ERC 2013

[Barrie]

Originally Posted by Hickey

The way they have a core of competitors and then a couple of extras per event, it seems a lot like the Speedway Grand Prix. Maybe they will do more heats and have a points system, like the Speedway. Problem with that is the reliability, as I said before. If a Speedway rider bins it, chances are he'll be out again

I thought exactly the same when I read through. I do think the Speedway Grand Prix format is what is being planned. Five heats, top 8 into semi finals, top point scorers pick there lane in turn etc. SkyTV Saturday evenings, competitors will probably have more than one car. What a load of old ********.

[WJM]

Why are people harping on the FIA?? In the absence of a promotor they have been running the sport for the last 40 years or so. But apparently now from 2013 on they have sold the promotional rights to some private marketing company. It is this marketing company that proposes the changes outlined in the article.
You can get away from the FIA, but who is going to run the show then? The GRC is run out of the FIA, but people hate that too.

[WJM]

Originally Posted by richp175

isnt one of the remits of the FIA to promote all the genres of motorsport that is under its wing? a move of this scale will do nothing but kill off a form of motorsport that has shown itself to have a justifiably loyal fan base no matter what pitfalls have been put in the way of people to enjoy be it spectators or drivers.

That which is under the FIA wings. The only Rallycross under the FIAs wings is the ERC. There is not a lot of information, but you could assume that the marketing company that takes control of the ERC next year gets series sponsors, major tv broadcasts and increased media attention. That would surely produce lots of money streams for the drivers, organisers, promotors and FIA.
Should the FIA take care of those few amateur supercar drivers that contribute very little to the ERC as a whole? Should they hold back 'progress' and professionalism because a few hobbyists might get the raw end of the stick?? I guess the opinions vary.

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by WJM

Why are people harping on the FIA?? In the absence of a promotor they have been running the sport for the last 40 years or so. But apparently now from 2013 on they have sold the promotional rights to some private marketing company. It is this marketing company that proposes the changes outlined in the article.
You can get away from the FIA, but who is going to run the show then? The GRC is run out of the FIA, but people hate that too.

I don't care if FIA or some commercial company is running ERC. I have problems with stupid plans which are turning around the sport completely. You don't need to make these changes to create a commercial succesful series. Like I said before: The sport is healthy but it need only better promotion.

People don't like GRC because of the gap jump and the tracks. People don't care who's running the sport.

[FIRE]

Originally Posted by WJM

That which is under the FIA wings. The only Rallycross under the FIAs wings is the ERC. There is not a lot of information, but you could assume that the marketing company that takes control of the ERC next year gets series sponsors, major tv broadcasts and increased media attention. That would surely produce lots of money

We have to see if it's really creating money towards the drivers. It would not be the first time organizers are using participants as a milking cow.

Originally Posted by WJM

Should the FIA take care of those few amateur supercar drivers that contribute very little to the ERC as a whole? Should they hold back 'progress' and professionalism because a few hobbyists might get the raw end of the stick?? I guess the opinions vary.

If it's an official FIA championship they should to a certain extent.
I don't see why drivers like Kevin Proctor, Jos Jansen, Pavel Koutny are bad for the sport and holding back the pro's. Limiting talented drivers to take part because they are not part of the holy 14 is holding back.

BTW Without "hobbyists" there would be only one car on the grid (Foust).

[rallycrossnl]

Limited number of drivers, less races to qualify for 1 final etc, it all says one thing: tv format.
A few names with which the fans can 'identify', a couple of car brands appealing to brand-fanatics, easy to understand ( read: stupid proof) qualifying system. Instant drama, heroic winners. 30 mins of footage, 15 mins of advertising.
Branding, marketplacement etc is all rather easy that way.
Marketing textbook for dummys, chapters 1 to 4 I think
And indeed smells (cough) of USA involvement in how to kill a sport where it would benifit in so many other ways where you would have 100+ drivers batteling for the price and have 2 broadcasts of 1 hour between events.

