[WEC] Ginetta LMP1

[S griffin]

I thought the only reason they would go to Fuji was for one last shot. But it seems they won’t even do that. So thanks for the effort Ginetta, just a shame it didn’t work out

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by TheMightyM

Who's suppose to step up and fund this two-car program that you and Aysedasi speak of?

No-one.

[Adam43]

I didn’t see it as a proposal that someone would or should! Your point, I believe, was simply if you’re going to do it then do it well. Which is valid.

[Akrapovic]

Originally Posted by TheMightyM

No. Just no. This is the Sunk Cost Fallacy. Ginetta's investment in LMP1 is a sunk cost, a cost that has already been incurred and cannot be recovered. Considering such sunk costs as a rationale to proceed is bad business practice — you should look only at prospective costs when making a decision otherwise you're likely to throw good money after bad.

Looking to the future, it's hard to see the business case for continuing. Even if the G60-LT-P1is a good design (not a given), it’s well behind the ORECA and BR1 in development. The future of current generation privateer LMP1 beyond 2020/2021 is extremely uncertain. Who's suppose to step up and fund this two-car program that you and Aysedasi speak of? (Manor/CEFC/TRSM/ were only in for one car — Ginetta was funding the second car.)

Completely agree with this. Unless someone like Jota turn up and say they'll run it, I can't see this car going any further.

[knighty]

I'm just speculating, but the withdrawal seems to align well with the installation and testing of the AER motor......perhaps they did some straight line testing and finally realised with a half decent motor the car was actually an aerodynamic turd?......so they withdrew the car?

A bit like the AMR LMP1 project, whereby the engine was blamed for everything bad, but it was actually the chassis that had pitiful aero performance and never stood a chance...….

Much like McLaren this year!

[EffectiveSprinkles]

To me it just looks like a simple case of there not being any money.

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by knighty

I'm just speculating, but the withdrawal seems to align well with the installation and testing of the AER motor......perhaps they did some straight line testing and finally realised with a half decent motor the car was actually an aerodynamic turd?......so they withdrew the car?

A bit like the AMR LMP1 project, whereby the engine was blamed for everything bad, but it was actually the chassis that had pitiful aero performance and never stood a chance...….

Much like McLaren this year!

Originally Posted by EffectiveSprinkles

To me it just looks like a simple case of there not being any money.

I think it's probably 30% A and 70% B honestly but it definitely feels like the money is driving this turn. And do we know how much a difference there is better powerplants?

[Turbodcc]

likely just the withdrawal of Manor from the program and paperwork takes longer that we would imagine.

They will likely turn it around and be at Shanghai. I would believe all the negative press about the mecachrome engine. its clear from F2 alone. But mecachrome came out and said it would need development so in my eyes they took what they thought was a good gamble against the other engine options, and now they've chosen the AER off the back of what is probably more to do with the car ready for a turbo engine installation rather than an NA.

No small task getting a full engine install prepped in a couple of months.

[TzeiTzei]

Originally Posted by Turbodcc

They will likely turn it around and be at Shanghai.

I don't see any reason why that would be likely. Unless they think it's the best non hybrid out there. The market to sell these cars seems to be pretty much nonexistent, and the Ginetta has to be seen as the last option for anyone willing to buy an LMP1. IMO there is no reason for Ginetta to throw more money at this turd.

[Akrapovic]

The car was matching Toyotas pace pre-season said Ginetta. Then at Le Mans it turned up without an aero kit, and the engine is apparently terrible. Despite being the first car announced, it's the least developed of the three customer chassis.

Silverstone comes around and it's basically put down to an admin rule for why they can't race. Then Fuji comes around and the car still isn't here. So realistically, it was never going to make Silverstone, was it?

We're pretty deep into the sunk cost fallacy at this point. Realistically, there aren't many teams who can make the leap to LMP1 right now (JCDC Jota being the obvious choice), so the number of potential customers is pretty limited. They can continue to pour money into it, or they can cut their loses.

[S griffin]

The other LMP privateers seem to have gone the right way about it and it’s got results

[Akrapovic]

In the least shocking news you'll read today, the Ginetta is not on the entry list for Shanghai.

However, DSC says the effort is far from done.

[joeb]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

In the least shocking news you'll read today, the Ginetta is not on the entry list for Shanghai.

However, DSC says the effort is far from done.

How far?

[canaglia]

Originally Posted by joeb

How far?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAsHFSrh0i8

[broadrun96]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

In the least shocking news you'll read today, the Ginetta is not on the entry list for Shanghai.

However, DSC says the effort is far from done.

Originally Posted by joeb

How far?

Well I think a Ginetta takes 250 days at 250 degrees with a good alder smoke until you can pull the chassis and serve with a good sauce.

[Bentley03]

Originally Posted by Akrapovic

In the least shocking news you'll read today, the Ginetta is not on the entry list for Shanghai.

However, DSC says the effort is far from done.

Personally, I haven't lost hope completely. The team name registered for the Super Season has to be the main sticking point, in terms of bringing new sponsorship to the programme. But I do think we'll see the car on track again, maybe for Le Mans (or even Spa and Le Mans) next year. For the 2019/20 season, it should be easier to bring in new money, as they will be rid of the CEFC banner currently associated with the programme. Not saying this is what will happen, but I do see a glimmer of hope that things could pan out this way.

[GT6]

Fingers are crossed but every announcement we get seems to make the situation look bleaker

[Aysedasi]

The trouble is, if they do come back, the darned thing needs to blow the other LMP1's into the reeds for it to make any sense for Ginetta to continue.....

[Akrapovic]

The other option here is they put the AER engine in the back and realised the car didn't move forward as much as they hoped. See: McLaren.

[Adam43]

Have they tested the thing since they changed the engine?

[gert]

Originally Posted by Bentley03

maybe for Le Mans (or even Spa and Le Mans) next year.

Frankly, if they don't do any other race, I am not sure I even *want* to see them at Le Mans. IMO, if they just don't turn up anywhere, their place on the Le Mans entry list should go to a team that does deserve it.
It would be a farce to turn down a team that raced all year long in favour of Ginetta.

I'd rather see a Racing Engineering LMP2 car than Ginetta at Le Mans.

[Tique]

Originally Posted by gert

Frankly, if they don't do any other race, I am not sure I even *want* to see them at Le Mans. IMO, if they just don't turn up anywhere, their place on the Le Mans entry list should go to a team that does deserve it.
It would be a farce to turn down a team that raced all year long in favour of Ginetta.

I'd rather see a Racing Engineering LMP2 car than Ginetta at Le Mans.

Totally agree with this. We have teams in ELMS that fully deserve to race at Le Mans

[S griffin]

That’s the problem of a super season. We have to continue into next year as well. Still, I highly doubt we’ll see Ginetta again

[Deleted]

As much as I agree that other _teams_ "deserve" to be there more, I also think that
A) Any LMP1 car should have priority over lower class entries. In other words, as long as you have P1 chassis, you have automatic entry to the 24 hours regardless whether it's full season or one-off.
B) I rather still see interesting individual exotic cars than more of the mandated clone chassis from LMP2, or BoP-GTs. Even if every one of those unique entries is ByKolles -level of absurdity, or indeed this fiasco of a project, it's still more interesting to look into...

[Aysedasi]

I don't necessarily disagree with that (being a prototype kind of guy myself), however the entry does need to be credible. It's a bit like saying if GT was the highest class that JLOC should get an entry for a Lambo, just because it's in that class.... Not saying that Ginetta are that bad, but as yet, they've not really proved any worth at all....