Balaclavagate: did a team dob SBR in?

spectator22 · 12 Oct 2005, 01:20 (Ref:1431379)

Todays Motorsport News says that Stewards only acted on Luffs balaclava after they were alerted by an "AVESCO official" in pit lane. Chief steward Chopping says he doesnt know who brought it to the AVESCO officials attention! MN is suggesting it came from another team. Almost sounds like SBR were set up. Anyone have any info on who it could have been?

Aarrgh8 · 12 Oct 2005, 01:24 (Ref:1431382)

Set up to not wear their balaclavas?

spectator22 · 12 Oct 2005, 02:10 (Ref:1431409)

No. Why Car 1 was singled out, when others werent wearing balaclavas. And why in the middle of the biggest race of they year. As Ambrose says, why wouldnt it have been brought up in practice or drivers briefing if it was so important.

storyline · 12 Oct 2005, 02:11 (Ref:1431410)

AVESCO officials? Since when have there been AVESCO officials?

AVESCO employees yes, but they are NOT officials at any meeting.

They just seem to grow their own importance every meeting.

Uncle Cranker · 12 Oct 2005, 02:21 (Ref:1431419)

On the money Storyline.

Was the person in question a PIT LANE OBSERVER or an AVE$$CO employee with no actual juristiction over the competition rules that the drivers were abiding (or allegedly not) by during the running of the event.

As much as AVE$$CO hate to be viewed as similar to NASCAR, the "Pit Lane AVE$$CO people:" for lack of a better description are almost identical in role to the NASCAR pit lane officials, except for the previously mentioned lack of official capacity.

I'll throw this up for debate as well.

Would the person who cited the SBR drivers for lack of a balaclava NEED to be a Judge of Fact ?

Dazz · 12 Oct 2005, 02:24 (Ref:1431420)

Did somebody steal their balaclava's? No, then they did it to themselves I'm afraid.

You can't be busted for doing the wrong thing if you're doing the right thing.

Yes it was harsh, yes it ruined the race a bit, yes it was a petty thing but unfortunately they did the wrong thing and paid for it.

JABWOA · 12 Oct 2005, 03:15 (Ref:1431440)

UC, there is no need for person who sighted the non-bala wearing to be a Judge of Fact as it would be relayed to race control and then proof was in the pudding by watching the incar (but I believe pit lane marshals are declared judges of fact regarding pit stops & CPS).

What we need is someone with time on thier hands to go back and watch the entire race again to see if anyone else wasn't wearing them.

aj_308 · 12 Oct 2005, 03:24 (Ref:1431443)

Did we ever actually find anyone elso not wearing one?

Chucky · 12 Oct 2005, 03:59 (Ref:1431457)

There were a couple of drivers who made unscheduled changes and disappeared from view with their helmets still on. All coinciding with the furore going on down at SBR.

storyline · 12 Oct 2005, 04:12 (Ref:1431466)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Cranker

Would the person who cited the SBR drivers for lack of a balaclava NEED to be a Judge of Fact ?

Based on what has been said afterwards by officialdom - yes he would.

Why?

Because otherwise the point COULD have been protested and argued - under the Australian NCR's a Judge of Facts decision cannot be protested. IMHO one of the most ridiculous rules in place in Australia because it allows a completely biased person, or someone with an axe to grind to make a decision and that decision stands - regardless of what any other evidence shows.

Now - some of those who make decisions in race control are judges of fact - and I am not suggesting they are being dishonest or perverting justice - but you sometimes have to wonder whether a pattern of decisions that has been made are being made because of factual evidence or personality?

Obviously everyone will have their own opinion - I'vee seen these decisions being made and I have to say the latter course very closely matches the pattern of some people.

Halsey · 12 Oct 2005, 05:41 (Ref:1431499)

Firstly, and off-topic ever so slightly - don't think that the name of a topic is enhanced by the inclusion of 'gate' at the end of it.

As for the debate over whether or not a team informed whoever it was about SBR drivers not wearing their balaclavas, who knows? It's possible.

storyline · 12 Oct 2005, 05:56 (Ref:1431502)

BUt but but - everything that has a hint of conspiracy gets the lettes 'gate' added to it these days - after all - someone has to be blamed (innocent or otherwise)!

Raglanparade · 12 Oct 2005, 05:59 (Ref:1431504)

As far as i know, the only other drivers to be suspicious about balaclavas were SBRs other drivers.

Spunky · 12 Oct 2005, 07:44 (Ref:1431552)

The person who called in that they were not wearing balaclava's does not have to be a JOF, it was the Tech Director who went to the garage and let RC know what the situation was, they then hand down the penalty. I do agree with you on the point of their not being the chance to redress an incorrect penalty given when the JOF did and has got it wrong before.

fordfan · 12 Oct 2005, 08:07 (Ref:1431564)

I have been told by a person in another established ford team that the person who blew the whistle was the grinch. Where he got that info from I do not know, but he did name the grinch as being a snitch.

storyline · 12 Oct 2005, 08:49 (Ref:1431589)

According to Bond and other info made available though - the call came from a Judge of Fact in pit lane. Be interesting to find uot what realy happened one day.

**GTRMagic** · 12 Oct 2005, 09:37 (Ref:1431631)

The alleged judge of fact in this case was said to be the new series technical director....

TSR · 12 Oct 2005, 10:35 (Ref:1431664)

Quote:

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

The alleged judge of fact in this case was said to be the new series technical director....

In a red t-shirt surly not?

^temuchin^ · 12 Oct 2005, 11:14 (Ref:1431689)

Who relocated their pit to near SBR and after 3 years of not wearing a balaclava suddenly there is a rumour of someone reporting SBR. Bit hard for the other team to monitor SBR when they are at the other end of pit lane.

Rombles1 · 12 Oct 2005, 15:20 (Ref:1431891)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chucky

There were a couple of drivers who made unscheduled changes and disappeared from view with their helmets still on. All coinciding with the furore going on down at SBR.

Someone on another thread on a similar topic said "I want a name" of who dobbed them in. Well, can anyone give us the names of anyone else who did this - the only one I can think of without going back and watching it again is Russell Ingall - gee, which team is he in? Has anyone checked and produced any evidence against anyone else? It has been several days now and I am yet to see anyone else actually named as breaking the rule requiring a balaclava to be worn.

Kerri · 12 Oct 2005, 15:48 (Ref:1431918)

Ok so why did RI suddenly pit then run off into the garage with a suspected stomache problem??? Then a few laps later want to finish the race ???????

At this point ( 3 days post Bathurst) who really cares.

It's done, finished, results are in, RI is leading now (albeit not by much) move on, please .............

Phase3 · 12 Oct 2005, 21:19 (Ref:1432202)

Quote:

Originally Posted by fordfan

I have been told by a person in another established ford team that the person who blew the whistle was the grinch. Where he got that info from I do not know, but he did name the grinch as being a snitch.

Forgive my ignorance, but who is "The Grinch" besides the big green dude that stole Christmas?

**GTRMagic** · 12 Oct 2005, 21:35 (Ref:1432217)

Mr Grech, of HMS/HRT fame

Arguably the dude that stole Bathurst....

Uncle Cranker · 12 Oct 2005, 21:46 (Ref:1432222)

Phase, GTR is right, yes Jeff Grech is 'The Grinch'.

But to a lot of Ford supporters, [who look at life through blue tinted glasses]

'The Grinch' did in fact steal Christmas.

[or the 00, 01, 02 championships, as the case may be]

amiers · 12 Oct 2005, 22:46 (Ref:1432250)

it'a a big bucks game and everyone is looking for an advantage.

DONT GET ANGRY! get even

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