Just my 2 eurocents.

[chunder]

Exactly nl, those were exactly my thoughts.

I fear we may have been sold down the river or at least prospectively, by the very people who have made rallycross a rather poor show in the US.

There is more to sport than tv and a few 5 minute sponsors, just ask speedway or UK rallying, all really struggling at the top level for crowds and drivers.

Ok ERC needs some work, but it should not be revolutionised with only one thing in mind, tv and sponsors and a few people who should know better coming up with rubbish like this

[NaBUru38]

There should be 10 guests to complete 24 cars.

[M.Lowe]

Those that usually do the ERC should drop it and commit to their home championships and hopefully try and get tv deals with Motors TV
Look at the French series that is better to watch im my mind on tv than erc.

If the BRC could bring in more foreign drivers then that would be a bonus too

[FIRE]

Compared to last year the TV coverage of the French series is poor.
But yes the national series could gain from these plans.

[chasing cars]

Originally Posted by M.Lowe

Those that usually do the ERC should drop it and commit to their home championships and hopefully try and get tv deals with Motors TV
Look at the French series that is better to watch im my mind on tv than erc.

If the BRC could bring in more foreign drivers then that would be a bonus too

And maybe the return of 1 off events like the grand prix as it use be, the superprix and the internations cup, though we shouldn't give up on the ERC at least until the story is officially confirmed.

[FIRE]

Besides Mad Mark did other drivers give an opinion?

[Mad Mark Watson]

my opninion it stinks !!
all about money for a selected few and those who work there arses off to fund their motorsport get hung out to dry

yes national championships will benefit but then where do you spaire to ?? £100k plus supercars doing 8 round national championships
whats point in voicing opninion deal already done with no BRDA and other driver assoc. we dont have say its already sold i heard

[AndyS]

Well I guess we're all going to have wait for the official annoucement before we know for sure. The FIA has form of handing things over to promoters who haven't got a clue what they are doing and make a complete mess of it. They don't seem to have learnt, which worries me that it may be a done deal already and they won't listen to fans, drivers etc. Time will tell.

[schanche]

Originally Posted by AndyS

Well I guess we're all going to have wait for the official annoucement before we know for sure. The FIA has form of handing things over to promoters who haven't got a clue what they are doing and make a complete mess of it. They don't seem to have learnt, which worries me that it may be a done deal already and they won't listen to fans, drivers etc. Time will tell.

I can't believe this is a done deal!

[Stephen H]

Originally Posted by Mad Mark Watson

its already sold i heard

really hope that's not the case. I think this will only cause national championships to go their own way. Why have a euro legal Supercar category in your national championship, when drivers won't be able to step up and do their local European round, or dip their toe in the European championship by doing a few rounds.

I fear a plan like this will make rallycross more fragmented.

[Chessmsport]

Originally Posted by schanche

I can't believe this is a done deal!

As the news is out there I would imagine it is, but i suppose after 33 years of spectating and competing in rallycross at home and abroad it is about time to find a new hobby and I can cross out the top item on my bucket list, that should save me some money.
Any suggestions on a new hobby gratefully received but nothing thats too physical

[rallycrossnl]

On the otherhand, there's a lot that needs to be changed in FIA santioned ERC.

