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Old 29 Sep 2013, 16:24 (Ref:3310741)   #26
JeremySmith
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Originally Posted by ECW Dan Selby View Post
This forum's becoming painful.

Selby
Yes I don't know what to make of this one to be honest, Giancarlo Minardi is certainly not a beginner...

Start a new thread Selby.. choose an interesting subject..

Overall I think people are finding RedBull walking to another title a bit of a yawn..
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Old 29 Sep 2013, 20:37 (Ref:3310815)   #27
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Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!
I like Red Bull
I hate Vettel
I hate Red Bull
I like Vettel
I think Red Bull do this
I think Vettel does that
I think Red Bull do that
I think Vettel does this....

I just thought I'd note down a few possibilities for the next 8 threads in the F1 subforum.......
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Old 29 Sep 2013, 20:41 (Ref:3310822)   #28
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Mekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridMekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridMekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Ten years ago we had the same dilemma with TGF and Ferrari. Oh memories...
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Old 29 Sep 2013, 21:31 (Ref:3310835)   #29
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Originally Posted by Aysedasi View Post
I like Red Bull
I hate Vettel
I hate Red Bull
I like Vettel
I think Red Bull do this
I think Vettel does that
I think Red Bull do that
I think Vettel does this....

I just thought I'd note down a few possibilities for the next 8 threads in the F1 subforum.......
Vettel does happen to be winning in F1 and he excites controversy. The F1 section is going to reflect this. I'm not sure what you guys want.
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 01:15 (Ref:3310876)   #30
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Mekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridMekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridMekola should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
BTW, strange that it was Giancarlo Minardi who made this observation. Considering his team is now Toro Rosso, where Vettel did his first win in 2008 Italian GP.
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 07:59 (Ref:3310949)   #31
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Originally Posted by Paradise City View Post
Vettel does happen to be winning in F1 and he excites controversy. The F1 section is going to reflect this. I'm not sure what you guys want.
I want to be able to say what I want, thanks. The fact that 2 threads out of 3 are about Vettel or RBR bores me, but I accept that's my problem. Sadly, the only controversy we're seeing is almost entirely manufactured, which really speaks for itself in terms of how many truly entertaining/exciting/novel things there are to talk about....
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 08:21 (Ref:3310957)   #32
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Your not aloud to say what you want, that's against rules and regulations.
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 08:30 (Ref:3310959)   #33
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Originally Posted by Mekola View Post
BTW, strange that it was Giancarlo Minardi who made this observation. Considering his team is now Toro Rosso, where Vettel did his first win in 2008 Italian GP.
Not a fair comment: First the controversy about traction control is on before Minardi's pov and is a real question mark. Second, Vettel's TR was an exact replica of the RB at that time.
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 10:11 (Ref:3310994)   #34
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Originally Posted by Aysedasi View Post
I want to be able to say what I want, thanks. The fact that 2 threads out of 3 are about Vettel or RBR bores me, but I accept that's my problem. Sadly, the only controversy we're seeing is almost entirely manufactured, which really speaks for itself in terms of how many truly entertaining/exciting/novel things there are to talk about....
What's manufactured?
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 11:38 (Ref:3311022)   #35
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How absurd, just an old timer wanting people to notice him again.

Why would RB use a cheat at Singapore when the title is almost wrapped up?
Who would possibly consider authorising it. Surely not Vettel, when being caught cheating could destroy his career. Surely not Red Bull management when it could irreparably damage their brand?

People can dominate even in spec series - look at the Ginetta Junior UK championship - one driver won every race in the run to the title, even though the cars are completely spec and all main components are sealed.
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 12:04 (Ref:3311037)   #36
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Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!Aysedasi is the undisputed Champion of the World!
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Originally Posted by Paradise City View Post
What's manufactured?
If I really need to answer that, I think I'll just give up........
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 12:18 (Ref:3311041)   #37
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If I really need to answer that, I think I'll just give up........
I don't know what you meant because someone deleted the article that I had only scanned over briefly before but I can actually see it tucked away on post 6 of this thread.

I think the accusation is that Renault is uniquely giving Seb more juice? That he has 'special' software the others lack? If he has suspicions, fine, he needs to cough up more than circumstantial evidence if he is to go to press. They have a very poor media in Italy, their lackadaisical media standards is second nature over there.
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 12:34 (Ref:3311043)   #38
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http://youtu.be/8DwXOPN7ZIM video of engine note from singapore, vettel is on the throttle much earlier than the others
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 13:27 (Ref:3311062)   #39
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I can't see the grassy knoll in that video but I clearly saw what I was told to see...

These unfounded accusations along with its adherents is beyond ridiculous and desperate.
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 13:33 (Ref:3311065)   #40
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Your not aloud to say what you want, that's against rules and regulations.
No, that rule is just for you.

