IMSA IMSA : 2019

[Akrapovic]

Nope, and that isn't what MaskedRacer was meaning, which we all know. But cool, no problem

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

Nope, and that isn't what MaskedRacer was meaning, which we all know. But cool, no problem

Then what is it? Because Caddy would tout it as a Caddy win? Hell, everytime one of the 4 P2 costructors cars win they tout it too. What in the hell is the difference, other than it is DPi rather than P2 constructors? NOTHING! Check their twitter feeds.











L.P.

[Akrapovic]

Do I really need to explain why Cadillac would like a Cadillac JDC car to win over an ORECA JDC car? And why that's a good thing for Cadillac? I'm not sure how to actually word that, it's such a simple concept.

Next up: I'm going to explain why I prefer earning more money, rather than less!

Anyway, real discussion:

What are ESM Actually going to do? They aren't continuing with the Nissan and I can't imagine anyone taking those cars and paying the Nissan entry fee. There are a couple of ORECA chassis kicking about, so that's an option. Other than that, GTD? The RACER article has worryingly little detail.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

Kinda missing what he's saying. He's saying Cadillac don't want beaten by privateer teams. If JDC are a Cadillac team, they are no longer a privateer team, are they?

Anyway, now we have the DPi class, and the CORE Autosport Class. Sounds almost as fun as when Rebellion and ByKolles got to run around on there own behind the big guys and everyone absolutely loved it! Wait, I think I miss-remembered that last bit.

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

Do I really need to explain why Cadillac would like a Cadillac JDC car to win over an ORECA JDC car? And why that's a good thing for Cadillac? I'm not sure how to actually word that, it's such a simple concept.

Next up: I'm going to explain why I prefer earning more money, rather than less!

Anyway, real discussion:

What are ESM Actually going to do? They aren't continuing with the Nissan and I can't imagine anyone taking those cars and paying the Nissan entry fee. There are a couple of ORECA chassis kicking about, so that's an option. Other than that, GTD? The RACER article has worryingly little detail.

So which is it? The argument was, they would no longer be a PRIVATEER TEAM, in your own words! Or is it gonna change again?
















L.P.

[Akrapovic]

Ohhhhh. I see what you're getting at. Deliberately missing the point to try and look smart. Very good. Doesn't change what the intention was since we were discussing LMP2 v DPi, making the point kinda obvious, but we're going to ignore that because we need a chance to score some internet points! Awesome.

Anyway -

DPi -

Acura x2
Caddy x5
Mazda x2
Nissan x0 (unless a sale comes in).

LMP2
CORE x1
PR1 x1
PerfTech x1

Any likely expansions or is this what we're looking at next year? Any chance of the LMP2 teams expanding to a second car? We know United aren't returning, but could we see anyone else run Daytona?

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

Ohhhhh. I see what you're getting at. Deliberately missing the point to try and look smart. Very good. Doesn't change what the intention was since we were discussing LMP2 v DPi, making the point kinda obvious, but we're going to ignore that because we need a chance to score some internet points! Awesome.

Anyway -

DPi -

Acura x2
Caddy x5
Mazda x2
Nissan x0 (unless a sale comes in).

LMP2
CORE x1
PR1 x1
PerfTech x1

Any likely expansions or is this what we're looking at next year? Any chance of the LMP2 teams expanding to a second car? We know United aren't returning, but could we see anyone else run Daytona?

Right, how dare I take it for what and how it was said!


Also, where is the notion that ESM will not be in the Nissans next year coming from? That is NOT what the article says.


https://racer.com/2018/08/10/esm-to-...vity-for-2019/










L.P.

[Akrapovic]

Yeh, almost like conversation is dependant in context! Glad we sorted that one out. We’ll have none of that context here thank you very much!

Quite right, I miss read that article completely.

So their intention is to continue but seems funding would now be from selling customers. I think that’d be optimistic at best. Unfortunately I wouldn’t be surprised to see none of those sold. It’s slipping behind the Riley Mazda as a package, and previous Riley customers have learnt the lesson the hard way.

Worrying situation but very sad. Race winners to entry in jeopardy in such a short space of time, and Nissan don’t seem that fussed with it.

[HORNDAWG]

Originally Posted by MaskedRacer

I agree that its silly. The DPI makes are pushing it to eliminate the nescience (threat) that the smaller operations like JDC and CORE are providing. Especially Cadillac and Acura. I guess its like the establishment media not liking alternative options such as Infowars. So they are trying to persuade big tech to hold the them down. Same concept. Substitute CNN/NBD for GM and Honda. JCD/CORE for Infowars. IMSA for Google/Facebook.

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

Yeh, almost like conversation is dependant in context! Glad we sorted that one out. We’ll have none of that context here thank you very much!

Context? 'Eliminate the nescient threat that a smaller operation like JDC and Core are providing'. How in the heck are they eliminating that threat by providing the likes of JDC and Core with a more competitive chassis (within the DPi mfgs. eyes)? That dog don't hunt!










L.P.

[chernaudi]

Factory backed/supported vs privateer with an off the shelf LMP2 car. JDC supported the split, but that may be at least in part due to them seeking--and getting--a DPI chassis/engine for next year.

IMO, we're getting into a possible situation where the factory supported teams have spent money on development and don't want to be pegged back to a non-developed ACO compliant car that a fraction of the money has been spent on.

Granted, a lot of this is IMSA's own making by allowing DPIs development that the LMP2s couldn't have due to the ACO agreement, yet wanting to keep LMP2 as the primary performance bench mark.

