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4 Aug 2003, 10:08 (Ref:679396)
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,598
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I hate to say I told you so (not!) - Williams on top
I know I've said this time and again all season, but just to be really boring and annoying I'd just like to have a little gloat about Montoya winning by a full minute! The Williams is the best car at the moment, no qualification needed... chassis, tyres, motor, drivers, aero etc - come on, credit where it's due.
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4 Aug 2003, 10:30 (Ref:679410)
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Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,179
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Here here.
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4 Aug 2003, 10:31 (Ref:679413)
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#3 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,179
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Have they ran the new gearbox yet?
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4 Aug 2003, 10:36 (Ref:679418)
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#4 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,598
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I don't know the answer to that - it has been mentioned in the same breath as some other big modifiations, and the bodywork at the back is quite different now... but I don't recall any press release saying that they were actually now racing it.
What delights me is that they are strong just about everywhere, including Monaco. Bodes well for Hungary I think - if the Michelin teams can restrict Ferrari to 5th or worse both championships will be well in Williams' sights. |
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4 Aug 2003, 10:42 (Ref:679425)
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#5 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 2,986
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Re: I hate to say I told you so (not!) - Williams on top
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Glen
I know I've said this time and again all season, but just to be really boring and annoying I'd just like to have a little gloat about Montoya winning by a full minute! The Williams is the best car at the moment, no qualification needed... chassis, tyres, motor, drivers, aero etc - come on, credit where it's due. [/QUote tires...tires...tires... ...thats the biggest advantage. Ferrari could barely keep up with Renault throught most of the race. You are correct though. As a complete package they do have the best right now. Last edited by neilap; 4 Aug 2003 at 10:45. |
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4 Aug 2003, 10:44 (Ref:679426)
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#6 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,179
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Well with Ralf seemingly out of the title chase after his DNF and 10 - place penalty, the smart money has to be on Montoya.
If Monty can win at Hungary, roll on Suzuka Montoya's favorite track! - its going to be a great autumn! Last edited by Sodemo; 4 Aug 2003 at 10:50. |
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4 Aug 2003, 10:48 (Ref:679428)
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#7 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,598
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neilap - In case you hadn't noticed there are some other teams using the same tyres! One being McLaren, who many claimed to have a far superior chassis to Williams. The Renault is a very impressive chassis too - but they've been well beaten at all kinds of circuits, including places where their engine disadvantage shouldn't matter.
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4 Aug 2003, 10:49 (Ref:679429)
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#8 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 13,000
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Considering the advantage Williams should have at Monza and Indy, it might be better for the series if Kimi wins Hungary to stay in the fight, with Michael and Montoya both scoring minor points. This does look to be McaLren's best remaining chance of a win, unless they bring out the new car.
If Ralf does rescue a result in hungary, especialyl if the appeal is successful, he isn't out of the hunt either. he could be only 8 points down from Michael with 3 tracks to go, and the confidence boost could do enough, eepsecialyl if hew outperforms Montoay by a lot. What a shame there's only one race in the next 6 weeks. I can't wnit to see if Williams can overcome Michael's advantage. |
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4 Aug 2003, 10:54 (Ref:679431)
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#9 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,179
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But isn't it really great to see someone other than M Schu winning races, I mean for the good of the sport.
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4 Aug 2003, 10:55 (Ref:679432)
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#10 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 2,508
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Montoya must be regretting throwing away the win in Melbourne at the moment although i think he's a good thing for the title.
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4 Aug 2003, 11:01 (Ref:679437)
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#11 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,179
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Yes, speaking as a Montoya fan, his Melbourne spin was a stupid error which he should not have made, as he was leading by a fair margin, still he only dropped 2 points as he finished 2nd, so it wasn't a total loss.
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4 Aug 2003, 13:13 (Ref:679587)
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#12 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,598
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Consider this also: Montoya's engine was limited from lap 15 onwards! The official line seems to be that it was accidental (Montoya seemed confused about a lack of top end speed when he spoke about it in the press conference) - but I'd be suspicious of the team giving him a helping hand to save his engine. Especially considering the heat, I find this quite plausible. All that pace, without the famous top-end of the BMW motor!
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4 Aug 2003, 13:51 (Ref:679622)
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#13 | ||
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Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
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Posts: 5,181
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Well, Todt seems to think that the Ferrari will have troubles in Hungary, but will exhibit Silverstone-like competitiveness for the remaining three races.
On top of that, lets not forget that Suzuka is the Bridgestone home circuit. In short, I don't think the Williams-Michelin package will be as dominant in the remaining races. |
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__________________
"And the most important thing is that we, the Vettels, the Bernies, whoever, should not destroy our own sport by making stupid comments about the ******* noise." - Niki Lauda
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4 Aug 2003, 14:17 (Ref:679646)
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#14 | ||
 Race Official20KPINAL
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 21,606
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Not so sure. Monza and Indy are great for them.
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__________________
Show me a man who won't give it to his woman An' I'll show you somebody who will
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4 Aug 2003, 14:19 (Ref:679648)
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#15 | |
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 5,598
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To a degree... Certainly Suzuka is the kind of track that suits Ferrari, and the temperatures tend not to be so high there. Monza and Indianapolis don't have much for Ferrari to get over-confident about though, especially the latter with its combination of extreme twistiness and flat-out acceleration which is very much the FW25's cup of tea.
ah - I'm not the only one - Cheers Bononi. Last edited by Glen; 4 Aug 2003 at 14:20. |
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4 Aug 2003, 14:33 (Ref:679662)
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#16 | ||
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Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2001
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The Empire will strike back after the testing ban is lifted. You will see.
