[BTCC] BTCC 2022 season discussion, News and Rumours!

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Pdh

The only way dynamics will become a three car team is if they buy a license and they didn’t want to do that last year so I can’t imagine they will this year either

They tried to acquire a 3rd TBL for 2021.....

[BTCC frog]

I think if Team Dynamics do manage to acquire a third TBL, it will most likely be Matt Neal himself driving that car, and while I would prefer Cammish back, Neal is a great asset to the championship, and deserves a better send-off than an anonymous race at Brands Hatch with no spectators and nobody knowing if it was actually his final race. And if the Plato to BTC rumours are true, they would effectively be driving the same car for the first time ever!

[antnee]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

They tried to acquire a 3rd TBL for 2021.....

From what I have worked out, they applied for one of the 'unused' TBLs which needs approval from all teams. Where as buying one just needs the approval from TOCA/Gow and a fair few £££

[Matt K]

Another thing is, if money's tight at Dynamics, will they be willing to expand to three cars? Unless they want Andy Neate in the third car....

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Matt K

Another thing is, if money's tight at Dynamics, will they be willing to expand to three cars? Unless they want Andy Neate in the third car....

Apparently the sponsorship was lined up, it was just an available TBL that was missing.

[Pdh]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

Apparently the sponsorship was lined up, it was just an available TBL that was missing.

Tbl’s were available at the right price guess they didn’t want to pay for them

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by BTCC frog

I think if Team Dynamics do manage to acquire a third TBL, it will most likely be Matt Neal himself driving that car, and while I would prefer Cammish back, Neal is a great asset to the championship, and deserves a better send-off than an anonymous race at Brands Hatch with no spectators and nobody knowing if it was actually his final race. And if the Plato to BTC rumours are true, they would effectively be driving the same car for the first time ever!

But Cammish has gone from being dominant in Porsches to pretty average this year ….

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

But Cammish has gone from being dominant in Porsches to pretty average this year ….

Well, if by average you mean putting together a late deal with minimal testing and leading the championship. Yeah, average.

[Nononsensecapeesh]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

But Cammish has gone from being dominant in Porsches to pretty average this year ….

Average? He's leading the Championship, only by 7 points admittedly but still, that's hardly average. Maybe because the BTCC is where he would ideally have liked to be this year and the same goes for next year if possible?

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

But Cammish has gone from being dominant in Porsches to pretty average this year ….

Do you not mean Harry King?

[S griffin]

Harry King has really been brought back down to earth after his dominant season last year yes. Cammish OTOH has shown he’s lost none of his skills, despite not being in the series for a while and being quite a few years older than when he was last in the series

[antnee]

I caught some of the eTCR/WTCR footage from over the weekend and there was an interesting comment from Matt Neal about the hybrid system. He said that they (the project team) were struggling to get the full 15seconds of power at some circuits with minimal braking, like Thruxton.

Now this wouldn't usually be an issue as it would be the same for everyone, but as the success ballast system is being replaced with a hybrid power restriction system - it causes a lot of headaches.

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by Nononsensecapeesh

Average? He's leading the Championship, only by 7 points admittedly but still, that's hardly average. Maybe because the BTCC is where he would ideally have liked to be this year and the same goes for next year if possible?

Sorry clumsy use of words , what i meant was I am surprised he is not dominant

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

Sorry clumsy use of words , what i meant was I am surprised he is not dominant

Why surprised?

Harry King is still in the series, Hanafin has improved and Jewiss has emerged as another contender. Meanwhile, Cammish spent a couple of years in totally different machinery, and had a limited preseason. If that context surprises you that he's not dominant, I expect that says more about how you rate the competition....

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by antnee

I caught some of the eTCR/WTCR footage from over the weekend and there was an interesting comment from Matt Neal about the hybrid system. He said that they (the project team) were struggling to get the full 15seconds of power at some circuits with minimal braking, like Thruxton.

That's an interesting comment from Matt. I expect there is a little bit of poetic licence in what he is saying - because the BTCC Hybrid system doesn't re-generate from braking.

I appreciate that being off throttle and braking are commonly aligned in BTCC, but there is a subtle difference.

[Nononsensecapeesh]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

Sorry clumsy use of words , what i meant was I am surprised he is not dominant

I understand.

