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Old 10 Nov 2019, 16:47 (Ref:3939731)   #46
broadrun96
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Originally Posted by chernaudi View Post
Either the ACO are doing a horrible job officiating this stuff, teams are pushing the rules too far, or both. Especially if a car passes pre-race tech and then flunks post race tech for seemingly no reason and nothing changed on the car during the race.
When is tech completed? If the team passes at the start of the event and doesn't maintain the requirements with setup changes that's on the team and NOT the officials. It sounds to me like most things teams have been DQ'd for us well within their ability to change and monitor.
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Old 10 Nov 2019, 17:51 (Ref:3939743)   #47
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Originally Posted by HopAlong View Post
Is the racing anymore artificial than what we have had since 2006 with the diesels and hybrids? during those years you could have built a car with a better aero, chassis, suspension and the best petrol only engine and still be seconds off the pace of the rules advantaged factory cars.

Mind you this success BoP is a load of crap and I don't understand why they can't just try and balance hybrid and non hybrid properly. Surely if they reduced the ICE power and reduced the hybrid power but allowed for it to be used for the whole straight, surely the cars would make lap time in a very similar way.
I think they've done most of what they can in the beginning which is give Toyota hybrid but take away from the engine and add weight. It started this season at 932kg but now has had reduced engine and hybrid even further. They've lost 4 seconds per lap at Shanghai going from qualifying. I think that's too far. What they should do is limit the mj/lap the hybrid puts out, keep the weight on but allow them their engine power back by relaxing the fuel flow. That way they aren't struggling to pass GTE's even. In the race it wasn't so bad, but that's because they mostly overrode the boost to save it for straights to not get blasted past by other prototypes.
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Old 10 Nov 2019, 19:28 (Ref:3939761)   #48
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Er... well done Rebellion!

I think..
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Old 10 Nov 2019, 21:25 (Ref:3939790)   #49
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Juntos should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid

Congratulations to the ACO stewards for achieving their own target of DQ a car after the race! Mission accomplished!

Regarding the race itself, I will not make any comment. Just because everyone is behaving like a clown, it doesn’t mean you have to join the circus.
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Old 11 Nov 2019, 09:20 (Ref:3939900)   #50
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Badlands99 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
'Interesting Race' ....... I think! Yes it was artificial, but isn't most racing in these BOP/Safety Car/FCY days?
Quite enjoyed it really, some good battles up and down the other classes as always ........ just a few more cars in GT Pro would be good. Pleased that Rebellion finally won in a 'straight fight' but I do think that the changes went a little too far. Toyota strategy and professionalism kept them in touch.
Good also to see Ginetta going in the right direction - both finished which was encouraging and they are progressing quickly through the usual new car/new team learning curve. Good effort!
Now to the UK TV coverage ........ Eurosport had the whole race and BT Sport appeared to have the last two hours so was able to see it all. BUT ........ Eurosport commentary was just painful! I can do Mark Cole as he at least has an idea of what is going on, but Tom Gaymor is just painful to listen to and sometimes just doesn't appear to know what is happening. It was nice to turn over to BT and listen to Alan McNish who definitely knows what he is doing.
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Old 11 Nov 2019, 09:25 (Ref:3939904)   #51
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Originally Posted by Badlands99 View Post
Now to the UK TV coverage ........ Eurosport had the whole race and BT Sport appeared to have the last two hours so was able to see it all. BUT ........ Eurosport commentary was just painful! I can do Mark Cole as he at least has an idea of what is going on, but Tom Gaymor is just painful to listen to and sometimes just doesn't appear to know what is happening. It was nice to turn over to BT and listen to Alan McNish who definitely knows what he is doing.
Somewhat related: I had to chuckle when they read out a tweet from a viewer saying something like 'these penalty rules are ridiculous, hypercar can't come soon enough'.
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Old 11 Nov 2019, 12:14 (Ref:3939941)   #52
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Somewhat related: I had to chuckle when they read out a tweet from a viewer saying something like 'these penalty rules are ridiculous, hypercar can't come soon enough'.
Hmm yes they have the liberty to do anything they like as they're not really the official ACO channel

