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Old 29 Jun 2019, 08:40 (Ref:3914738)   #1
Casper
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Why Does Anyone Who Complains or Criticises...

I chopped the header short because I couldn't think of a shorter way to put it.

We have a new trend in F1 fandom, if someone within the teams dares to even open his or her mouth and express dissatisfaction of something they are automatically accused of whining by the fandom of the sport. Is it fair to say the fans are whining also? I must admit if anything turns me off F1 it will be the childish attitude of the fans and their attitude surrounding this.
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Old 29 Jun 2019, 08:59 (Ref:3914740)   #2
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It's the way of the world these days. People have to be careful these days, especially with the rise of social media. It's likely to be jumped on almost immediately if they say the wrong thing. I applaud anyone who tries to rise above that and say what they think, whether we agree or disagree with it
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Old 29 Jun 2019, 11:02 (Ref:3914753)   #3
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I chopped the header short because I couldn't think of a shorter way to put it.

We have a new trend in F1 fandom, if someone within the teams dares to even open his or her mouth and express dissatisfaction of something they are automatically accused of whining by the fandom of the sport. Is it fair to say the fans are whining also? I must admit if anything turns me off F1 it will be the childish attitude of the fans and their attitude surrounding this.
Yes the fans whiny all the time. People are miserable, it appears worse nowadays, as social media has allowed that to be easily expressed. People feel clever if they can point out something that is wrong. The real tragedy is this drowns out good, considered, critical observations and means the fan voice is difficult to listen too.

But isn’t this whining about the fans whining? do I win a prize for this?
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Old 29 Jun 2019, 11:19 (Ref:3914755)   #4
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Theres so much whining about F1 even my sheep are whining about.
They dont watch it on TV anymore,infact they won't have a baaaa of it anymore.
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Old 29 Jun 2019, 19:55 (Ref:3914829)   #5
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The problem is that it attracts fans,as opposed to died in the wool enthusiasts, and has done so ever since it became a made for TV soap opera . That means silly tribalism , conspiracies and childish spats between rival factions, few of whom actually watch races (of any sort ) from trackside . F1 is a TV reality show.



I love motor sport , including but absolutely not confined to F1 , and I believe it is a very broad church - from club racing and speed events to rallying and single seater racing.



I have watched the sport for 50 years - and all I want is a good race, never really fussed who wins.



I can whinge , of course , so don't get me started on the simply obscene cost of F1 , the absurd leverage manufacturers have and the fact that F 1 consorts with some very shady regimes . I wouldn't be paid to attend races in totalitarian hell holes like the UAE or Azerbaijan , for example .
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Old 30 Jun 2019, 01:47 (Ref:3914863)   #6
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Theres so much whining about F1 even my sheep are whining about.
They dont watch it on TV anymore,infact they won't have a baaaa of it anymore.

When is this forum going to get a "like" feature...
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Old 30 Jun 2019, 01:52 (Ref:3914865)   #7
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Theres so much whining about F1 even my sheep are whining about.
They dont watch it on TV anymore,infact they won't have a baaaa of it anymore.
Are your sheep died in the wool F1 fans that have earnt the right to bleat about F1?
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Old 30 Jun 2019, 04:32 (Ref:3914869)   #8
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Originally Posted by Casper View Post
I chopped the header short because I couldn't think of a shorter way to put it.

We have a new trend in F1 fandom, if someone within the teams dares to even open his or her mouth and express dissatisfaction of something they are automatically accused of whining by the fandom of the sport. Is it fair to say the fans are whining also? I must admit if anything turns me off F1 it will be the childish attitude of the fans and their attitude surrounding this.
If you are enjoying the current state or season of the sport, constant criticism of the same issue repeatedly can get tiresome. I can't talk much as I have been on both sides myself. Just check out my post from when the WEC was created... I was an inconsolable *******. I was also correct.
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Old 30 Jun 2019, 08:54 (Ref:3914889)   #9
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Yes the fans whiny all the time. People are miserable, it appears worse nowadays, as social media has allowed that to be easily expressed. People feel clever if they can point out something that is wrong. The real tragedy is this drowns out good, considered, critical observations and means the fan voice is difficult to listen too.