[antnee]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

That's an interesting comment from Matt. I expect there is a little bit of poetic licence in what he is saying - because the BTCC Hybrid system doesn't re-generate from braking.

I appreciate that being off throttle and braking are commonly aligned in BTCC, but there is a subtle difference.

I think this is where things start to get a little too technical for general discussion. While there isn't the usual 'regenerative' braking function, there is reverse torque applied to the motor while braking. This will still aid in decelerating the car faster. The more time a driver spends on the brakes, the more time the system can regenerate.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by antnee

I think this is where things start to get a little too technical for general discussion. While there isn't the usual 'regenerative' braking function, there is reverse torque applied to the motor while braking. This will still aid in decelerating the car faster. The more time a driver spends on the brakes, the more time the system can regenerate.

Yes, a bit technical I agree.
I just recall how the system designers wanted it to make no difference to brake feel - so the regeneration occurs at the ICE.

It's always worth taking Matt's comments with a pinch of salt. Remember he claimed that they could enter a Honda RWD previously, ignoring the engine orientation requirements of the NGTC ruleset. It would be interesting to see how much of the regeneration data he has observed, given that Cosworth claim the system to only be 80% developed at the moment.

[S griffin]

I am looking forward to seeing the hybrid formula. From what I’ve seen it shouldn’t make too much difference and still sounds good

It’s interesting what Matt has in mind. Is there something in the future he has planned that we don’t know about? He’s done well with Dynamics, so who knows? I don’t think we’ll ever see him back as a driver, but he has a good future as team manager

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

Why surprised?

Harry King is still in the series, Hanafin has improved and Jewiss has emerged as another contender. Meanwhile, Cammish spent a couple of years in totally different machinery, and had a limited preseason. If that context surprises you that he's not dominant, I expect that says more about how you rate the competition....

Sorry as usual as an interested observer rather that an intellectual collusus on the subject once again I have failed to reach your high standards thank you as ever for correcting me

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

Sorry as usual as an interested observer rather that an intellectual collusus on the subject once again I have failed to reach your high standards thank you as ever for correcting me

[BTCC frog]

A summary of what we know so far. Maybe this is a bit strange to do before the 2021 season has even ended, but silly season speculation is most fun when you don't actually know anything.

WSR:
Stephen Jelley looks set to stay in one of the cars. There are always rumours around Colin Turkington leaving due to loss of sponsorship from the team, but I think he is still likely to stay. In the third car, Tom Oliphant is probably leaving the team, with Michael Crees the only real potential replacement mentioned so far. Mat Jackson and Ash Sutton have both been mentioned, but both are very unlikely and if they were to happen it would be in place of Turkington, not Oliphant.

Team Dynamics:
Gordon Shedden is likely to stay, but while Dan Rowbottom is on a multi-year deal there is talk that he might leave. Rory Butcher has been suggested as a possible replacement, while Cammish is probably an option too. The team might finally buy a third TBL, and if that happens, I would suggest a return for Matt Neal would be most likely. He is also a probable contender for the second car.

BMR/Laser Tools/Boardley:
Ash Sutton and Team BMR seem likely to split from Laser Tools, and join Power Maxed Racing with a new RWD car. Laser Tools will then cut back to a one-car team with just Aiden Moffat in an Infiniti, as Boardley may also leave to form his own team, that will likely still be connected with HARD.

Speedworks:
Rory Butcher is there currently, but Josh Cook has been mentioned as potentially going there. If Toyota invest more money into the team, which is possible, they might be able to run Butcher and Cook, which would be a great team, but it is most likely they will only get one of the two. Smelt is currently the second driver, but I don't think he will stay.

MB/Motorbase:
Jake Hill, Ollie Jackson and Sam Osborne are all in the seats currently and will probably stay, but I just can't see Andy Neate returning in the fourth car. Tom Oliphant has been mentioned as the most likely replacement at this early stage.

BTC Racing:
Josh Cook has been linked with other teams so is probably out, and Jason Plato is a possible replacement. The idea of him potentially driving the same car as Matt Neal is exciting. Senna Proctor is their second driver. I seem to remember him saying something about it only being for one year when he signed (maybe misremembering), but given the success of this year, I think he will stay. Nothing has been said about Jade Edwards yet, but I think she too will stay. Because of his one-off cameo in 2021, I will throw Cammish's name in the mix, but somewhat hopefully.

