Home  
Site Partners: SpotterGuides Veloce Books  
Related Sites: Clubmans Rallycross Your Link Here  

Go Back   TenTenths Motorsport Forum > Other Motorsports > Rallying & Rallycross

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 26 Sep 2018, 11:38 (Ref:3852756)   #1
tbtstt
Veteran
 
tbtstt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
United Kingdom
Redhill, England
Posts: 3,704
tbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridtbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
DiRT Rally 2.0

Thought some of you might be interested in this. Dirt Rally 2.0 is coming next year (26th February), it includes rally and the World Rallycross Championship.

Looks to be based on the 2018 season and includes 8 tracks (Barcelona, Montalegre, Mettet, Lohéac Bretagne, Trois-Rivieres, Hell, Holjes and Silverstone)
tbtstt is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Sep 2018, 14:12 (Ref:3852785)   #2
chunder
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
England
Stevenage
Posts: 8,298
chunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
The rallycross part of DR was woeful. Cars all handled badly, it was revised well in Dirt 4, but the rally stuff was terrible.

And it really only existed to try and make the game more sellable in DR1, hence why the abysmal Dirt 4 was released.

The rally part was brilliant, massively immersive and hugely rewarding.

And I hope that is the part they concentrate on.

But, I do fear rallycross will be the bigger selling point, and that would be a shame, as the original game was perhaps the best sim I have played in many years, just not the rallycross bit!!
They will not have the WRC licence, which is good and bad, but they will no doubt have the IMG licence, so I suspect the game will be focused on rallycross, I hope not, but let's see.
chunder is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Sep 2018, 15:55 (Ref:3852801)   #3
W2Motorsport
Racer
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
United States
Pennsylvania, USA
Posts: 111
W2Motorsport should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by chunder View Post
The rallycross part of DR was woeful. Cars all handled badly, it was revised well in Dirt 4, but the rally stuff was terrible.

And it really only existed to try and make the game more sellable in DR1, hence why the abysmal Dirt 4 was released.

The rally part was brilliant, massively immersive and hugely rewarding.

And I hope that is the part they concentrate on.

But, I do fear rallycross will be the bigger selling point, and that would be a shame, as the original game was perhaps the best sim I have played in many years, just not the rallycross bit!!
They will not have the WRC licence, which is good and bad, but they will no doubt have the IMG licence, so I suspect the game will be focused on rallycross, I hope not, but let's see.
I agree fully. The rally portion of Dirt Rally was excellent and the Rallycross portion was lackluster at best. To be honest iRacing is leaps and bounds ahead of D.R in Rallycross and even pCars2 is better in my opinion. Hope they continue to focus on traditional rally as they knocked it out of the park on the first dirt rally.
W2Motorsport is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Sep 2018, 17:06 (Ref:3852810)   #4
tbtstt
Veteran
 
tbtstt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
United Kingdom
Redhill, England
Posts: 3,704
tbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridtbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
I though both DR and D4 had their strengths and weaknesses. The rally stages in DR were excellent but, even with the revised physics model, some of the car behavior was odd (specifically thinking when the cars left the ground or collided with an object).

The rallycross cars could be unpredictable in DR and, in my opinion, that was the single biggest improvement in D4: the cars slid easier and were much more controllable on the limit.

I also thought that, for the most part, the 4WD rally cars handled better in D4 as well. The rally stages in D4 were a lot more forgiving though, which is why I think many felt that D4 was more of an arcade game as you have a lot more room for error. The biggest step backwards in D4 were the RWD cars which didn't feel anywhere near as much of a handful as they did in DR.

D4 was also cut short on content by Codemasters being denied the Pikes Peak license. I am curious to know exactly what happened behind the scenes, but the total lack of follow on support for D4 was bizarre.

It's a shame "Your Stage" isn't back as I think it had incredible potential. The hand crafted stages should bring back the same level of stage detail that we saw in DR. With more locations and rallycross tracks than DR, I hope it's the complete sequel that D4 should have been.
tbtstt is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Sep 2018, 18:45 (Ref:3852833)   #5
NaBUru38
Veteran
 
NaBUru38's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Uruguay
Las Canteras, Uruguay
Posts: 10,356
NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!NaBUru38 is going for a new world record!
For those who can't wait to play off-road racing, there's Gravel, V-Rally 4 and Wreckfest.
NaBUru38 is offline  
__________________
Nitropteron - Fly fast or get crushed!
by NaBUrean Prodooktionz
naburu38.itch.io
Quote
Old 26 Sep 2018, 18:56 (Ref:3852840)   #6
chunder
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
England
Stevenage
Posts: 8,298
chunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
I think to be honest, they realised with Dirt4 they had written a pup!

