Villeneuve: why is he bothering?

[Knowlesy]

Late last season, I welcomed the return to F1 of Jacques Villeneuve. I never expected him to be on the pace straigtaway, yet he was rather dissapointing still. Don't worry though, he'll have a lot of running in winter testing and he'll be back on it in Melbourne with Sauber.

During winter testing, he was excruciatingly slow. You can never read too much into winter testing, but it did look worrying.

Then we get to Melbourne and the reality of the situation dawns.....

After spinning on his out and in laps in first qualifying, he still manages to start fourth. Nobody expects him to stay in the points, the Sauber is too slow. But he has a chance to show nicely.

Race kicks off, Villeneuve is swamped by all and sundry and is visibly slower than everything. He holds half of the pack up, a train of cars forming behind.

Alonso finally passes the Sauber roadblock and immediately runs about three minutes quicker per lap.

Villeneuve pits and the downward spiral begins. He is lapped by the people he was holding up and he finishes a mile behind Massa.

Jacques Villeneuve, 1997 World Champion. The fall from grace is painful to watch. I used to love watching him race, but the magic is gone, he's making up the numbers and he is past it. He looks out of place on track, he can't cut it anymore.

I really hope he improves, but I can't see it happening. Modern Formula 1 seems beyond him and even in 2003 he seemed a man in the wrong game. I can't see him lasting the season in all honesty......what a terrible end to a great career that would be.

[ralf fan]

What would be more galling is the fact that Massa finished 4 places ahead eventhough he start last on the grid...

[DNQ]

Shades of Mansell 1995?

He really looks out of place.

It's sad to see an ex-WDC being little more than a road-block.

[Knowlesy]

I agree ralf. From where Jacques started combined with his undoubted talent, he should have finished comfortably ahead of Massa. There is no doubt about that.

[M Coupe]

His counter move with Alonso had shades of the old Jacques.

I like JV and hope this was just a bad race, lets see how he goes over the next few GP's. Today wasn't good.

[Formula1Fanatic]

Villenueve has been a shadow of himself since winning the title. I feel he never recovered after he bad-mouthed Button who then out-paced him. Maybe he just getting used to the car

[Silk Cut Jaguar]

Villenueve has been quite open about Massa having adapted easier to the new race system. I say give him until the European season before writing him off, afterall, he was the only world champion to finish the race...

[Knowlesy]

Yes, finishing 14th is some achievement.

[ssilviu]

the indian boy is far better than this canadian... the title won in 1997 is 100% car's credits

[ralf fan]

there are only 2 WDC's in the field and MS was on his way to pts.....so i dont see your point...

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by knowlesy

Nobody expects him to stay in the points, the Sauber is too slow. But he has a chance to show nicely.

I have a problem with this. Why shouldn't we expect him to stay in the points? He's an ex WDC who was brought to Sauber to give them just that. Points and good finishes.

BTW, he also held up Button who, once past, was able to deal with Trulli much more easily. But by then it was too late for any kind of charge.

[Kicking-back]

I'm tempted to write him off - but doing such things has a tendency to come back and bite.

[ralf fan]

Well you cant blame him for holding up Button...it was for position... but he almost cost DC 4rth... i dont blame him really...the marshall's needed to be more aware of the lapping situation.

[Steve57]

Originally Posted by knowlesy

Yes, finishing 14th is some achievement.

I believe JV's biggest problem this race was his tyre choice. From interveiws after the race it seems he picked the softer option tyres, thus the worsening performance after the first pitstop. His team-mate was on the harder option tyres, thus the result.

That is if you can believe what you hear.

[Inigo Montoya]

Welcome to the forum Steve57! He also had a long scrap with Alonso which probably hurt those softer tyres quite a bit.

[RWC]

I didn't see the race so i'm wondering,how did massa get past him?

I mean-was it from faster lap times or because JV made a mistake?

[luke]

This was he problem I feared. Jacques is a great driver, hence he's the 1997 champ, but I don't like seeing him racing in the middle of the pack, dropping back.
I remember saying a while a go, or something that I think if he doesn't score more than 10 points before Silverstone, than what's the point of him competing, maybe it was a little harsh, but I don't like seeing the ex champ racing with the Jordan's etc.
What's there to gain? Or prove?

[Peter Mallett]

Originally Posted by Kicking-back

I'm tempted to write him off - but doing such things has a tendency to come back and bite.

Very true and I am one of those with little time for him but in an attempt at balance I'll run with (welcome Steve) Steve57's statement. The trouble comes when we get the "I chose the harder tyres and they slowed me" argument.

Anyway it is too early to tell and he's got 18 more chances to redeem himself this year.

[Snrub]

I dunno... His launch wasn't that bad, he was just put out a bit and forced back. I've seen it happen to good drivers. Early to midway he was a road block, but his pace was probably close to what the car should have been running and Alonso had the fastest car. Then we didn't see much of him, he wasn't anywhere close to the pace and he got smoked. What the heck happened there? I don't know. Tires, maybe, but Trulli and JPM dropped way of the pace and they didn't drop to 14th.

His first half performance doesn't deserve the critisism he's gotten here, so I'm still reserving some judgement.

[RWC]

Just found some fastest laptime stats-it doesn't look good
Massa was near a full second faster that JV

[Knowlesy]

The tyres thing is irrelevant, he was slow from start to finish.

I've had a look at the re-run on ITV and he's disastrously bad on the first lap, he seems so much slower than everyone else. As if he's asleep.

It's bad to write people off too soon I know, but he performed like this in the renault.

[Elton Julian]

So what some of you are saying is that JV has only ever been better or as good as Damon Hill and HHF? IMO it seems to me that as the cars have become more technical to drive things have become more difficult for JV. Being brave is no longer enough. Slow speed corners are more important than ever and he has always had problems there. A serious karting backround helps.

[Mosport67]

I'm not going to write off JV yet. He didn't show much in the race other than a nice counter move on Alonso. A bad start but I'm not sure if he was just being very careful as he did not force the issue with anyone. He actually got pushed almost off the track.

As to first qualifying he was the first one out on dry tires (maybe too soon). Hard to be critical of the spin when nobody knew the limits of the dry tires especially when the wet spots were apparently hard to see.

JV is a very different person in the press (or maybe the press are reporting it differently). He gives kudos to MS and others. He acknowledges that he is having a difficult time with the car and that the he has to adapt to it.

Hopefully he will otherwise he is just a field-filler.

[BootsOntheSide]

Consdiering the advantage he got from qualifying, he surely should have done more over the course of the race. The Sauber's clearly a reasonable car, and Massa got to grips with it much more strongly. Still, remember that Massa started strongly enough to outpace Fisichella in the first ocuple of races last season, and that came to nought, so maybe JV can find form. For now, he is something of an embarassment, especially compared to DC.

[f1manoz]

Certainly wasn't a great first race in the Sauber for JV, but it's clear he still hasn't adapted to the cars and rules of 2005...

But I'm not going to write him off just yet. But I have a feeling Massa will end his Grand Prix career.