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Old 15 Jun 2004, 13:40 (Ref:1004764)   #1
Green Monster
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Green Monster should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Why do racecar makers ask ten of thousands when boat/aircraft makers ask thousands?

How is it that in boats and airplanes prices for structures went DOWN when composites were introduced while in motorsports they went UP?. How did the belief start in motorsports that to keep costs affordable you need to stay AWAY from a sandwich composite chassis? Why is that the a composite chassis in motorsports has come to be associated only with the most expensive cars?

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Old 15 Jun 2004, 14:59 (Ref:1004865)   #2
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zefarelly should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridzefarelly should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridzefarelly should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
how much does a Riva boat cost ?

its only rich people that spend silly money . . .the rest of us shop around until we find it somewhere cheaper
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Old 15 Jun 2004, 15:03 (Ref:1004869)   #3
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how much does a Riva boat cost ?

its only rich people that spend silly money . . .the rest of us shop around until we find it somewhere cheaper
Depending on which aircraft you're looking at, you can get a half dozen to a dozen sandwich composite kitplanes for the price of one engineless unassembled CART or IRL chassis.
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Old 15 Jun 2004, 15:55 (Ref:1004937)   #4
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Its a clever trick by the industry to keep prices high. People in motorsport tend to think that composites are expensive because they are extremely difficult to make. We are only recently seeing prices start to come down now that a few guys have learned the truth and started making cheap carbon hill climb cars.
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Old 15 Jun 2004, 15:59 (Ref:1004947)   #5
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Originally posted by Mackmot
Its a clever trick by the industry to keep prices high. People in motorsport tend to think that composites are expensive because they are extremely difficult to make. We are only recently seeing prices start to come down now that a few guys have learned the truth and started making cheap carbon hill climb cars.
Thank god some people are catching on.
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Old 15 Jun 2004, 21:57 (Ref:1005327)   #6
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avsfan733 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
it should also be pointed out that the shape of a hull and deck are probably easier to make then the shape of a racecar and allows for the use of larger single pieces as opposed to the often thousands of pieces that go into a racecar monocque
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Old 16 Jun 2004, 09:11 (Ref:1005608)   #7
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Manufacturers will argue that the R and D has to be covered, but I think they will charge what they can get away with.
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Old 16 Jun 2004, 09:21 (Ref:1005614)   #8
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zefarelly should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridzefarelly should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridzefarelly should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Avsfan has a point . . .a hull or wing would use large full sheets . . . .a car is more likely to need as many sheets for a smaller construction due to the wastage etc.
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Old 17 Jun 2004, 05:10 (Ref:1006453)   #9
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example: the tub for the Mclaren F1 road car had over 3000 pieces and this was years ago. If you notice, the boats and such you pictured are not made of prepreg they are wet layup procedures. this is more labor intensive but requires less of a specialist then does laying up prepreg. They also don't autoclave these boats. Autoclaves themselves are incredibly expensive in a large enough sze to do a tub and are also expensive to run...I don't know how hard points work for boats but that is another large part of the effort expense of a carbon tub racecar
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