False start in final and you're out rule, one of the most stupid rules in sport.
The name touringcars, this is a touringcar:
Touringcars, rebuild FWD > RWD... wtf?
Different clerk of the course on each race? Have one for all, and kick out the 'race director', his possition is crippled by the overrullings in the past anyway.
CotC needs to have 2 votes in 'meeting of the stewards, give him some power during those meetings.
The stewards need to be rotated over the fia sections after 3 or 4 or 5 years, now there's people who f*ck about with our sport for far to long behind the green clothed table. Say bye bye to them, greet new people with fresh ideas. And.. if they f*ck up, there needs to be a tool to get them out of the power possition they are in by majority of votes of the 'ERC drivers club' (not if 1 driver is angry over some minor rulling of course)
Bring back the black flag! Now no CofC in his right mind waves one, he'll choose the B/W over it any time. Firstly before he waves the black, he'll look over his shoulder to the race director, at that man's nod of the head the CotC will wave black. Then he has to wait for the meeting of the stewards outcome if that was the right flag... There's no power in the man's hands. Give it back.
Right now, even people in high power possitions advice drivers to run all laps if the black flag is out for them. New rule should read: black flagged? Stop. If not stopping, you're out for the next 2 events, no matter the outcome of an protest over the original black flag.
Not slowing down under red? Same 2 events rule.

You will be able to list a lot more I bet

[rallycrossnl]

I found another one.

6.4 There will be only one driver per car, no driver may compete in more than one car at an Event, and no driver may compete in more than one race in one and the same meeting.

One race... as in one heat? Or as in one class? Or two cars at the same time, one remote controled? is that forbidden???

11.9 Fuel control
At any time during an Event, it must be possible for the scrutineers to take at least 3 litres of fuel as a sample.

Euh... well, they are free to drive to a local gasstation and take (and pay) as much as they like, untill that tank is empty. Take a sample? of what? Where? from a drum with the label: for scrutinering samples only? from the tank in the car?

[Stephen H]

Originally Posted by Chessmsport

As the news is out there I would imagine it is, but i suppose after 33 years of spectating and competing in rallycross at home and abroad it is about time to find a new hobby and I can cross out the top item on my bucket list, that should save me some money.
Any suggestions on a new hobby gratefully received but nothing thats too physical

Mmm, let me think, do you want another hobby where you get drenched in Germany, woken by armed police in Portugal, and camp next to a revving engine on a trailer all night long in France?

The news isn't officially out there, no official press releases are there? So hopefully the story on ERC24 is leaked proposals?

Formula 3 seems to have enough national series that trott round European, though I read Gerhard Berger wants them to stop. As much as I hated having two series in Britain diluting the field of cars in each. With a restriction to 16 supercars, maybe a European open series is the answer for those that don't get invited to play.

Is there any news on how many rounds are planned for 2013. If its 10 again, what are they going to do, allow in just 1 Supercar driver from each country they have a round in? That leaves 4 spots for the like of tanner or TT, that don't have a home round and two wide cards.

What happens to the planned huge meeting that was going to be Loheac hosting the ERC in 2013?

[Mad Mark Watson]

lots of rumours and lots or arguments
do people just sit back and let it happen ?
i heard last night that deal was done back in january !

what happens to Ludvig supposed to be coming back next year ? to Holte to aspiring Pailliers, Peu, and me obviously i love to go to france to take the xsara home we cant do full champs but nice to have outings now and again does this mean that no new talent will come into rallycross ??

[mel tyres]

Originally Posted by Mad Mark Watson

lots of rumours and lots or arguments
do people just sit back and let it happen ?
i heard last night that deal was done back in january !

what happens to Ludvig supposed to be coming back next year ? to Holte to aspiring Pailliers, Peu, and me obviously i love to go to france to take the xsara home we cant do full champs but nice to have outings now and again does this mean that no new talent will come into rallycross ??

[Chessmsport]

Originally Posted by Stephen H

Mmm, let me think, do you want another hobby where you get drenched in Germany, woken by armed police in Portugal, and camp next to a revving engine on a trailer all night long in France?

And too think that one day we will look back at these as 'the good old days'

[Stephen H]

Originally Posted by Chessmsport

And too think that one day we will look back at these as 'the good old days'

After The dreadful camping conditions at Dreux this year, I already do look back to Essay as " the good old days"

[tbtstt]

Possibly overthinking this, but if the ERC adopts the GRC format, will they both remain seperate entities in 2013?...