Ciceley:
Adam Morgan will stay, for obvious reasons. Tom Chilton is the current incumbent of the second seat, but a disappointing season means that, despite the investment he has put in, a return is by no means certain. Given what I said about him previously, and the fact that he was linked to the seat last season, I think Senna Proctor is a potential replacement for Chilton if he does leave. There is also the third car which was built early this season, and may be run next year if they can acquire another TBL. At the time, Lucky Khera was mentioned as a potential driver of that car, while it could also be Proctor if Chilton stays.

Excelr8:
Tom Ingram’s move there has been a great success, so it is unlikely he will leave after one season. I would also be surprised if Chris Smiley or Jack Butel departed the team, but don’t think Rick Parfitt will return in the fourth Hyundai. Tom Oliphant has been linked to this seat, while Michael Crees and Bobby Thompson could also be potential replacements, as are the host of Excelr8s in the Minis this year, including championship leader Dan Zelos.

Power Maxed:
There have been heavy rumours of PMR joining up with BMR, meaning that it is very likely that they will be running three new RWD cars for 2022 and ditching the Astras. Ash Sutton will surely be one of them, and Dan Lloyd probably another, as he has done a great job this year. But Jason Plato will almost certainly not be back with the team, meaning a replacement is required. Dare I mention Mat Jackson’s name as a possible third driver? I would suggest Bobby Thompson is more likely.

Team HARD:
Jack Goff and Aron Taylor-Smith are currently signed up as two of the Cupra drivers, but Josh Cook has been suggested as potentially replacing Goff. Nic Hamilton will probably return in the third Cupra, but there are question marks over the fourth. Jack Mitchell is unlikely to stay, but the only suggestion as a replacement thus far is Mike Bushell. What a line-up that would be for HARD if they had Cook/Goff, Taylor-Smith and Bushell in the same team! But traditionally, Bushell signs for the team and then doesn’t actually race for them at the start of the season. There is also the issue that the TBL is actually owned by Carl Boardley, so if he chooses to sell it, HARD will have to slim down to three Cupras. But I don’t think this will happen, as I think Boardley will continue to be associated with HARD for next year, but will officially be in his own team, driving an Infiniti.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by BTCC frog

A summary of what we know so far. Maybe this is a bit strange to do before the 2021 season has even ended, but silly season speculation is most fun when you don't actually know anything.

WSR:
Stephen Jelley looks set to stay in one of the cars. There are always rumours around Colin Turkington leaving due to loss of sponsorship from the team, but I think he is still likely to stay. In the third car, Tom Oliphant is probably leaving the team, with Michael Crees the only real potential replacement mentioned so far. Mat Jackson and Ash Sutton have both been mentioned, but both are very unlikely and if they were to happen it would be in place of Turkington, not Oliphant.

Team Dynamics:
Gordon Shedden is likely to stay, but while Dan Rowbottom is on a multi-year deal there is talk that he might leave. Rory Butcher has been suggested as a possible replacement, while Cammish is probably an option too. The team might finally buy a third TBL, and if that happens, I would suggest a return for Matt Neal would be most likely. He is also a probable contender for the second car.

BMR/Laser Tools/Boardley:
Ash Sutton and Team BMR seem likely to split from Laser Tools, and join Power Maxed Racing with a new RWD car. Laser Tools will then cut back to a one-car team with just Aiden Moffat in an Infiniti, as Boardley may also leave to form his own team, that will likely still be connected with HARD.

Speedworks:
Rory Butcher is there currently, but Josh Cook has been mentioned as potentially going there. If Toyota invest more money into the team, which is possible, they might be able to run Butcher and Cook, which would be a great team, but it is most likely they will only get one of the two. Smelt is currently the second driver, but I don't think he will stay.

MB/Motorbase:
Jake Hill, Ollie Jackson and Sam Osborne are all in the seats currently and will probably stay, but I just can't see Andy Neate returning in the fourth car. Tom Oliphant has been mentioned as the most likely replacement at this early stage.

