[BTCC] Round Four, Thruxton 03-04 Jun, Races 10,11&12

[Jon411]

Fair play to Ash, that was another great drive.


Didn't see the full points table but noticed Turks in 3rd is now 38 points behind him, and Colin hasn't exactly had a bad start to the season - just shows what a great job Ash is doing.

[SR18]

BORING
What a waste of time to watch

[GT6]

If the others can't improve then looks like this season will not be more than a contest for second in the championship. No offence to sutton but we like to see a close championship and this year does not appear to be that

[porsche962fan]

Minis demonstrate once again how pathetic the BTCC has become

[porsche962fan]

another boring pathetic race

[GT6]

If they do not sort list out BTCC will struggle top seven finished in starting order. Not good.

[AnnoyedMoose]

Thruxton is just a rubbish track for proper cars with decent drivers. There are just no real opportunities. It only really works for underpowered cars that have to draft.

[Matt K]

Originally Posted by porsche962fan

another boring pathetic race

Maybe stop watching this pathetic championship? You'll have a lot less stress and will no longer waste so much time on complaining

[porsche962fan]

rather maybe TOCA and Gow should move their brains and produce a better more exiting quality product ?

Hybrid a total pathetic joke, the guy whoi has none really can just cruise ahead without any problems and in the field there is hardly any passing , so what's the point of it again ?

[crmalcolm]

https://tentenths.com/forum/showpost...1&postcount=71

[BTCC frog]

The hybrid is certainly the problem. As it is totally ineffective, the drivers who are fastest in qualifying will remain at the front in the first race, because they are already in speed order. But the main problem is that the situation is exactly the same in the second race so we get another procession. The third race will be entertaining as Sutton, Ingram and Cook will have to come through back to the front.

I know some people value pure racing where the best driver/team wins every time, but for me that is what Formula 1 should be about, and the BTCC is about exciting racing, which is not the case at the moment. I think for 2024 we need a return to the success ballast because hybrid just isn't a proper handicap. In my opinion, if we had ballast up to 75kg like the old days but only in qualifying and race two, then the grid would be slightly jumbled but the best drivers would still be able to make their way to the front in race one. In race two the fastest drivers would have the most weight so would have to defend and the racing would be close and exciting, and in race three the drivers at the front would not be fastest because they have been put their by the reversed grid, and it would be equal weight, so that race would be exciting as well.

Ash Sutton dominating is not the problem at the moment; if he wasn't there it would be exactly the same situation, just with Ingram taking a processional win from Cook and Hill, so slowing the Focus down is not the solution, and indeed is never a fair fix to just slow down the team that have done the best job. In my scenario above, Sutton would still dominate the championship because he is the best BTCC driver since Andy Rouse and perhaps is even better, but he wouldn't be winning every race and his racecraft would come to the fore more as well because he would have to fight his way to the front more often like he did in that brilliant third race at Brands Hatch this year.

[porsche962fan]

LOL

Oneil made fun of the hybrid during classic Mini race

[redshoes]

https://www.barc.net/wp-content/uplo...-Rowbottom.pdf
3 place grid drop for Rowbottom, due to an incident with Pearson

[porsche962fan]

mental classic Mini race

they probably have more passes in one lap than BTCC in whole race

[Sodemo]

I do think that overall the racing isn’t as good as it was in the S2000 era and prior.

I am not sure what the solution is but if I were TOCA I’d be having a very close look at that Focus to see if they have pushed the tech rules a bit too far.

Interesting also to hear the Astras have been given a boost increase for Thruxton, is there any context to that increase?

[Jon411]

Just be thankful we are only going to Thruxton once this year.


I don't think Hybrid is the sole issue however I wouldn't be surprised if some sort of success ballast returns after this season (or) we end up with some sort of performance balancing between all the different makes/ models.


Personally I hope it doesn't happen but TOCA's RWD/ FWD obsession (some of which should have been left) over the years means that there are people out there who are now expecting them to slow the Ford down.

I doubt we will ever find out but I presume the BMW is still hobbled and not just the gearing/ start line restrictions.

[AnnoyedMoose]

Originally Posted by Sodemo

I do think that overall the racing isn’t as good as it was in the S2000 era and prior.

A lot of that is tyres according to previous talks from Plato and Neal.

[Evantra]

Glad to see Rowbottom get that, certainly deserved it. Moffat too.

Still rather stagnant though in that last one and again the Ford, in Rowbottom’s hands at least, looked about twice as fast as anyone else!

[JDMROB]

Another fairly uneventful race. NAPA have just done a seriously good job with that car.

Not sure what the answer is? Maybe the cars are too big, heavy and grippy. It’s not just BTCC though I think all ‘elite’ motorsport nowadays is the same. Hence why historic racing is so popular. It’s just better to watch.

Not a single safety car in the 3 BTCC races. That doesn’t happen often.

[Evantra]

Originally Posted by JDMROB

Not sure what the answer is? Maybe the cars are too big, heavy and grippy. It’s not just BTCC though I think all ‘elite’ motorsport nowadays is the same. Hence why historic racing is so popular. It’s just better to watch.

Not a single safety car in the 3 BTCC races. That doesn’t happen often.

Car size definitely, tightening track limits doesn’t help either. And the hybrid system being fairly irrelevant.

Sadly I can’t image Oulton Park is going to be much better with the racing, but perhaps it might bring the BMWs into play.

[GT6]

better than the first two races but still a disappointing BTCC meet to be honest

[AnnoyedMoose]

Originally Posted by Evantra

Car size definitely, tightening track limits doesn’t help either. And the hybrid system being fairly irrelevant.

Sadly I can’t image Oulton Park is going to be much better with the racing, but perhaps it might bring the BMWs into play.

Tightening track limits by 6 inches doesn't make that much difference honestly. As has been said a lot of top level racing is fairly processional these days. The teams and drivers at the front are just too good at what they do.

[GT6]

Appears i was not the only one that found it well below normal BTCC standards, not sure what they can do to get the racing back to exciting level but we shall see

[Sodemo]

Originally Posted by Jon411

Just be thankful we are only going to Thruxton once this year.


I don't think Hybrid is the sole issue however I wouldn't be surprised if some sort of success ballast returns after this season (or) we end up with some sort of performance balancing between all the different makes/ models.


Personally I hope it doesn't happen but TOCA's RWD/ FWD obsession (some of which should have been left) over the years means that there are people out there who are now expecting them to slow the Ford down.

I doubt we will ever find out but I presume the BMW is still hobbled and not just the gearing/ start line restrictions.

As far as I know the BMW still has a whole host of performance degrading measures against it;

- boost reduction in mid 2019
- heavier RWD base weight (by 50kg?)
- mandated higher ride height
- some kind of COG weight penalty that I think came in with the Subaru
- longer first gear
- lower boost in 1st and 2nd gears (but I think only for the start “map”).
- ballast box moved further forward

[SR18]

NAPA won 9/12 races this season. They have to be penalised ASAP.