargers make it more expensive ]. But as the Green energy program goes on , the price of electricity will continue to rise .
Electric prices have already risen by 100% over the last 10 years to pay for wind & solar .

[Peter Mallett]

To complete the current supply mix in the UK this chart shows that despite all the backslapping in the Wind industry although coal is now virtually extinct wind/solar etc. has only supplied approx 20% of the requirement which is obviously reduced from the norm. https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/data-portal...fuel-source-gb

This shows that gas is the major winner although you won't see that from the wind generation companies.

[crmalcolm]

Musk Tweets Tesla Model Y 3-Row 7-Seater May Launch Soon

'The CEO said 'Probably early Q4' when asked about the three-row Model Y.'

however - the actual story does change slightly, so there is still a bit of doubt over what will come in Q4.

'When Tesla CEO Elon Musk first talked about the Model Y, he said it would be built on a brand-new platform. However, that tune changed later, when he said it would actually be built on the same platform as the Model 3 and share many of its sibling's parts, though it would have third-row seats.'

Why the confusion? - it seems to have come from Tesla promotional activity:

'When people started getting notifications to configure their Model Y, there was some confusion, which caused plenty of speculation. The automaker was telling people to prepare for delivery of Model Y versions that weren't yet available, such as the three-row model.

Fast forward to a recent tweetstorm this Father's Day weekend, and Musk replied to a tweet saying the seven-seat Model Y may become available in the coming months. More specifically, early in the fourth quarter.'

Although - as with many options on cars, are they any good?
'The more important question may be whether people will actually want to follow through with ordering it when they realize the third row is almost unusable.'

[crmalcolm]

Ford Mustang Mach-E: Dealers Reportedly Adding $15,000 Markup Over MSRP

https://insideevs.com/news/430459/fo...-markup-15000/

Are people in America willing to pay a premium for the name?

'If you wanted proof that even though some Mustang fans think the Ford Mach-E shouldn’t have borne the iconic galloping stallion badge, it’s still popular and desirable, here is that proof. According to a post on the Mach-E*forum, dealers are now marking up the price by between $5,000 and $15,000, even for those people who have already placed orders.'

[Tel 911S]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

To complete the current supply mix in the UK this chart shows that despite all the backslapping in the Wind industry although coal is now virtually extinct wind/solar etc. has only supplied approx 20% of the requirement which is obviously reduced from the norm. https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/data-portal...fuel-source-gb

This shows that gas is the major winner although you won't see that from the wind generation companies.

Yes , completely right Peter .
Long term , gas [ CCGT generation ] is 10 to 15 times cheaper than wind & solar . And even Nuclear is 3 or 4 times cheaper than the renewables .
But this year everything has gone strange with the Lockdown , so current figures are not reliable . Last week there was high pressure over most of the country , & wind generation was down to less than 1% some days .

But overall , wind/solar never generate enough energy to pay for the cost of them , which is why , on average , every consumer is paying £400 to £500 extra for their electricity .
Which means that the cost to charge up any EVs will continue to rise .

[Adam43]

Originally Posted by Tel 911S

Yes , completely right Peter .
Long term , gas [ CCGT generation ] is 10 to 15 times cheaper than wind & solar . And even Nuclear is 3 or 4 times cheaper than the renewables .
But this year everything has gone strange with the Lockdown , so current figures are not reliable . Last week there was high pressure over most of the country , & wind generation was down to less than 1% some days .

I know they publish this stuff, but 8 thought it was by quarter. Can you link to your source for days last week?

I’ve been interested in this and remain quite impressed how coal has decreased.