BTC Racing:
Josh Cook has been linked with other teams so is probably out, and Jason Plato is a possible replacement. The idea of him potentially driving the same car as Matt Neal is exciting. Senna Proctor is their second driver. I seem to remember him saying something about it only being for one year when he signed (maybe misremembering), but given the success of this year, I think he will stay. Nothing has been said about Jade Edwards yet, but I think she too will stay. Because of his one-off cameo in 2021, I will throw Cammish's name in the mix, but somewhat hopefully.

Ciceley:
Adam Morgan will stay, for obvious reasons. Tom Chilton is the current incumbent of the second seat, but a disappointing season means that, despite the investment he has put in, a return is by no means certain. Given what I said about him previously, and the fact that he was linked to the seat last season, I think Senna Proctor is a potential replacement for Chilton if he does leave. There is also the third car which was built early this season, and may be run next year if they can acquire another TBL. At the time, Lucky Khera was mentioned as a potential driver of that car, while it could also be Proctor if Chilton stays.

Excelr8:
Tom Ingram’s move there has been a great success, so it is unlikely he will leave after one season. I would also be surprised if Chris Smiley or Jack Butel departed the team, but don’t think Rick Parfitt will return in the fourth Hyundai. Tom Oliphant has been linked to this seat, while Michael Crees and Bobby Thompson could also be potential replacements, as are the host of Excelr8s in the Minis this year, including championship leader Dan Zelos.

Power Maxed:
There have been heavy rumours of PMR joining up with BMR, meaning that it is very likely that they will be running three new RWD cars for 2022 and ditching the Astras. Ash Sutton will surely be one of them, and Dan Lloyd probably another, as he has done a great job this year. But Jason Plato will almost certainly not be back with the team, meaning a replacement is required. Dare I mention Mat Jackson’s name as a possible third driver? I would suggest Bobby Thompson is more likely.

Team HARD:
Jack Goff and Aron Taylor-Smith are currently signed up as two of the Cupra drivers, but Josh Cook has been suggested as potentially replacing Goff. Nic Hamilton will probably return in the third Cupra, but there are question marks over the fourth. Jack Mitchell is unlikely to stay, but the only suggestion as a replacement thus far is Mike Bushell. What a line-up that would be for HARD if they had Cook/Goff, Taylor-Smith and Bushell in the same team! But traditionally, Bushell signs for the team and then doesn’t actually race for them at the start of the season. There is also the issue that the TBL is actually owned by Carl Boardley, so if he chooses to sell it, HARD will have to slim down to three Cupras. But I don’t think this will happen, as I think Boardley will continue to be associated with HARD for next year, but will officially be in his own team, driving an Infiniti.

A great summary - thanks.

May I make a request? If you have any references for any predictions, I'll update 'the list' accordingly.

[Overboost]

Originally Posted by crmalcolm

A great summary - thanks.

May I make a request? If you have any references for any predictions, I'll update 'the list' accordingly.

I'll throw a few more things into the mix.

WSR, Dynamic's, Motorbase will hinge on what MB Motorsport do, as to where drivers, sponsors might go. The only definite at Motorbase is Osborne, everyone else's contracts are up. Word of a potential big sponsor there too though (mind you we've heard that before )

Likewise PMR, Laser Tools, Hard, will depend on BMR, Laser Tools & Boardley's plans/decisions.

All of the above could be affected by TPC and their plans, they own TBL's, MB Motorsport don't, Boardley's got 2, Throw in Bery Taylor looking to return with Restart Racing, maybe some spare TBL's if the PMR merge comes off.

Hell of a lot up in the air still.

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by Overboost

I'll throw a few more things into the mix.

WSR, Dynamic's, Motorbase will hinge on what MB Motorsport do, as to where drivers, sponsors might go. The only definite at Motorbase is Osborne, everyone else's contracts are up. Word of a potential big sponsor there too though (mind you we've heard that before )

Likewise PMR, Laser Tools, Hard, will depend on BMR, Laser Tools & Boardley's plans/decisions.

All of the above could be affected by TPC and their plans, they own TBL's, MB Motorsport don't, Boardley's got 2, Throw in Bery Taylor looking to return with Restart Racing, maybe some spare TBL's if the PMR merge comes off.

Hell of a lot up in the air still.

Are all 4 TBLs being used by the Motorbase camp this season owned by MB Motorsport?