Sir Lewis Hamilton is the GOAT

[S griffin]

Interesting fact. Prior to 2009 Englishmen only won titles in even years and Scottish drivers only won in odd years. Button’s title in 2009 broke that.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Interesting fact. Prior to 2009 Englishmen only won titles in even years and Scottish drivers only won in odd years. Button’s title in 2009 broke that.

I know you are referring to the overall WDC, but don't forget Palmer in 1987 (yes I know it was the Jim Clark trophy, but was a F1 title nonetheless).

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

I know you are referring to the overall WDC, but don't forget Palmer in 1987 (yes I know it was the Jim Clark trophy, but was a F1 title nonetheless).

I had not run across the special categories for 1987 (Jim Clark and Colin Chapman Trophies). Maybe we need to bring that concept back.

For the special drivers trophy (Stirling Moss Trophy?). You are eligible if you have NOT been on the podium that year.

For the special constructors trophy (Toyota Trophy?). You are eligible if one of your cars has NOT been on the podium that year.

The selection for Moss and Toyota? Always a bridesmaid, never a bride.

Richard

[S griffin]

But it wasn’t an overall title, so you can’t rank it on the same wavelength

[wnut]

Let's go with he is the most successful GP driver ever, if not now exactly, certainly before the end of the year, and he is an entirely Mercedes creation.
So great Mercedes marketing material.

[chunterer]

Originally Posted by wnut

Let's go with he is the most successful GP driver ever, if not now exactly, certainly before the end of the year, and he is an entirely Mercedes creation.
So great Mercedes marketing material.

Was Ron Dennis working for Mercedes back in the day then?

[S griffin]

Hmm, yes I seem to remember it was Ron he approached and let's face it he was a McLaren man through and through. The partnership they had with Merc doesn't change that

[E.B]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Hmm, yes I seem to remember it was Ron he approached and let's face it he was a McLaren man through and through. The partnership they had with Merc doesn't change that

I seem to recall his F3 cars were Mercedes powered.

[Adam43]

Yes, he’s been associated with Mercedes one way or another for a long time. Why would either of them want to change that?

I suppose you could say a similar thing about the marketing of Moss and Mercedes over the years. Crikey they milked that. But does that bother me? Hell no.

[billy bleach]

On a different tack what defines a GOAT? Just driving? Schumacher gave $illions to charities, Stormzy pays for Cambridge bursary’’s, Drogba gives $illions to Africa good causes. All I hear is noise from Hamilton and stories of wage demands - words are cheap .....

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

On a different tack what defines a GOAT? Just driving? Schumacher gave $illions to charities, Stormzy pays for Cambridge bursary’’s, Drogba gives $illions to Africa good causes. All I hear is noise from Hamilton and stories of wage demands - words are cheap .....

IMO, activities outside of the sport are unrelated to the tag of GOAT:

It is a tag which is reserved for the individual who is deemed to be the undisputed master of their sport.
As well as exceptional talent, in order to be considered the GOAT, the individual must also maintain a consistent high level of achievement.

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

On a different tack what defines a GOAT? Just driving? Schumacher gave $illions to charities, Stormzy pays for Cambridge bursary’’s, Drogba gives $illions to Africa good causes. All I hear is noise from Hamilton and stories of wage demands - words are cheap .....

There are plenty of celebs and sportspeople who do good charitable works. Not all of them plaster the fact all over social media. He may do nothing, he may do a lot....

[chillibowl]

personally, i think it can include any trait or characteristic one can make a persuasive argument to include.

boxing for example has 'the best pound for pound fighter of all time time' as a way to compare boxers who did not compete against each other both because of eras and weight classes, but the best pound for pound fighter is not necessarily considered the GOAT...that would be reserved for Ali and with Ali i think activities outside of boxing are a big part of what makes him the GOAT.

specifically though about the donations...is that a function of greater remuneration for modern athletes. they make more so they donate more. hard for athletes from decades past to compete then.

going back to Ali, i absolutely think social activism factors greatly into this conversation.

inherently the GOAT is such a subjective, but imo fun, question. who here doesn't like talking about sports?

[Akrapovic]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

On a different tack what defines a GOAT? Just driving? Schumacher gave $illions to charities, Stormzy pays for Cambridge bursary’’s, Drogba gives $illions to Africa good causes. All I hear is noise from Hamilton and stories of wage demands - words are cheap .....

Good thing he donated half a million to helping those effected by the Australian wild-fires then. And he's previously donated to childrens hospitals. And UNICEF. Education Africa. Ormond Street Hopspital. And quite a few others. Close call - he almost just had cheap words.

[chillibowl]

to add another thing about Ali.

losing the title/being stripped of the title and coming back to win it is also a big part of the appeal. how a person responds after losing may be just as important, maybe even more important, than win count or titles won.

[ascarracinguk]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

On a different tack what defines a GOAT? Just driving? Schumacher gave $illions to charities, Stormzy pays for Cambridge bursary’’s, Drogba gives $illions to Africa good causes. All I hear is noise from Hamilton and stories of wage demands - words are cheap .....

Then you need to unclog your ears.

He’s been a unicef ambassador and donor for over a decade, a personal donor to great Ormond street hospital, education africa, Harlem children zone, save the children, same with the WWF, personally donating $500,000 to the Australian fire fund and set up the hamilton foundation which works with disadvantaged and disabled kids.

So yes, words are cheap, especially when you use them on an open forum before doing your research.

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by ascarracinguk

Then you need to unclog your ears.

He’s been a unicef ambassador and donor for over a decade, a personal donor to great Ormond street hospital, education africa, Harlem children zone, save the children, same with the WWF, personally donating $500,000 to the Australian fire fund and set up the hamilton foundation which works with disadvantaged and disabled kids.

