Britcar

[Stephen Green]

How did Mr Sollis fare?

[PaulSands]

I think he struggled a bit...it looked to me like his tyres went off towards the end...the couple of laps prior to this picure the same had looked imminent...unless of course he was puching it a lttle harder at the time

[martinparsons]

Originally posted by Snapper Baz
Anyone recognize the chap holding the wheel?


















Handsome chap isn't he!

Bit of advice for Baz at Brands - If the Marcos looks big in your viewfinder it's not because your zoom lens is working well.


MP

[ascarracinguk]

hey phil....you dont happen to have any decent shots of the number 31, 39 gts bmw m3 cars do you....i got a friend who works for the team and would like a few pix....also if your at brands could you drop in and take a few pix?...thanks

adam

[neil_davidson2]

Originally posted by PaulSands
I felt like I was going to be blown into traffic a few times

Nice shots Paul, was that you I saw wandering around the Luffield area with a giant Chammy leather draped over your camera?

[PaulSands]

Nope I was the big red one with the curly haired urchin in tow...I do need a shammy though

[james tucker]

Sir Piglet, you normally are confused i've been told...we understand that there are rules, but also try to use common sense, the EERC has had a speed gun for a year, when policeing ourselves we have
broached the subject with the ones extending reasonable safety. You understand the need with so many walking around in the pitlane...Whenever someone other than the EERC does it, it is not used as a deterant. The speed limit is 60k
in the UK and we feel with so many on foot extra care should be asked for . Re Yellow flags etc
through the book at them....Without discussion with the public no-one would know about us.....A fulltime clerk is a good idea, any names?
sportingly
james

[Driesco]

A Specially for the Britcar and the Clio I came from Belgium to Silverstone. Why don't you complaine ? I went home with a feeling of " what a good race,friendly people, but ****ing weather". We followed the Clio ( that we sold to Meyrick Cox ) and I saw a few good teams. Not really on the level of the Belcar, but very familiar, dirty boxes ( shame ) and no spectaters. I was looking for a second pilote to drive our Volvo S40 on the Belcar Championship in Belgium and had an quick talk to the owner of the Volvo S60. I've somebody will race the championschip with me, please contact me for details. +32 474 95 23 86 www.belgianraceinvest.be

I had a nice day there in Silverstone

[Piglet]

Originally posted by james tucker
Sir Piglet, you normally are confused i've been told...

James, you say the most charming things on a public forum and for the record it's madam not sir

we understand that there are rules, but also try to use common sense, the EERC has had a speed gun for a year, when policeing ourselves we have
broached the subject with the ones extending reasonable safety. You understand the need with so many walking around in the pitlane...Whenever someone other than the EERC does it, it is not used as a deterant. The speed limit is 60k
in the UK and we feel with so many on foot extra care should be asked for .

If I understand you correctly, you set a 40kph speed limit and if enforcing it yourselves you just do this by broaching the subject with those concerned? Yet you seem to be suggesting that this is a greater deterant than applying your own regulations that prescribe a stop/go penalty for anyone exceeding the speed limit. The confusion for me is that your regulations provide for something that you don't wish to be enforced - in the case of the driver who posted earlier (IIRC) he says that he was doing 15kph above the speed limit that's 38% faster than the limit. Why have the penalty in your regulations if you don't wish it to be enforced?

I'm all for pit lane safety, I think we've had this discussion before - IMO in a properly run pit lane 60kph is perfectly OK and as has been said on here for most cars limiting to 40kph is very difficult - but that's a topic for another day no doubt.

Re Yellow flags etc
through the book at them....Without discussion with the public no-one would know about us.....

I don't understand what you are saying here. Are you saying that drivers were excluded or given endorsments on Saturday for yellow flag infringements and that they didn't know about it?

A fulltime clerk is a good idea, any names?

I think that would have to be your choice, you clearly have some very specific requirements for your clerk.

[johndpeat]

Piglet,The EERC will punish a speeding offence in the pits depending on it severity.If they were doing 15 k's over they would be done for and cop a 10 sec pen.If they are caught doing a couple of ks over we will then tell who ever is nearest to the team concirned to have a word with them and give the driver a warning tht he was over the limit.If they are caught again then they should also get a penalty for doing it again after they were warned.Speeding offences are normal delt with by James or John and not normally by race control as happened at silverstone.
On track infringment are delt with at the discertion of race control as they are the ones who will be told of the offence by marshal's on track.I agree with James that if rules are broken on track they need to be delt with as harshly as possible as they are causing a far greater danger to people at racing speed than ever they would at 40 kph.

[alec dudfield]

Originally posted by johndpeat
The reason behind the lack of britsport was a rumour in radical I belive saying this round had been canned.It had nothing to do with the eerc whatso ever.

With respect, Utter Tosh.