Dr was perfect in many ways, agreed the mid engined cars had weird handling on some stages,

Pikes Peak doesn't interest me at all I am afraid, hardly ever drove there. I get why its there, but withou notes its rather hard to learn without just endlessly repeating the same few bits. real, yes, but not the same as a rally stage for some reason.

Give me 2 more countries and I would be happy without rallycross and pikes peak. and more proper cars.

\Trailer shows Erikssons Golf, how cool, WRX which seems to look muddy and a clear VW Audi bias in trailer.
chunder is offline  
Quote
Old 26 Sep 2018, 20:04 (Ref:3852848)   #7
crossfades
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Sweden
Posts: 957
crossfades should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I am hoping this will be a big improvement from D4 and DR, just like you guys say they both had some ups and downs. Sliding around with the RWD Escort in DR is so much fun and I hope they can add some of that realism to AWD cars as well. Perhaps not realistic but it would fun if they could add RWD cars to rallycross.

I am worried though that there might not be snow/ice stages and also a lack of asphalt (only Spain). Judging from the locations it seems to be heavy emphasis on gravel.

“Our passionate, knowledgeable community helped to make DiRT Rally a special title. We have been working with a selection of that community alongside a roster of real world rally drivers to ensure that we meet their high standards”
http://www.codemasters.com/codemaste...irt-rally-2-0/

"You will need to rely on your instincts with the most immersive and truly focused off-road experience yet, including a new authentic handling model, tyre choice and surface deformation."

http://dirtrally2.com/
crossfades is offline  
Quote
Old 27 Sep 2018, 07:57 (Ref:3852892)   #8
tbtstt
Veteran
 
tbtstt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
United Kingdom
Redhill, England
Posts: 3,704
tbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridtbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by crossfades View Post
I am worried though that there might not be snow/ice stages and also a lack of asphalt (only Spain). Judging from the locations it seems to be heavy emphasis on gravel.
They are talking about two seasons of DLC post-release with each of those seasons adding three new locations to the game (so six in total).

Given the respective resources required to add new locations, I suspect there will be two additional rally locations and four more rallycross tracks. I wonder if one of the additional rally locations will be snow.
tbtstt is offline  
Quote
Old 27 Sep 2018, 08:18 (Ref:3852895)   #9
SnoodyMcFlude
Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
United Kingdom
Posts: 520
SnoodyMcFlude should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridSnoodyMcFlude should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by W2Motorsport View Post
I agree fully. The rally portion of Dirt Rally was excellent and the Rallycross portion was lackluster at best. To be honest iRacing is leaps and bounds ahead of D.R in Rallycross and even pCars2 is better in my opinion. Hope they continue to focus on traditional rally as they knocked it out of the park on the first dirt rally.


You’re joking, right? PCars 2 rallycross is woeful other than having a decent variety of cars


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
SnoodyMcFlude is offline  
Quote
Old 27 Sep 2018, 09:26 (Ref:3852908)   #10
chunder
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
England
Stevenage
Posts: 8,298
chunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
PCARS2 is a shocker of a game, basically a full price patch for the first title, so bad they have given up!

Iracing is very good.

But Dirt Rally for me had a better off road feel, it was simply spot on, on gravel. Actually the modern 4wd cars were quite dull, the best feel being kept for the fwd and rwd cars.

If they can recapture that, I don't mind a bit of DLC within reason.

The issue with the last game was it is basically a test piece with lots missing, admitted by the devs, I don't want this game to be like all modern games, a 50% finished game, for full price then DLC taking it well over 100 quid so that within 2 years you get the game you should have got initially.