So yes, words are cheap, especially when you use them on an open forum before doing your research.

Apologies. That’s me back in my box

[PS54321]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

Apologies. That’s me back in my box

I was aware of Lewis’s charitable awareness but hadn’t heard of the Hamilton Foundation which is apparently an umbrella for his activities.

But I can’t reconcile what I’ve heard with what I found about the foundation, why are the accounts figures so low? Is this a discontinued charity?

THE ADVANCE IN LIFE AND TO RELIEVE THE NEEDS OF AND TO HELP CHILDREN AND YOUNG PEOPLE.

Charity Number1124368Date Registered2008-06-06Telephone01462451321AddressFIRST FLOOR OFFICES, 99 BANCROFT, HITCHIN, SG5 1NQTrusteesGIOVANNI VIGILIO PENASA, LEWIS CARL HAMILTON, GIOVANNI VIGILIO PENASA, SUSAN ELAINE THACKERAYCharity Commission ClassificationsMakes Grants To Organisations, Disability, Children/young People, Education/training, The Advancement Of Health Or Saving Of Lives, Other Charities Or Voluntary Bodies, The Prevention Or Relief Of Poverty, Makes Grants To Individuals, General Charitable PurposesGoverning DocumentTRUST DEED DATED 23 OCTOBER 2007;
Basic accounts
Accounts date Income Spending More info
31 Mar 2019 £0 £60
31 Mar 2018 £4,355 £60
31 Mar 2017 £0 £66
31 Mar 2016 £70,568 £18,593
31 Mar 2015 £12,000 £120,120

[wnut]

Originally Posted by PS54321

I was aware of Lewis’s charitable awareness but hadn’t heard of the Hamilton Foundation which is apparently an umbrella for his activities.

But I can’t reconcile what I’ve heard with what I found about the foundation, why are the accounts figures so low? Is this a discontinued charity?

THE ADVANCE IN LIFE AND TO RELIEVE THE NEEDS OF AND TO HELP CHILDREN AND YOUNG PEOPLE.

Charity Number1124368Date Registered2008-06-06Telephone01462451321AddressFIRST FLOOR OFFICES, 99 BANCROFT, HITCHIN, SG5 1NQTrusteesGIOVANNI VIGILIO PENASA, LEWIS CARL HAMILTON, GIOVANNI VIGILIO PENASA, SUSAN ELAINE THACKERAYCharity Commission ClassificationsMakes Grants To Organisations, Disability, Children/young People, Education/training, The Advancement Of Health Or Saving Of Lives, Other Charities Or Voluntary Bodies, The Prevention Or Relief Of Poverty, Makes Grants To Individuals, General Charitable PurposesGoverning DocumentTRUST DEED DATED 23 OCTOBER 2007;
Basic accounts
Accounts date Income Spending More info
31 Mar 2019 £0 £60
31 Mar 2018 £4,355 £60
31 Mar 2017 £0 £66
31 Mar 2016 £70,568 £18,593
31 Mar 2015 £12,000 £120,120

Wow!

Welcome PS54231, a very interesting post.

[Adam43]

What’s the most interesting thing about it? Other than it’s based in Hitchin?

[Greem]

For comparison we need the charitable accounts for every single F1 driver that has ever lived. Produce that, produce a forensic accountant, let's go for it.

I know he invites it sometimes but the micro analysis of everything Hamilton does really is tiresome. I genuinely can't think of a single former or current driver who gets the approbation he does for everything, inside and outside the car, from everywhere, all the time.

Yes, location checks out etc etc.

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by Greem

For comparison we need the charitable accounts for every single F1 driver that has ever lived. Produce that, produce a forensic accountant, let's go for it.

I know he invites it sometimes but the micro analysis of everything Hamilton does really is tiresome. I genuinely can't think of a single former or current driver who gets the approbation he does for everything, inside and outside the car, from everywhere, all the time.

Yes, location checks out etc etc.

Couldn't agree more. Now we're probing his charitable contributions.... Jeez, things must be quiet.

[steve_r]

What have the Romans ever done for us?

[crmalcolm]

Seeing as how the subject has been discussed - Crash.Net ran an article a few months ago here:
Why Lewis Hamilton can’t do right for doing wrong

'Last week, Hamilton announced that he would be donating US $500,000 (£380,000) to help support local fire service and animal welfare charities affected by the ongoing bushfire crisis in Australia.

While it must be noted there was significant support for Hamilton’s actions, there was also a huge amount of negativity directed towards the recently-crowned six-time world champion which could not be ignored.

One response to Hamilton’s post on Twitter read: “Only 500k? Michael Schumacher would have pledged millions”, while others questioned the figure Hamilton had pledged, describing it as “loose change” to one of the world’s highest-paid athletes - 13th according to Forbes’s 2019 rich list. '

'Roger Federer (5th on the same Forbes rich list as Hamilton) and Rafael Nadal (37th) - who between them have won 39 Grand Slams - revealed they would jointly be donating A$250,000 (£132,285).

While this combined figure is over £200,000 less than what Hamilton had donated, a quick look through some of the replies to Federer and Nadal’s act of kindness showed there was no question of whether it had been a sufficient amount or not.

The point here is not to say that Hamilton’s donation was in any way superior due to the amount of money pledged being higher - any charitable act should be praised and appreciated in equal measure - but more to emphasise the stark contrast in the manner of reaction received.'

Some people are more public in their charitable acts than others - some are more generous than others.
But for some reason, and the article suggests it is his relationship with social media that is the cause, Hamilton seems to be in a case of 'damned if you do, damned if you don't'?

[Knowlesy]

It is almost as if some are held to a higher standard than others by certain people.