I entered cars at the Britsports Winter Warmer at Brands in November. The meeting was well subscribed and wholely enjoyable: Our Drivers finished 1-2. , the organisation was excellent.
One has to remember that this race took place when all other championships had finished; so competitors from Nat. Supersports, Sports 2000, Global Lights, and Radical Championships were all able to take part. It was a good way to prolong the season.
I suggest that 2/3 of the 30+ cars that raced at Brands are like me preparing for what is going to be a long and very busy season within their core championships. For reasons of budget, logistics, conservation of engines, marital harmony etc.....they have not raced. This creates a snowball effect with the race becoming less attractive as the likely entry diminishes.
When James T told me that the entry was low (13) last wednesday, I decided I could not reasonably motivate my team to give up what will be their last free weekend for a month.
You say the reason the entry was low was that there was a rumour the race would not run; implying that is the reason entries failed to turn up. That is simply not the case those Radical cars that did not run quite simply could not justify the time and expense one week before their core Championship was due to take place.
I cannot speak for all Radical owners of course, but I would very much like to enter cars in a Britsports event in the future when it did not clash or compromise our primary commitments.
I greatly respect the efforts of James and the EERC team, and I do not know the capacity in which you speak, but it is my opinion that blaming low entries on a third party / championship is patently untrue and malicious.

Sincerely

Alec Dudfield

[Ian Sowman]

Which takes us back to a point I made earlier - what purpose does Britsports serve? Maybe, as Alec said, it is a good way to end the season...

[Snapper Baz]

Archie...thats allright then! Ian, think we will have to see RE: Britsports entries though I do think that the grids will swell in time. There are a lot of sports types out there that don't have champonships to run in at present which must be looking for somewhere to race-lets wait and see. The Mini...Sollis did the first stint-with Davidson taking over later-once the car had returned to the pits afterwards the rear left had no rubber at all...just the canvas showing which might explain things a little!

[Sheila M]

Originally posted by Sheila M
Martin, as a Chief Pit Marshal I am conscious of the dangers of children and pit lanes. Can I refer you to clause B.18.2 of the Blue Book which states "Warning, the Pits (i.e. garages) and Pit Lane are areas of potential danger and great care should be exercised at all times. Children under the age of 16 years are not allowed in these areas".

To add to my previous posting - a couple of years ago I was chief pit marshal at a race meeting at Donington Park. We had what could have been a major incident in the pit lane when a vehicle fell off the jack whilst the mechanic was still underneath it. The mechanic's head ended up trapped between the vehicle and the floor of the garage. Fortunately the mechanic only suffered a major hangover as a result of later celebrations in the bar. If that had been a child near the car I dread to think of the consequences.

Please, all you drivers, mechanics and team managers, if you have guests coming to a race meeting, keep them out of harm's way by only allowing them into the garage during allocated periods (i.e pit walkabouts). No one other than officials, team personnel and "signed on" media personnel should ever be allowed in a working pit lane.

[PaulCherry]

Are there full results online yet for either/both the Britcar/Britsport races yet?

[james tucker]

Britcar 3rd April Brands Hatch GP Circuit
CLASS 1
Andy.Rouse/Julian.Rouse DTM MERC
Peter.Seldon/TBA BMW E46 GTR
Paul.Dishman/Linus.Ridge P996
David.Back/Calum.Lockie F360
Jeff.Wyatt/Martin.Parsons MARCOS
Stephen.Hirst/TBA AUDI BTCC
Bo.McCormac/TBA FERRARI F360
Warren.Gilbert/TBA TVR TUSCAN
Jon.Harrison/AndyRay AUDIBTCC
Colin.Simpson/TBA MARCOS
10 of 11
CLASS 2
Calum.Lockie/David.Smith BMW E36 M3
Mark.Smith/David.Cuff BMW M3
Richard.Meins/ BMW E46 M3
Ian.Mitchell/TBA BMW E36 M3
HarryHandkammer/David.Leslie BMW E36M3
Andrew.Allen/David.Kempton BMW E46
Andrew.Howard/Chris.Wilson BMW E36 M3
Bill.Sollis /NeilCunningham SUPER-MINI
Mike.Salmon/David.Ellis BMW E36 M3
Damax Witt.Gamski/ FERRARI F355
Paul.Fenton/Simon.Mason BMW E36 M3
John.Clonis/David.Streater 911RS
Reid/Burt BMW E36 M3
13 of 11
CLASS 3
John.George/TBA Honda
Michael&SeanMcinerney HONDA INTn+
Mark.Lemmer/TBA HONDA CIVIC n+
Tom&William.Gannon HONDA INTn+
Richard.Gain/Larry.Phillips Honda Civic N+
Don.Norchi/Martin.Sadler VOLVO S60 n+
Nigel.Stephens/Michael.Caine BMW E30 M3n+
Alex.Frick/Terry.Flatt VW BEETLESR3n+
Jillian.Butcher Honda
Gillet/Clynes Vectra N+
Simon.Wainwright/Mike.Walters BMW E30
Fiona.Leggate/Gyndeff.Evans MG Judd
Geoff&Niel.Waterworth / CLIO N+
Nick.Reynolds/Ron.Field HONDA INTn+
14 of 11
CLASS 4
John&MarkHammersley/. MG 190N
Daniels MSP Honda Int N
Daniels MSP Honda Int N
Ben.Salmon/Nick.Starkey Honda Accord
John.Griffiths/Chris.Snowdon ALFA 156 N
Bernie.& Andy.Bowden CAVALIER16V N
Neil.Armstrong/Steven.Turvey Honda Civic N
Rupert.Laslett/TBA Fiesta
8 of 11

