Fire extinguishers - what's changed?

ffracer · 10 Mar 2006, 20:55 (Ref:1543175)

I've read in several places in the press that the extinguisher regs have changed this year. Having just received my new Blue Book I find I can't find any differences from last year, so I assume my 2.25 AFFF plumbed in system is still OK.

Have I missed something?

SCOBER11 · 10 Mar 2006, 22:28 (Ref:1543237)

Its been changed so many times in the last few years that soon they will have us carry a bucket of water on the roll hoop!

As far as i know there has been no change from last year.

lifeline-fire · 13 Mar 2006, 08:54 (Ref:1545812)

Hi

There have been no changes to extinguisher regulations this year apart from it is now a requirement for all forms of Circuit racing apart from some historics to have an on board fire system.
If any one needs more info or would like a regulations guide line then please PM me

JIM

Vauxhall Junior · 14 Mar 2006, 14:10 (Ref:1548026)

Do the extinguishers need to have a up to date service stamp on them? Or do they just need to be full?

lifeline-fire · 14 Mar 2006, 14:27 (Ref:1548039)

Extinguishers do need to be serviced. Most makes are every two years but ther are some that require every year. The extinguisher once serviced will be date marked when the service was carried out and when it is next due

JIM

Vauxhall Junior · 14 Mar 2006, 14:32 (Ref:1548040)

Where can this be carried out?

lifeline-fire · 14 Mar 2006, 15:38 (Ref:1548072)

It usually has to be carried out by either the manufacturere of one of his official agents. If it is a Lifeline one please PM me.

JIM

scrutineer · 14 Mar 2006, 18:26 (Ref:1548226)

Quote:

Its been changed so many times in the last few years that soon they will have us carry a bucket of water on the roll hoop!
As far as i know there has been no change from last year.

Arnt you just contradicting yourself there?

Quote:

Extinguishers do need to be serviced.

This is obviously a recomendation (and is recommended by the manufactures for a very good reason) however you will not fail scrutineering if it is out of service date, you will fail if its empty though

Tim Wilkinson · 14 Mar 2006, 18:55 (Ref:1548255)

Quote:

Originally Posted by scrutineer

This is obviously a recomendation (and is recommended by the manufactures for a very good reason) however you will not fail scrutineering if it is out of service date, you will fail if its empty though

I'm glad you've clairified this. Although the MSA "recommends" it, i've read on here that certain scrutineers at certain circuits won't pass the car unless the extinguisher is within the service date. Does anyone have experience of this?

"Scrutineer", would you be able to give a brief overview of what you're looking for with regard to extinguisher systems, please?

I think my system is okay, but want to check before turning up for my first race and being told it's not. A friend is racing at the Brands meeting this weekend (after much running around to find a within service date extinguisher, as the rules seemed fuzzy to him also), and i'll be looking for a nice friendly scrute to ask pertinent questions of.

greenamex2 · 14 Mar 2006, 19:11 (Ref:1548268)

Both myself and a couple of our guys have been 'warned' about out of date extinguishers but still been allowed to race.

scrutineer · 14 Mar 2006, 19:34 (Ref:1548293)

Denis is right, we will always warn you about your service date, and would hope that you will act on the warning as at the end of the day it is to your benifit. But you should not be stopped from racing for it. We are not there to stop you having a good time just to make sure you do it as safe as possible.
What I will be looking for when I look at the extinguisher is, first is it there

ill look at the trigger points (dont forget your marking after your resprays) nossels (are they the correct type) do they fire in to the correct places, is the bottle a proper type (a list can be found on the MSA and FIA website). If its an electronic one have you got a battery and can you show me the circuit works. Its it the manual pull cables can you pull them? Make sure you put some grease on the cable and when fitting them dont kink them. How is it held in, will it come lose if your in an crash. There is a few other things but there is a good start. If you have any problems or questions you can always get in touch with me on here, or just ask one of us at the race meeting, dont forget we are there to help as much as we can, even though you might not always think that.
And im sure if you need new gear lifeline-fire might be able to help

