[Team] Williams: Do they have a spare tub?

[S griffin]

I’m not sure what is going on here. They said Lowe was on gardening leave, now he’s trying to legal challenge suggests it wasn’t an amicable parting at all

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by S griffin

I’m not sure what is going on here. They said Lowe was on gardening leave, now he’s trying to legal challenge suggests it wasn’t an amicable parting at all

An employee being placed on gardening leave is not dependant on whether the parting of the ways is amicable or not.

It's purpose is to protect the employer, usually so that knowledge of their current business plans or similar are out of date by the time that the leaving employee starts his new job.

For example, one of my sons was placed on gardening leave after he handed in his contractually obligatory 6 months notice to his firm. His firm just didn't want him to be in touch with their clients, or to know what business they were conducting with those clients. He starts his new position on this coming Monday.

The parting of the ways was neutral because neither my son or his old firm wanted to burn their bridges due to the fact that in the future they may want to get him back, or he may find that he would prefer to be back there. But they still required him to clear his desk (metaphorically) pretty swiftly.

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by wnut

IMO it looks to be a place that people take their careers to die, it would be interesting to see a list of people who have survived Williams to be successful elsewhere, there are some like Newey and Wolff, but boy are there a lot that it hasn't worked out well for.

after Newey, Ross Brawn and Geoff Willis are names that come to mind. off the top of my head i cant think of any names more recent then 30 years ago though.

well thats not true and to your point of Williams being peoples last stop, there was Antonia Tersi(?) who came highly regarded from Ferrari and given an impossible task to resurrect Williams with one punch (a la Paddy) and she swung for the fences with the walrus nose.

they scapegoated her pretty badly for that despite the fact she was clearly brilliant and went on to build superbuses or supertrains or something else supercool!


in the NFL they often talk about coaching trees...essentially a map tracing the linage of winning coaches back to the coach/mentor/system for whom they initially worked/learned under.

would the F1 equivalent to the Bill Walsh NFL coaching tree be Patrick Head?

[S griffin]

Whatever happened to Sam Michael?

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Whatever happened to Sam Michael?

Mclaren i think.

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by Tourer

Not sure if some of what she said has been lost in translation (original interview was in a French magazine apparently) but according to this article Claire Williams is admitting fault for instigating the change of internal structure within the team back in 2014-15 period that has lead to the current problems.

Lot of work to get done if the ship is going to be turned around by the sound of it.

if she is going to be there for the long run and can learn from missteps then for sure it should be viewed as a positive that she can acknowledge her part for their current state.

and no doubt her dad made many many mistakes along the way that ultimately made him a better leader in the long run.

anyways, i fell like she has been bashed enough and now im rooting for her.

love the underdog!

[S griffin]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

Mclaren i think.

Oh yes, I remember now

[crmalcolm]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Whatever happened to Sam Michael?

http://bfy.tw/N5Zl

[S griffin]

Triple 8 I had forgotten about that do

[Moneyseeker]

Interesting that CW said that William's Advanced Engineering was set up to generate income to support the F1 team, but no longer does so the team is now totally reliant on sponsorship and FOM income. Tough way to run a team and it must grate on Williams to see what Stroll is investing in Racing Points new factory.

Sent from my SM-T580 using Tapatalk

[P38 in workshop]

I don't know Jonathan Williams or his ability to run a racing team,might I assume that the same applies to those harking back to his iSport adventure?As I recall it was an offshoot of SuperNova and benefitted from the involvement of David Sears and Paul Jackson,not too sure where JW fitted in actually.Had he really had an overwhelming desire to get into F1 it might have been entirely possible to expand that way and yet the team withered.I would contend that David Sears and Paul Jackson could both hold their own in just about any racing series and yet it didn't work out.


None of which is going to move Williams off the foot of the constructor's championship.George Russell's performance in the Mercedes this week illustrates that he isn't the weak link.In a way it reminds me of the era when Damon Hill was driving the worst car in the series for Brabham,while being a test driver for the team with the best car.When he got the full time drive with the team that had the best car a championship fell his way.Will history be repeated?

[S griffin]

It depends how much speed Russell shows, but the potential is definitely there

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by midgetman

That's a little harsh. Running a historic racing team with wealthy customers just playing at racing in cars whose specification is fixed can hardly be compared to being at the cutting edge.

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He was a driving force at I Sport F3000 - he has been exiled in the Historic department where they don’t actually race....

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by S griffin

Whatever happened to Sam Michael?

888 Australia - what did he do at Williams ? From memory started the nose dive

[wnut]

Had not seen this before:

"Late on Monday last week, TJ13 received an anonymous email from an internal source within Grove. To quote:
“At the end of last year, all the managers in all manufacturing departments got sacked after an internal survey.
“They all obviously appealed, and have now all been paid off with no employment restrictions.
“Upper management are now trying to implement new working hours and staff are refusing to work more than the standard shift hours in protest of any change. So not a surprise the car is late and is not at the test”

https://thejudge13.com/2019/02/27/cl...amning-report/


Plus

Headline from Claire Williams: "Kubica could be technical director".

This does not even bear thinking about.

[Tourer]

Originally Posted by chillibowl

if she is going to be there for the long run and can learn from missteps then for sure it should be viewed as a positive that she can acknowledge her part for their current state.

and no doubt her dad made many many mistakes along the way that ultimately made him a better leader in the long run.

anyways, i fell like she has been bashed enough and now im rooting for her.

love the underdog!