FORZA FERRARI!!!! |
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__________________
"And the most important thing is that we, the Vettels, the Bernies, whoever, should not destroy our own sport by making stupid comments about the ******* noise." - Niki Lauda
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4 Aug 2003, 15:02 (Ref:679685)
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#17 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 729
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Sorry man. Vader is being turned on by his brother. Luke Schumacher and the other hero Juan Solo are on the rampage.
I'm hangin out for a lightsaber duel at Suzuka. ^_^ She's gonna be an interesting end to the season and with some luck Japan will be the decider. This season has been pretty damn interesting so far. A nail biter would only do it justice. |
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__________________
Gawky supermodels may look stunning in the right clothes, on the right catwalk, in the right city, but in an M&S jumper, on a crowded street, on a wet Wednesday afternoon, only classic good looks will catch the eye. - Ian Eveleigh.
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4 Aug 2003, 19:14 (Ref:679862)
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#18 | |||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 2,986
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Quote:
Maybe you did not notice that Michelin has brought the goods this year while BS has not. I think the Williams has become the 2nd best car now but on equal footing the Ferrari should still be faster. Call it what you must. But dont believe for a second that Renault, Mclaren, and Williams have all surpassed Ferrari in half of a season. Why have all the Michelin teams made huge strides, even the Mclaren which is 2 years old, while all the BS teams have fallen by the wayside? Its common sense. Dude, Toyota and Jaguar were faster than Ferrari in qualifying at times this weekend! Look at the common factor. Here is some more evidence. Look at the fastest laps of the race... Hockenheim - fastest laps in the race 1. Juan Pablo Montoya: 1'14"917 - lap 14 2. David Coulthard: 1'15"003 - lap 14 3. Jarno Trulli: 1'15"740 - lap 13 4. Olivier Panis: 1'15"883 - lap 34 5. Cristiano Da Matta: 1'16"051 - lap 35 6. Fernando Alonso: 1'16"060 - lap 16 7. Michael Schumacher: 1'16"081 - lap 36 8. Jenson Button: 1'17"430 - lap 41 9. Mark Webber: 1'17"754 - lap 48 10. Nick Heidfeld: 1'18"036 - lap 10 Last edited by neilap; 4 Aug 2003 at 19:19. |
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4 Aug 2003, 22:01 (Ref:679984)
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#19 | ||
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Ten-Tenths Hall of Fame
Veteran
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 5,181
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I'm with neil. The biggest factor to the resurgence of Williams is tyres - by far. And its not too late for Bridgestone to get it together - at least enough for Ferrari to be competitive over the last few races and for Michael to squeeze out his 6th.
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__________________
"And the most important thing is that we, the Vettels, the Bernies, whoever, should not destroy our own sport by making stupid comments about the ******* noise." - Niki Lauda
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4 Aug 2003, 22:49 (Ref:680008)
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#20 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 11,179
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Blimey, the way people are talking its like they actually want TGF to win a 6th title!
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5 Aug 2003, 02:21 (Ref:680111)
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#21 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 2,986
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I just want to see racing where the best car driver combination wins. I don't want MS to win again but it must be the worst thing in the world to have the only factor that you don't have complete control over cost you a title.
(I will eventually get over the whole BS situation, it just takes time) Williams have done really well. I do want to see JPM win. He deserves it. He is also talented enough to be recognized as a true champion, a racer and a fierce competitor. |
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__________________
Eventually we learn
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5 Aug 2003, 02:35 (Ref:680112)
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#22 | ||
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Race Official 1% Club
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 46,695
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In the same way Bridgestone was an advantage to Ferrari in 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002... they are now something of a millstone. Should we reset the records of the past because the top teams were running Michelin when the Bridgestones were a demonstrably better product? I dont think so....
JPMonty for 2003, I'd like to see that... then he can drift off to fill Coulthard's seat at MacMerc, take the #1 with him..... 
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__________________
Happy David Thexton Day, 21st March 2003 “I am not uncertain” - Dollar Bill Stern, Billions “Fear stimulates my imagination” - Don Draper, Mad Men “Everybody Lies” - Dr Gregory House, House “Trust But Verify” - Commissioner Frank Reagan, Blue Bloods
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5 Aug 2003, 02:53 (Ref:680116)
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#23 | ||
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Veteran
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 5,073
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Best season in recent memory - these next 4 races are going to be good stuff!
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__________________
"He's still a young guy and I always think, slightly morbidly, the last thing you learn is how to die and at the end of the day everybody learns every single day." - The Ever-Cheerfull Ron Dennis on Lewis Hamilton.
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5 Aug 2003, 03:14 (Ref:680125)
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#24 | ||
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Veteran
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Sure the tires are there, but the MP17 was the better car at the start of the year. The Williams improved massively. I never imagined this difference.
Both JPM and Williams have struggled with consistancy, so it will be interesting to see what happends. The other big factor is the Ralf vs. JPM thing. Ralf seemed to improve massively while JPM was slumping. In Germany JPM seemed to pick it up a notch while Ralf didn't seem to lose anything. If they are this close they could hurt each other and give up ground to MS. Frankly I'd much rather that then have team orders. |
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__________________
No Rotor, No Motor.
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5 Aug 2003, 03:55 (Ref:680142)
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#25 | ||
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Race Official 1% Club
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 46,695
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But Ralf's penalty for the next round should put paid to any rivalry with JPM.. not even a good strategy can overcome 10 places on the grid usually
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__________________
Happy David Thexton Day, 21st March 2003 “I am not uncertain” - Dollar Bill Stern, Billions “Fear stimulates my imagination” - Don Draper, Mad Men “Everybody Lies” - Dr Gregory House, House “Trust But Verify” - Commissioner Frank Reagan, Blue Bloods
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