But isn’t this whining about the fans whining? do I win a prize for this?
Adam, stop whining about Casper whining about fans whining about drivers whining!
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Old 30 Jun 2019, 09:07 (Ref:3914891)   #10
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Adam, stop whining about Casper whining about fans whining about drivers whining!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oS8cRqLymaA

Now I'm putting a wining video up in response to whining about Casper whining about fans whining about drivers whining!
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Old 30 Jun 2019, 10:27 (Ref:3914903)   #11
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Hmm, now I'm thirsty!

But, why do people who watch F1 complain?

For me it's like watching an old friend of 50 odd years, die slowly from a crippling disease. I obviously recall the good times and the bad, which made up his or her character. But the sad thing about it is, that even if he or she continues to survive for a few more years, the disease has taken so much hold that he or she will never be that old friend again.

So, I'll keep on offering objective criticism knowing that people just think I'm old and irrelevant, whilst those of you who are the experts can solve the problem and put it out of its misery.
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Old 30 Jun 2019, 12:16 (Ref:3914915)   #12
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Complaints I get, we all have them but as soon as someone within F1 makes a complaint or even a suggestion they are whining according to the great unwashed. I have been watching F1 on and off for a bit longer than 50 years either in print or on TV when it became available and the fan base IMHO are becoming more moronic than the management of F1, is that possible? I was surprised it took three posts for the inevitable jokes to start, you guys are getting slower on the come backs.
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Old 2 Jul 2019, 19:52 (Ref:3915541)   #13
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obviously i love talking about, arguing about, and complaining about sports!

at times the narrative may seem worse today then in decades past and that may be down to online/social media stuff but for me the positives outweigh the negatives...harder to find but once you do you are likely to have the opportunity to interact with sizable group of knowledgeable and well reasoned fans.
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Old 2 Jul 2019, 20:40 (Ref:3915552)   #14
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What gets me is that whining has become automatic. And I agree with chillibowl that the proliferation of social media and the ease with which garbage can now be posted based upon absolutely no intelligent thought at all has something to do with it. But people do whine a lot these days. Even at work, the staff I work closely with in my team constantly whine about what they're expected to do, in the full knowledge that there is nothing they can do about it. I spent quite a long time a few years back doing management courses which my employer considered to be essential for all managers (and thus it was obligatory to go). I learned very little other than a lot of fancy new jargon and theories apparently to replace my common sense with, but I did learn that there is nothing so pointless as spending valuable time and energy whining about something that you have no power at all to change. Like Peter, I'm getting older now and yes, I'm probably irrelevant too, my only task on this earth these days is to persuade the weather Gods not to vent their ire with non-sun during Le Mans week, but am I worried about people moaning about F1? No, not really. It's not exactly end of the world stuff, is it?
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Old 3 Jul 2019, 21:57 (Ref:3915759)   #15
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They constantly complain.. If F1 disappeared they would complain about that too ..
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Old 4 Jul 2019, 08:26 (Ref:3915823)   #16
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People complain bitterly and lament the death of the sport all too quickly after a quiet race (France), and seemingly lose sight of the fact that bad races are quite inevitable, and then lo and behold a great race comes along (Austria).

Watch back some races from past eras (full race coverage, not the highlights) - there has always been boring / bad / noncompetitive races - races when the first two cars lap the entire field. Of course, we always remember the exciting bits, but who remembers the dull races?

That's not to say F1 is perfect. I would love to see the midfield teams able to bring the fight to the top 3 teams. And DRS is not really what I like to see, but is a necessary evil at the present time.
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Old 4 Jul 2019, 11:00 (Ref:3915842)   #17
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Yeah - but what we didn't have was a rule book two feet bloody thick which is apparently written , and applied , to suck every little bit of drama and spontaneity out of a sport whose heritage is founded on both .



It is absurd enough penalising a team because an engine blows up , but when every single move on track , almost every overtaking move that isn't by the ridiculous DRS triggers whingeing noises from the cockpit, a f****g 'investigation' (into why a racing driver drove, y'know , like he was..err...racing) and, as often as not , a 'penalty'.



