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Old 6 Nov 2007, 12:38 (Ref:2061125)   #46
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climb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridclimb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Originally Posted by D.R.T.
... Mutoh is another interesting discussion point.

Point being is do what you have to in order to survive.
I cannot catch your drift, DRT; Mutoh got a drive in one of the best funded OWR teams, if not the best, therefore nobody can say he's doing it "to survive"; nor can we say AGR have recruited him because they need his money.
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Old 7 Nov 2007, 00:06 (Ref:2061685)   #47
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Is the fourth car not going to be funded by Honda ?

While Mutoh has shown potential during his debut season in IPS, by no means did his talent alone get him the AGR ride. If it came soley down to the best candidate he would not be driving the #27 car.

To survive a manufacturer helps, if that manufactuer tells you who to put in the car, you do it, smile and shake hands and hope one day it improves.

Much in the same way Marco Andretti wasnt the best candidate to replace Wheldon.
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film
Old 7 Nov 2007, 09:45 (Ref:2061911)   #48
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climb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridclimb should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by D.R.T.
Is the fourth car not going to be funded by Honda ?

While Mutoh has shown potential during his debut season in IPS, by no means did his talent alone get him the AGR ride. If it came soley down to the best candidate he would not be driving the #27 car.

To survive a manufacturer helps, if that manufactuer tells you who to put in the car, you do it, smile and shake hands and hope one day it improves.

Much in the same way Marco Andretti wasnt the best candidate to replace Wheldon.
Tell me the name of a team boss who refused money from outside

The problem is, AGR are not that kinda team who need to hire a pay driver in order to survive; they just do it because there is an economic interest, some more money probably coming from Honda, but that's a completely different situation from the ones we recently saw in CC
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Old 10 Nov 2007, 01:40 (Ref:2064106)   #49
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Would the 4th car be there without this money from Honda? So a pay driver could be helping the 4th car to survive.
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film
Old 10 Nov 2007, 14:19 (Ref:2064350)   #50
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JohnSSC has a real shot at the podium!JohnSSC has a real shot at the podium!JohnSSC has a real shot at the podium!JohnSSC has a real shot at the podium!JohnSSC has a real shot at the podium!
I think there is a huge difference here in saying "Pay Driver" as in Geoff Boss and implying that Mutoh is of the same ilk.

Is Mutoh one of "Honda's" drivers? Sure. He has had his career shepherded by them. The quid pro quo is that he actually has to produce results in order to continue with their support.

Honda is trying to place their guy with a team where their guy will get the best results. Period. AGR has the resources to do that. AGR will continue to exist with or without Mutoh. Whether that is as a 3-car or a 4-car team is their decision. Certainly Franchitti was not a "pay driver" although he did apparently have sponsorship associated with him.

This is not the same situation where, say, Revolving Door Racing has seats available but only functions if the drivers in them bring a Cashier's Check.
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Old 10 Nov 2007, 22:08 (Ref:2064663)   #51
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I wouldn't worry John or Climb, the attempts the devalue the IRL on these threads are getting more and more desperate and pathetic

trolls indeed! very sad....

like i've said, worry about whats going on in the dying series and leave the IRL alone...
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Old 11 Nov 2007, 02:46 (Ref:2064760)   #52
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Interesting perspective, indeed.

It is similar to the Geoff Boss situation in that a better driver has been overlooked for another driver due to factors outside of talent.

Schecter has been unlucky. But AGR, the top team in the IRL to be taking a IPS driver with 1 years experience is not normal practice.

As you say AGR still exists without Mutohs addition, even if it fell to 3 cars. But what happens if next year the option is a Japenese driver or going from 3 to 2 cars. It all starts somewhere.

I understand there are some who feel like their house is shielded from criticism but I dont think that is a very effective way of looking at things.

To those, keep your head in the sand and enjoy it
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film
Old 11 Nov 2007, 02:55 (Ref:2064761)   #53
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stradlin21 has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
of course, a much more effective way of looking at things is too be negative about every little thing that happens in the IRL

it's very very sad but pretty much what we expect from certain people...

Perhaps there's just a little jealousy going on in here?

I wouldn't worry though, AGR is still a four car team but at least Champ Car has Kevin Kalkhoven Racing, a glorious 10 car operation which is still beaten by Paul, Carl and the boys....

Keep your head in the sand and enjoy people, that money will run out soon and a certain Mr F does not his terms...

Fiddle fiddle!
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Old 11 Nov 2007, 05:01 (Ref:2064780)   #54
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mountainstar should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridmountainstar should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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Originally Posted by stradlin21
I wouldn't worry John or Climb, the attempts the devalue the IRL on these threads are getting more and more desperate and pathetic

trolls indeed! very sad....

like i've said, worry about whats going on in the dying series and leave the IRL alone...
Hmmm..... you spend a hell of a lot of time trashing champcar. Let's leave champcar alone.
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Old 11 Nov 2007, 11:22 (Ref:2064864)   #55
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...pretty much the same as what you do with the IRL

lets leave it alone shall we...

the negativity of some is a joke...
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Old 11 Nov 2007, 13:52 (Ref:2064948)   #56
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D.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridD.R.T. should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
I'd ask the moderators to review this thread, but I feel that it is not Mountainstar, Luke or myself that keeps turning this into a IRL - ChampCar stand off.

I am more than happy to talk IRL in this forum and ChampCar in the other forum, they way the rules state.
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Upon entry into the Bathurst 1000, it should be mandatory to view the compelling "Moffat - Man and the Mountain" film
Old 11 Nov 2007, 14:04 (Ref:2064959)   #57
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stradlin21 has a lot of promise if they can keep it on the circuit!
you consistently try to stir things up DRT

then you go off and moan about things when you get it back
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Old 11 Nov 2007, 14:51 (Ref:2064993)   #58
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paul-collins should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridpaul-collins should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridpaul-collins should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Enough.
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