Al Weyman · 14 Mar 2006, 20:14 (Ref:1548870)

Scrutineer, I have two cable pulls in close proximity one for the extinguisher and one for the battery cut out, both clearly marked with stickers as reqired and at the moment the pull handles are both red. Presumably red is right for the extinguisher but what colour would you suggest I paint the battery cut off pull handle?

scrutineer · 14 Mar 2006, 20:31 (Ref:1548896)

I would say there is no reason to paint the handles however I think I see were you are coming from as you are worried that a marshal might pull the wrong one by mistake. What I would suggest is have an arrow from your sticker to the correct cable pull and also write on the pull (in paint) what it is for. This will help no end and should ensure no mix up in the 'heat' of the moment.
I will say one thing, make sure that the stickers are on the right pull, it wouldnt be the first time a driver has pulled it in the bay to show it works and the car fills with foam.

ffracer · 14 Mar 2006, 20:32 (Ref:1548901)

Thanks for everyone's replies on this

Does anyone know why the manufacturers recommend that extinguishers are serviced after (typically) two years, and what do they actually do when they service them? I'm assuming it's more than reading the pressure level on the gauge, and changing the date on the label...

I'd be fascinated to learn how many people out there have actually used an on-board extinguisher in anger? I have once - I had the classic "fuel pipe union pull out of the carb" on an FF1600 at Lydden - petrol was squirted onto the distributor and also over my shoulder into the cockpit, and then...whoooomph. A tricky bit was that the mechanical pull lever on the dash was melting, but when I triggered it the (SPA AFFF lite) system worked a treat.

Al Weyman · 14 Mar 2006, 20:37 (Ref:1548910)

I have used my hand held, Lesson (1): Do not try to fire up a Holley carburated V8 without an air cleaner, very easy to start a nice little bonfire :-)

lifeline-fire · 15 Mar 2006, 08:45 (Ref:1549275)

When we receive a cylinder back for service we carry out the following,
Discharge it and then dismantle it. All parts are checked and cleaned and O rings replaced. The cylinder is visually inspected internally and then pressure tested. The unit is then re assembled and filled with new extinguishant and re pressurised. A label is applied close to the serial number label which indicates the date of service and the next required.
The reason the extinguishers are serviced are to make sure they are in working condition and will opetate when required. Because of the relativly harsh enviroment the extinguisher is in the foam after a period of time 2-3 years can start to degrade and deposit salts which in turn wil corrode the cylinder, valve and possibly even block the dip tube.

We held a a few open days last year for scrutineers and I would be prepared to do the same for competitors, marshalls or any ten tenther etc etc. If enough people were interested then it can be arranged. Maybe admin would allow me to use the forum to offer this.

JIM

***Chris Y*** · 15 Mar 2006, 09:09 (Ref:1549290)

Admin have no problems with that at all

Sounds like a very good idea.

scrutineer · 15 Mar 2006, 19:04 (Ref:1549716)

If anyone can take up the life-line offer then I would recomend it, although they are in the job of selling anything that might open your eyes to the dangers of not having the proper tools for the job or not fitting it correctly can only be a good thing. Im sure that you will get a lot of interest here, maybe with the permission of officials you could put this in its own thread and see how much interest you get.

lifeline-fire · 16 Mar 2006, 08:52 (Ref:1550091)

I will look in to some dates and start a new thread on the Racers Forum. I will make sure that we hold it on a weekend with the least amount of motorsport activity.

JIM

MikeM · 16 Mar 2006, 18:21 (Ref:1550414)

I'd definitely be interested if you can set it up!

R59 · 19 Mar 2006, 20:26 (Ref:1552992)

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCOBER11

Its been changed so many times in the last few years that soon they will have us carry a bucket of water on the roll hoop!

Sand actually.

More effective on fuel fires.

I agree with Al about 4 barrel holley's and no filters - light blue touch paper and run like hell. (or take some bread and a toasting fork)

Yes - the life-line doody would be a good thing to do.

Rob.

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