[Team] Mercedes: Will they ever dominate again?

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by Skam85

Ocon and Russell would have to be the most underwhelming and petulant pairing for the 2025 grid if it happened.

Really why?

[chillibowl]

Is his manager actually Toto?

Feel like Toto would have to break Ocon of his best attribute, his aggressive style, in order to make him fit into the Merc team…but would that ruin him as a driver and as a client?

Bit like Flav never actually putting Webber into a Renault?

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

Is his manager actually Toto?

Feel like Toto would have to break Ocon of his best attribute, his aggressive style, in order to make him fit into the Merc team…but would that ruin him as a driver and as a client?

Bit like Flav never actually putting Webber into a Renault?

Lol!!!!

There are some parallels...

[chillibowl]

reluctant to share this but it seems like its becoming a 'bigger than it should be' story.

apparently someone has sent out a mass email claiming Merc have been sabotaging Ham.

obviously everyone denying, Toto, saying their is a police investigation, Vasseur also addressing how ridiculous the assertion is.

https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/c...-car-sabotage/

https://twitter.com/wearetherace/sta...68750628732943

i can understand leaving Ham out of 2024 discussions, offering GR first crack at updates and race strategies as the team starts preparing for 2024...but actual sabotage?

[Beau2]

Sounds like a conspiracy theory to me. Some of the die-hard LH fans want to find any excuse for why he's being beaten by Russell. There was similar nonsense flying around the first half of 2022.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

i can understand leaving Ham out of 2024 discussions, offering GR first crack at updates and race strategies as the team starts preparing for 2024...but actual sabotage?

I think I read something months ago (not too long after Hamilton's move was announced) that Mercedes was being more restrictive on what they share with Hamilton regarding future plans and that is as it should be. But I also agree that there is no reason to actively try to sabotage his results.

This does feel like some type of effort from an unhinged LH fan.

Richard

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Richard C

I think I read something months ago (not too long after Hamilton's move was announced) that Mercedes was being more restrictive on what they share with Hamilton regarding future plans and that is as it should be. But I also agree that there is no reason to actively try to sabotage his results.

This does feel like some type of effort from an unhinged LH fan.

Richard

Regarding Russell getting the upgraded front wing first - Shovlin: "Lewis said, if we’re going to start doing this where we haven’t got enough parts, let George run it in Monaco. There will be races in the future where we have a single update, and of course, we just alternate, from here on in. But Lewis actually made that decision quite simple for us.”

[Mike Harte]

And Mercedes have reported the matter to the police, as well as conducting enquiries themselves in the source of the communications. Wolff confirms that no members of the team are behind the matter.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/m...mail/10625689/

[chillibowl]

That’s the part that I found a bit odd/interesting…rather, if you are certain it’s not a team member then why inform the police?

To go after some two bit journalist who makes things up or a fan(atic) who has crossed the line? People make up and stir stuff all the time, will they go to the cops every time from now on?

Mind you I’m not against that, most of the nonsense stuff online is toxic and should be policed better and more certainly more accountability in what’s been said. Impossible I know but kind of good for them making this a police issue.

Not the same thing, but a Spanish court apparently just sentenced a couple of fans for yelling racist crap. Imo a change for the good.

[Mike Harte]

chilli, I think that it was the death element in the messaging that has made up their minds that it needed to be reported. So that, god forbid, an accident happened involving Hamilton, then fingers couldn't be pointed at Mercedes, especially as they had nothing to hide. It's really an insurance policy to cover their backsides!

[peebee2]

The one bizarre thing is if this has really been sent to the same list as the Horner emails, then that would seem to rule out over-enthusiastic fanboys wouldn’t it?

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by Mike Harte

chilli, I think that it was the death element in the messaging that has made up their minds that it needed to be reported. So that, god forbid, an accident happened involving Hamilton, then fingers couldn't be pointed at Mercedes, especially as they had nothing to hide. It's really an insurance policy to cover their backsides!

didn’t see that part of it.

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by peebee2

The one bizarre thing is if this has really been sent to the same list as the Horner emails, then that would seem to rule out over-enthusiastic fanboys wouldn’t it?

Why? Are you saying insiders are incapable of being fanatics?

Richarc

[peebee2]

Only the person who sent the Horner emails and those who received them know the full list, so this is going to be child’s play to work out who sent them.

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by peebee2

Only the person who sent the Horner emails and those who received them know the full list, so this is going to be child’s play to work out who sent them.

Ooh I really can't wait!!

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by peebee2

Only the person who sent the Horner emails and those who received them know the full list, so this is going to be child’s play to work out who sent them.

IMHO, there are two challenges here. First, the Google drive link from the Horner email leaked enough that it became public info. I can imagine that early on some (many) of the recipients likely forwarded the entire email (with distribution list included) to other colleagues, friends and family. Given this was months ago, I expect the number of people who have the eamil distribution list is much larger than you think. And frankly building an accurate list of who has that distribution list might be nearly impossible to do. Second, while I think I read there may be a death threat in the Hamilton email? I don't see there being any serious investigation. I think Toto making a police report is 90% theater to show the accusation is false and Mercedes has nothing to hide.

Richard

[S griffin]

Quite frankly we shouldn’t speculate too much. But it is worrying what Merc have received. Really no tolerance for that sort of thing

[PanozDP01]

Originally Posted by Skam85

Ocon and Russell would have to be the most underwhelming and petulant pairing for the 2025 grid if it happened.

I get it. You really dislike George Russell.

Underwhelming. Like that pass he did for the lead in Spain. Had 2 bad pit stops and a bad strategy call. And still finished 4th. In front of a Red Bull, McLaren and both Ferrari's.

[peebee2]

To be fair to George, it was clear homework had been done with regard to previous Montmelo race starts, and he really capitalised on that.

In contrast, you have to wonder if Lando had done anything similar - from his actions it certainly appeared not.

[Skam85]

Yeah that race start was cool, one of the better ones I've seen in a while. Always a good rush when you see a car come from way back and shoot around the outside of everyone.

[Born Racer]

Yeah, impressive. It took me a moment to realise it wasn't Hamilton! (Less impressive from me).

[PanozDP01]

Originally Posted by Skam85

Ocon and Russell would have to be the most underwhelming and petulant pairing for the 2025 grid if it happened.

And Russell just got his second win in the 2022 regs. But whatever you say.

[GT6]

Well perhaps they did not deserve it but they will take that

[peebee2]

Originally Posted by PanozDP01

And Russell just got his second win in the 2022 regs. But whatever you say.

Poor driving from both Max and Lando, but George was there to pick up the pieces, so good on him.

[Tourer]

George "did a Bradbury" (to use an Australian expression). The expression stems from Australian speed skater, Stephen Bradbury winning gold at the Salt Lake Olympics when the the rest of the field crashed in front of him - you can check out video of it here.

Or in the words of another famous Australian (Jack Brabham) - "to finish first, first you need to finish".

Yep, very lucky win for Mercedes but George was 3rd on pace and deserved to pick it up.