[Bcarr6]

Don’t get what this big argument is about-

Cadillac would rather a potential race winner in JDC is running a Caddy, instead of another brand of car.

That way if JDC win, Caddy say Yay we won! Go Caddy!

If Action Express win, yay we won! go Caddy!

Point is outside of pure race fans the only thing in a marketing perspective is a Caddy car won. Doesn’t matter if it’s factory or privateer or some mix of both- a car... made by Caddy... won....

[chernaudi]

Not to get into semantics, but it'd be a Dallara chassis, GM engine that won, both badged by Cadillac.

But I get the point. We've already seen that Cadillac doesn't care much who wins...as long as it's a Cadillac DPI of some type. The addition of JDC I doubt changes that.

[FormulaFox]

Originally Posted by HORNDAWG

Also, where is the notion that ESM will not be in the Nissans next year coming from? That is NOT what the article says.

The notion that ESM MIGHT not be in Nissans next year comes not from that article, but from the ever-present problem of the million-dollar manufacturer participation fee. Patron was covering that little matter.

Either ESM needs another sponsor to cover it, there need to be enough sales of Nissan DPis to cover it, or there need to be enough of both to cover it together. It is not IMPOSSIBLE, not by any stretch of the imagination, but it IS going to be an uphill battle for ESM to still be a Nissan DPi team next year.

[carbsmith]

I feel the need to point out that JDC Miller isn't even really a properly new outside GM team, it's just Stallings getting his car again.

[FormulaFox]

Originally Posted by carbsmith

I feel the need to point out that JDC Miller isn't even really a properly new outside GM team, it's just Stallings getting his car again.

Stallings is not an actual member of the team, he just funds one of their cars.

[TF110]

Do you have to pay the manufacturer fee every year? If so, is it the same cost? That seems excessive imo. I could see a one-time fee of a pretty large sum and then once entered the fee to stay becomes significantly less.

[FormulaFox]

Originally Posted by TF110

Do you have to pay the manufacturer fee every year? If so, is it the same cost? That seems excessive imo.

Yes, yes, and yes. And it's also on top of other common entry fees, which is why it's so widely hated. Two manufacturers that I know of opted not to build DPis EXPRESSLY because of the fee - though one of them is still present in GTD thanks to someone else covering the fee, as the single million-dollar fee covers ALL classes(Nissan did try to sell GT-Rs for GTD teams when Patron put up the money, but nobody was interested).

I could see a one-time fee of a pretty large sum and then once entered the fee to stay becomes significantly less.

This has been proposed repeatedly but IMSA won't consider it.

[chernaudi]

What is this fee supposed to do (aside from line IMSA's and NASCAR's pockets)?

[Akrapovic]

$300,000 is the manufacturer entry fee. $700,000 is for advertising expenses. It is paid as a full $1m.

[FormulaFox]

Originally Posted by chernaudi

What is this fee supposed to do (aside from line IMSA's and NASCAR's pockets)?

As Akrapovic noted, 700 grand of it is SUPPOSED to be for advertising, but IMSA's been rather...silent on how they've been using that. From outside observation they don't seem to have done much of anything with it. The rest of basically an additional entry fee.


This is why myself and numerous others(inside and out) derisively refer to it as a mandated bribe. It doesn't seem to be used for anything and it's in addition to standard entry fees.

[seanyb505]

I wonder if any of it went to NBC. (Or fox)

[MaskedRacer]

The Daytona 24 race this year shows that a field size in the mid 40's works very well. If the 2019 race gets a 42-46 car grid then we can be in for a good one again.

60,70, even 80 car grids are no longer needed anyway because of reliability of the race cars has improved so much. You don't get 40% of the field finishing the race like in the 1990's. Today its 80-90%

[joeb]

And MP now reporting Juncos to Caddy for next year.

https://twitter.com/marshallpruett/s...288792576?s=19

[Bcarr6]

Confirmed on S365

https://sportscar365.com/imsa/iwsc/j...ntry-for-2019/

[Damian Baldi]

Woow, that's a surprise and a good news, but we have a Caddy invasion.

[Bcarr6]

So ten cars confirmed, 3 current DPI teams in the balance, kinda looking less likely, with another three current P2 cars unconfirmed for either P2 or DPI

Performance Tech have been on and off this year so cant see them stepping up, PR1 are pretty heavily PRO-AM so can see them staying in P2. I have no idea on CORE?

ESM are on an uphill for a DPI return, maybe they go PRO AM in P2? Maybe the same can be said for Spirit of Daytona.

That said, if enough of those maybes dont happen or even go DPI, then the new seperate P2 field is going to be pretty small

DPI Confirmed - 10 Entries

Action Express - Cadillac DPi-V.R
Action Express - Cadillac DPi-V.R
Wayne Taylor Racing - Cadillac DPi-V.R
JDC-Miller Motorsports - Cadillac DPi-V.R
JDC-Miller Motorsports - Cadillac DPi-V.R
Juncos Racing - Cadillac DPi-V.R
Acura Team Penske - Acura ARX-05 DPI
Acura Team Penske - Acura ARX-05 DPI
Mazda Team Joest - Mazda RT24-P DPI
Mazda Team Joest - Mazda RT24-P DPI

Maybe - 3 Entries

Extreme Speed Motorsports - Nissan DPI??
Extreme Speed Motorsports - Nissan DPI??
Spirit of Daytona Racing - Cadillac DPi-V.R??

Remaining P2 cars undeclared -

Core Autosport - Oreca 07
AFS/PR1 mathiasen Motorsports - Ligier JS P217
Perfomance Tech - Oreca 07