We're in a hiatus of genuine interest. Hopefully this will change when we reach the build up to 2014. Many changes with new rules and driver moves. Maybe it'll give F1 the reinvigoration it needs.
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Old 30 Sep 2013, 20:56 (Ref:3311198)   #41
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Can someone explain how come no rival teams, drivers, or engine manufacturer engineers ever noticed anything wrong with Vettel's car, yet Minardi, who was out of F1 business for many years, finds something so obviously wrong?

My personal explanation.. almost every dropped the ball on car development after Spa. Heck, maybe even before Spa. Supposedly Red Bulls main rivals are already working on 2014 car full time. Ferrari announced loud and clear that they will work on 2014 program if they don't do well in Spa.

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Old 30 Sep 2013, 22:23 (Ref:3311225)   #42
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Well, conspiracy theories is part of F1, so I guess it will fade away with time.
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Old 1 Oct 2013, 01:55 (Ref:3311274)   #43
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How absurd, just an old timer wanting people to notice him again.

Why would RB use a cheat at Singapore when the title is almost wrapped up?
Who would possibly consider authorising it. Surely not Vettel, when being caught cheating could destroy his career. Surely not Red Bull management when it could irreparably damage their brand?

People can dominate even in spec series - look at the Ginetta Junior UK championship - one driver won every race in the run to the title, even though the cars are completely spec and all main components are sealed.
The well connected indulging in mass media booing?

Simply shouting baseless nonsensical accusations which intellectual gnomes from the press push in order to try and sell their equally worthless product!

Beyond pathetic!
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Old 1 Oct 2013, 08:26 (Ref:3311331)   #44
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The well connected indulging in mass media booing?

Simply shouting baseless nonsensical accusations which intellectual gnomes from the press push in order to try and sell their equally worthless product!

Beyond pathetic!

It is never as simple as that. Teams have always gone to the limits from McLaren to Ferrari - not mentioning Benetton - and sometimes beyond the limits (caught or not) but a 2.5 second advantage can only raise eyebrows in any categories.

The traction control device was 'spotted" earlier during the season on pictures if you remember. Whether it is that or the "secret exhaust system" or different engine mapping, we are to find out. It is clear RB are using extra devices on Vettel's car which are not on Webber's. The question is whether it is legal or not. And that's where you have no choice but to put your faith in the FIA and their judgement if it comes to it.

Last edited by ace007; 1 Oct 2013 at 08:45.
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Old 1 Oct 2013, 08:45 (Ref:3311336)   #45
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Goes to show how impressive Vettel is when industry ex-team bosses, who have nothing to gain, are trying to look for ways RB could be cheating to explain his dominance at Singapore.

Just remember a few races ago at Hungary, Vettel couldn't stay with Hamilton.

I just think Vettel was on it that weekend, and the rest weren't. Rosberg had older tyres and on a track you can't pass on, we never got to see the true pace of Alonso or Webber.
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Old 1 Oct 2013, 09:35 (Ref:3311355)   #46
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It is never as simple as that. Teams have always gone to the limits from McLaren to Ferrari - not mentioning Benetton - and sometimes beyond the limits (caught or not) but a 2.5 second advantage can only raise eyebrows in any categories.

The traction control device was 'spotted" earlier during the season on pictures if you remember. Whether it is that or the "secret exhaust system" or different engine mapping, we are to find out. It is clear RB are using extra devices on Vettel's car which are not on Webber's. The question is whether it is legal or not. And that's where you have no choice but to put your faith in the FIA and their judgement if it comes to it.
I don't remember... Any pics, or articles talking about it, or interviews with people from inside other teams about that before Minardi suggested it ?

An explanation as to why no other team complains it it's true would be welcome too. They complained a lot about the flexi-wings and the blown diffusers, hard to believe they would not say a thing about this (if it's true, of course)
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Old 1 Oct 2013, 10:35 (Ref:3311378)   #47
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Yea lets see a picture of "that traction control device", (because we POSITIVELY KNOW it was a traction control device) and a few links to articles describing it.

When you are done I have this bridge I need to get rid of, really cheap...
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Old 1 Oct 2013, 10:39 (Ref:3311381)   #48
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http://britishmotorsportnews.wordpre...rol-in-canada/
http://motoring.ninemsn.com.au/cars/...action-control
http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns25675.html


Autosprint article.
http://autosprint.corrieredellosport...-vettel/10584/

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Old 1 Oct 2013, 11:19 (Ref:3311399)   #49
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Ah, yes, those marks. After that I found a thread in some other forum where there were pics of Rosberg's Mercedes and a Force India drawing the same pattern on the tarmac at the same race, it was Montreal. So that theory got rapidly debunked.
Also, wasn't it only on Seb's car ? That's Webber.

Here, took me some time but found the pics.
This marks were from Rosberg's car (burnouts before the start of the GP)




Sutil recovering from a spin






Still no pic of "the device" ?
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Old 1 Oct 2013, 13:09 (Ref:3311453)   #50
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