My favorite was at LM 2010 when Martin Haven was imitating Jonathan Legard during ES night shift
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Old 11 Nov 2019, 12:46 (Ref:3939949)   #53
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Originally Posted by Badlands99 View Post
'Interesting Race' ....... I think! Yes it was artificial, but isn't most racing in these BOP/Safety Car/FCY days?
Quite enjoyed it really, some good battles up and down the other classes as always ........ just a few more cars in GT Pro would be good. Pleased that Rebellion finally won in a 'straight fight' but I do think that the changes went a little too far. Toyota strategy and professionalism kept them in touch.
Good also to see Ginetta going in the right direction - both finished which was encouraging and they are progressing quickly through the usual new car/new team learning curve. Good effort!
Now to the UK TV coverage ........ Eurosport had the whole race and BT Sport appeared to have the last two hours so was able to see it all. BUT ........ Eurosport commentary was just painful! I can do Mark Cole as he at least has an idea of what is going on, but Tom Gaymor is just painful to listen to and sometimes just doesn't appear to know what is happening. It was nice to turn over to BT and listen to Alan McNish who definitely knows what he is doing.
Didn't have Louise in the pit lane, which was disappointing.
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Old 11 Nov 2019, 13:03 (Ref:3939953)   #54
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Well enjoyed the race this weekend, had to watch it in two parts as spent weekend at the britcar event at brands hatch, but it was certainly an interesting race and felt really pleased that Rebellion won a race on the track, the performance of the toyota's were held back but as the race was much better for those changes we will see how future races pan out.
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Old 21 Nov 2019, 01:36 (Ref:3941855)   #55
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The penalties have gone a little too far imo. The Toyota's were barely passing GTE's on the straights. That's bad for safety. They should reduce the amount of hybrid power per lap instead of the amount of fuel so much. This is what really hurts the top speed. Reducing hybrid a little more won't hurt the top speed so much, but will their 4wd advantage in acceleration. That way they'll be closer to the non-hybrids in the way they make their lap time. I guess we'll see how it goes but if Toyota were this close at basically 'max' penalties. I don't see the non-hybrids winning again until they "lose a little".
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Old 29 Nov 2019, 20:43 (Ref:3943747)   #56
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Originally Posted by Chiana View Post
It'll be even worse at Bahrain (and that's double the length of this race) given that even if Toyotas finish 3rd or 4th or whatever, they'll still be receiving further bop penalties on top of this, right?
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Originally Posted by Mike E View Post
"currently the two Toyotas’ are pegged back as far as they can be by the success handicap regulations. The maximum handicap has been achieved by a combination of a 40% reduction in hybrid power, 7.5% drop in fuel energy and a 28kg minimum weight increase to the car."

https://racer.com/2019/11/09/insight...mpression=true
Already it's seeming questionable

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/...ap-in-bahrain/

The championship-leading car of Sebastien Buemi, Kazuki Nakajima and Brendon Hartley will contest the fourth round of the 2019-20 season with a 2.72 second per lap handicap compared to the ‘reference car’, which in this case is the No. 6 Ginetta G60-LT-P1 AER.

Toyota’s sister No. 7 car for Kamui Kobayashi, Mike Conway and Jose Maria Lopez – which trails the No. 8 by three points – will be made 2.51 seconds slower.

Both Toyotas were expected to be penalized by the same amount for Bahrain because both cars are more than 40 points clear of the No. 6 Ginetta which is last in the standings and therefore the reference vehicle.

The WEC rules published at the start of the season state that handicaps beyond 40 points’ worth cannot be made, meaning the TS050s should be penalized equally as long as they are above this threshold.

Last edited by Chiana; 29 Nov 2019 at 20:53.
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