As an Australian, I won't be "rooting" for her (has a VERY different meaning down under compared to the USA) Look under "R" in this Oz slang dictionary and you'll see what I mean.

Otherwise I agree with you - if anyone wants public credibility then they need to "own" the problem they've created (perhaps inadvertently) and be straight up about it. If CW had done this when the problems first surfaced, the general public reaction she's had may well have been very different.

It could well be that the involvement of SPH back at Williams may have lead to Claire being so forthright publicly - he was always a straight shooter and no doubt is encouraging Claire to be the same.

Probably a case of Claire's PR background taking her down a path that felt right but which hasn't been useful. The removal of all departments heads in manufacturing referenced above is really weird though if it is true.

I don't personally know either Claire or Jonathan so don't know what capabilities either truly posses but it's possible that the team would work better with both involved - surely it would be possible to work out a way for them to have equal footing and avoid any urinating contests.

Right now though, Claire is in the chair and I think that owning the problem publicly could be the first step to having external fans etc back on the team's side and supporting, rather than criticising.

Like chilli, I do like to back an underdog and hope that this team with such a great history can find a way back to being competitive.

[Aysedasi]

Originally Posted by wnut

Headline from Claire Williams: "Kubica could be technical director".

This does not even bear thinking about.

So what's next? A change of that famous name to Team Kubica......?

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by wnut

Plus

Headline from Claire Williams: "Kubica could be technical director".

This does not even bear thinking about.

So thanks for the TJ13 link. I used to peek in there on occasion. I haven't done so in ages. I think there is a place for the rumor mill. The problem is there is a progression from top to bottom in the media. Mainstream press at the top, then "in the know" commentators (such as Joe Saward) and finally nearly at the bottom is something like TJ13. They sometimes tell the stories others don't want to touch (just yet) but they are also the king of things like click-bait headlines. Such as the "Kubica as technical director." Guaranteed to get some fish on the hook, but nothing but a tall tale.

You watch the interview and it's clear Claire is just pumping up the positives of Kubica and nothing more. Anyone who takes that comment (or headline) seriously needs their head examined.

She is just giving him a complement. I am not saying she is (or I am) making this comparison, but the mold is set by someone such as Mark Donohue (bachelors in mechanical engineering) or a more recent example of Marc Lieb (doctorate in automotive engineering) as both a driver and engineer for Porsche.

I don't think Kubica has any formal engineering training as best as I can tell. Sometimes you listen to drivers during interviews and it's clear they really don't know how the car works or the physics behind it. Maybe Kubica is one who does know or cares to learn and can easily communicate not just with his race engineer, but with others on the technical side as well.

Richard

[Richard C]

Originally Posted by Richard Casto

Anyone who takes that comment (or headline) seriously needs their head examined.

Sorry to quote myself. I re-read my post above and realized that it might come across wrong. I don't think anyone here is seriously thinking Kubica is going to be the new Williams Technical Directory. I didn't want anyone who posted on this topic to think I was criticizing them personally. It was more a commentary on the type of thing TJ13 sometimes puts forward.

Richard

[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by Tourer

As an Australian, I won't be "rooting" for her (has a VERY different meaning down under compared to the USA) Look under "R" in this Oz slang dictionary and you'll see what I mean.

haha, good to know!

Originally Posted by Tourer

If CW had done this when the problems first surfaced, the general public reaction she's had may well have been very different.

i think so too. imo, the Williams fan base has been pretty understanding and genuinely hope to see them do well again. i think they underestimate their fans and do us a disservice by not being as upfront as they could be.

mind you, i dont think they are dishonest and i can appreciate that being fully open is a difficult thing when you have to contend with the media, an institution that does not typically reward openness and honesty.

its apt that this started with you pointing out a humorous difference in culture/language but that then got me thinking about differences in english cultures in general and well it wasnt long after that i started thinking about Pink Floyd (as one often does when thinking about England).

a bit random to be sure, but their line 'hanging on in quiet desperation is the English way' kept going around my head and how that very much sums up for me the Williams situation and how much better their situation would be if they were to drop that mentality and were more open about their shortcomings...openness is a type of humility and respect for that is very much the Canadian way.

perhaps why im always looking to root for an underdog.

some may say im a root rat at heart!.

[F1Pete]

openness is a type of humility and respect for that is very much the Canadian way.

That pretty much sums up Justin Trudeau.

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[chillibowl]

Originally Posted by F1Pete

That pretty much sums up Justin Trudeau.

touche!

[billy bleach]

Camera cuts to a bewildered looking Clare apparently leant on a flight case in the back of the Garage - not sat at a Command Centre plinth type setup like Toto who also appears to have a grip. Honestly it’s time - just take the money but get someone in with Gravitas and knowledge, please ?

[GTRMagic]

Originally Posted by billy bleach

Camera cuts to a bewildered looking Clare apparently leant on a flight case in the back of the Garage - not sat at a Command Centre plinth type setup like Toto who also appears to have a grip. Honestly it’s time - just take the money but get someone in with Gravitas and knowledge, please ?

His Ronness may need to reappear in the paddock

[billy bleach]

Originally Posted by GTRMagic

His Ronness may need to reappear in the paddock

Adam Parr, Pat Symonds , Adrian Newey ? Ah no all been and gone......