It's insane , and it is turning my sport into a lame parody of what it should be .
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Old 4 Jul 2019, 11:15 (Ref:3915844)   #18
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Agreed wholeheartedly except for the autocensor dodge. Try to keep it clean.
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Old 4 Jul 2019, 11:17 (Ref:3915846)   #19
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I don't watch F1 any more, therefore I can stop whining about it. F1 doesn't value me as a fan, so why should I value it as a sport?
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Old 4 Jul 2019, 11:18 (Ref:3915847)   #20
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Oh, sorry, Coppice, I didn't realise it was your sport

Back to the OP though - others have already mentioned social media, forums like this and stuff on the Internet generally, but speaking from a very personal perspective it's the immediacy that's killing everything with negativity.

Time was you had to wait for your preferred Thursday publication to come along to catch up on what happened last weekend, and along with it came reasoned and in-depth analysis and additional background context that you could then sit in the pub and argue about/discuss with your friends.

Nowadays, we can all voice an opinion on any subject (whether we're familiar with it or not) immediately, wherever we are in the world. The context is usually missing, the reasons for whatever we're opining on aren't necessarily there, and it's usually easier to moan than it is to congratulate or whoop'n'holler with joy.

Along with the immediacy is polarity: if you're not with me, you're against me. Thankfully, most of the time, Tenths is a fairly nuanced place without a great deal of blinkered bias - although not always! - and it is possible to hold multiple viewpoints here without being slagged off endlessly. It's an island of nuanced, non-polarised calm in a sea of murky polarity

To me, the word "whiner" sits alongside "fanboy". It's a word that's used as a stick to beat people, and it shouldn't be.
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Old 4 Jul 2019, 17:06 (Ref:3915883)   #21
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It's 'my sport' because I have loved it for half a century . It may be yours too - and anybody else's who feels the same addiction.



I don't have exclusive rights , more's the pity . But my word (keeping it clean , please note Mr Mallett ) , there'd be some changes happening PDQ if I did .
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Old 5 Jul 2019, 13:00 (Ref:3916018)   #22
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In the days of news by print in magazines and the weekly comics the fan had little or no input and their was very little discussion about the management of any sort as all they reported was the races and maybe some team news and I am not sure that was a bad thing at all. Now we have the fan that includes himself inclusively with "my team" or "we need to do this or that" etc when they comment. Very tribal and not good for the sport at all IMHO but then I am an old fart who is not enamoured with a lot of social media and all it entails.
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Old 5 Jul 2019, 13:09 (Ref:3916020)   #23
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It's 'my sport' because I have loved it for half a century . It may be yours too - and anybody else's who feels the same addiction.
I think the point being made was around the use of 'my' as a possessive determiner for the sport, suggesting ownership of the sport.

Possible the correct terminology would be 'my favourite', thereby indicating a possession of the adjective and not the noun, or possibly 'my sport I love', indicating a possession of the verb

Unless the phrase 'my sport' was being used to indicate a participation?
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Old 5 Jul 2019, 15:38 (Ref:3916033)   #24
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as it so happens i have like officially become a member of several F1 teams by having joined their fan club, giving them my email, and buying some of their kit at the official team member discount price.

but seriously though, its pretty common for fans to see themselves as part of the 'team' and the sport and teams encourage this.

'my' country, 'my' government, 'my' religion...these possessive determiners are meant to indicate participation, inclusion in, and belief of not in ownership.

so getting back on point...i agree lots of issues with social media but surely people are not advocating that large scale participation is the root problem here?

sure you are going to see and hear a lot of people doing and saying a lot of goofy stuff but no sport is an island.

a big part of the experience of a sporting event is sharing that experience with potentially tens of thousands live, with million on TV, and untold more on line. interaction, even with the nutters out there, is all part of the show (and always has been) no?
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Old 6 Jul 2019, 04:19 (Ref:3916081)   #25
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I think the point being made was around the use of 'my' as a possessive determiner for the sport, suggesting ownership of the sport.

Possible the correct terminology would be 'my favourite', thereby indicating a possession of the adjective and not the noun, or possibly 'my sport I love', indicating a possession of the verb

Unless the phrase 'my sport' was being used to indicate a participation?

I think you are being a tad disingenuous. You know perfectly well what I meant , and you should also know that such usage is widespread and acceptable. My other sport is fly fishing by the way , although , as in the case of motor sport , I don't claim exclusive rights. Nor do I in the case of my music ...


Anyway , it's 6am and time for me to set off to watch some speed hillclimbing, another of my sports. Enjoy your day
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