[PaulSands]

a few more pictures here http://www.paulsands.org/sil200304/b.../britcar1.html

[Piglet]

Originally posted by johndpeat
Piglet,The EERC will punish a speeding offence in the pits depending on it severity.If they were doing 15 k's over they would be done for and cop a 10 sec pen.If they are caught doing a couple of ks over we will then tell who ever is nearest to the team concirned to have a word with them and give the driver a warning tht he was over the limit.

I understand that all competetitors given penalties on Saturday were doing in excess of 54kph. Which you suggest would normally incurr a penalty so hardly "heavy handed" to quote James.

Speeding offences are normal delt with by James or John and not normally by race control as happened at silverstone.

You may find that this causes you a problem with a switched on competitor. Your reg's state that the Clerk of the Course and the Stewards of the Meeting (appears to be a lifted from FIA regs) make decisions and give penalties (This is in line with MSA regs). A penalty given by a series co-ordinator is, I would suggest, invalid as there is no mechanism for it to be made and no mechanism to challenge it. It is outside of your regs and the Blue Book. Judicial decisions are made by Clerks (whether you agree with it or not that's how it stands under MSA regulations currently)....Note to Britcar competitors..... Thoughts from anyone else on this one?

On track infringment are delt with at the discertion of race control as they are the ones who will be told of the offence by marshal's on track.I agree with James that if rules are broken on track they need to be delt with as harshly as possible as they are causing a far greater danger to people at racing speed than ever they would at 40 kph.

Oh I see, is that what James was saying? Yes absolutely and that's why so many competitors ended up in Race Control on Saturday, as there were numerous reports of contact and flag infringements. Again James appears to be describing this as heavy handed, yet you say that he is supportive of this action.

[james tucker]

Madame Piglet,
the EERC pay for a service.....
We in the EERC are a club....hold race licences with the MSA,
but the EERC is not a member of the MSA OR THE FIA...and we are not a Championship....but we do recognise that the drivers are members of the MSA and the EERC has adopted the Blue book as the best guide to run a race meeting in the UK, but the EERC is involved with the changeing of the outdated rules and have been able to infuence this process
The EERC wrote the rules regs,but use a clubs to run our races
and the request was simple, use the speed gun as a deterrant, that request was ignored. If someone breaks or
does not respect the race code then they should get the penalties.
If someone had come down prior to the prize giving and said
'these cars have been speeding in the pit lane, car nos..SOANDSO.......and the list has been given to JT,' so that it could be used at the next race meeting as a deterant, then the club could have held its prizegiving, after all this is not any more than club racing. This did not happen and people were kept from getting their licences and sat for 2 hours before they were told off. Thus ends the lesson.

[Snapper Baz]

Piglet...are you a traffic warden or something?

[Steve Wood]

Safety is a serious business, and motor racing is dangerous, but, hey everybody, this is our day-off the daily grind, it's all about recreation and leisure, and having F-U-N.

Whilst I am no advocate of anarchy, Bob Dylan's 1964 advice, "If you want to do it, just do it - it's the rules that cause trouble" does seem attractive.

As James says, our gentlemen drivers spend their working lives with bureaucacy.

[R59]

According the the report in MN, looks like it all went well last weekend.

It sounds like Britsports isn't taking off. Shame as it seemed like such a good idea.

I'm sure it will grow, just as Britcar did.

Carry on the good work James.

Rob.

[Piglet]

Originally posted by Snapper Baz
Piglet...are you a traffic warden or something?

No, the hat didn't suit me...

I'm just inquisitive, I like to understand why things are done in certain ways and it irritates me when things don't make sense!

[archibold]

Not sure I would write Britsport off yet. If I didn't have the M3 the idea of getting a radical prosport for 13k and sharing it would be attractive (including dry break and air jacks). They are quite cheap to run when not under the draconian factory rules (e.g. having to buy tyres through radical). I think this series will grow...

[alec dudfield]

Originally posted by archibold
They are quite cheap to run when not under the draconian factory rules (e.g. having to buy tyres through radical)...

Minor observation, but:
I haven't found any of the supposed 'cheaper' suppliers of Dunlop Tyres to offer a significant saving.

...be interested if you know otherwise.

'draconian'...hardly, just sensible policing measures to ensure that the cars are as equal as possible when they race in the one make championship.

I wholely agree with your appraisal of the Prosport, its a fantastic car for the money.

Regards Alec