Gamers are the reason they do this, as they are so stupid and desperate they will now pay well over the full price of games for what you used to get in one purchase.
chunder is offline  
Quote
Old 27 Sep 2018, 15:26 (Ref:3852981)   #11
W2Motorsport
Racer
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
United States
Pennsylvania, USA
Posts: 111
W2Motorsport should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by SnoodyMcFlude View Post
You’re joking, right? PCars 2 rallycross is woeful other than having a decent variety of cars


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Pcars 2 isn't a classic for sure, but Rallycross in Dirt Rally was just awful, especially in comparison to the Rallying itself. Neither game is a great representation of Rallycross unfortunately, but I got a lot more enjoyment out of pCars 2 Rallycross than I did out of Dirt Rally. Neither one touches iRacing in my mind, although they are sorely lacking in permanent circuits such as Lydden Hill, Loehac and Hell. But I'm sure they will get there someday. Of course I've never Rallycrossed either so my opinion isn't worth much -- its just based on what feels more realistic to me, generally iR is pretty close -- at least they are with anything I've race IRL such as Asphalt and Dirt oval stuff.
W2Motorsport is offline  
Quote
Old 27 Sep 2018, 16:52 (Ref:3852998)   #12
chunder
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
England
Stevenage
Posts: 8,298
chunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
To be honest I tried rallycross in DR and left it alone pretty much just after, none of my cars were levelled as it was so poor, same as Pikes Peak, just did nothing for me, they were not that great to drive to be fair.

The rally stuff was all that was needed, the rest was a basic licence and the ability to play online, Minis were fun as was 1600 in the update, but the supercars were never right
chunder is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Oct 2018, 20:31 (Ref:3853910)   #13
crossfades
Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Sweden
Posts: 957
crossfades should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
A clip from the Canadian track. It's only pre-alpha gameplay (and an awful driver) but this makes me a bit nervous, the car seems to understeer quite a bit and beside that it looks kinda odd.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqVhuWkwZTg&t=185s
crossfades is offline  
Quote
Old 1 Oct 2018, 20:54 (Ref:3853917)   #14
chunder
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
England
Stevenage
Posts: 8,298
chunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
Thing is, it doesn't matter what the rallycross is like.

It didn't in Dirt Rally.

The game is being aimed at sim gamers, not simcade Projects cars types, and the rally handling will reflect that I hope.

It ought to be hard, unforgiving. Apparently there will be tyre choices now, and the stages will chew up for later runners, a really great idea.

That says sim to me, Thank God and frankly I couldn't care less about WRX being in the game at all. It's only there coz IMG paid them to have it in there.
chunder is offline  
Quote
Old 3 Oct 2018, 13:12 (Ref:3854279)   #15
tbtstt
Veteran
 
tbtstt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
United Kingdom
Redhill, England
Posts: 3,704
tbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridtbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Pre-Alpha Trois-Rivieres footage from the livestream yesterday:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=t9KjU-L06mQ

Canada is one of my least favourite tracks on the World RX calendar, but I am looking forward to trying it in game as it looks pretty unforgiving: there is concrete everywhere.
tbtstt is offline  
Quote
Old 3 Oct 2018, 14:57 (Ref:3854305)   #16
W2Motorsport
Racer
 
Join Date: Sep 2018
United States
Pennsylvania, USA
Posts: 111
W2Motorsport should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbtstt View Post
Pre-Alpha Trois-Rivieres footage from the livestream yesterday:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=t9KjU-L06mQ

Canada is one of my least favourite tracks on the World RX calendar, but I am looking forward to trying it in game as it looks pretty unforgiving: there is concrete everywhere.
That does not look awful. I'm sure I'll buy this when it comes out despite my complaints about the RX portion in DR1.
W2Motorsport is offline  
Quote
Old 3 Oct 2018, 17:04 (Ref:3854332)   #17
tbtstt
Veteran
 
tbtstt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
United Kingdom
Redhill, England
Posts: 3,704
tbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridtbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by W2Motorsport View Post
That does not look awful. I'm sure I'll buy this when it comes out despite my complaints about the RX portion in DR1.
I thought the rallycross in D4 was a big improvement over DR. If they manage to make a similar leap forward then I am expecting it to be decent.
tbtstt is offline  
Quote
Old 3 Oct 2018, 19:34 (Ref:3854383)   #18
chunder
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
England
Stevenage
Posts: 8,298
chunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the gridchunder should be qualifying in the top 3 on the grid
The thing is they are totally different games form the same developer.

Dirt 4 was a Block style game, and they have their place, I maintain Dirt2 was a magnificent game, I played it for months and Dirt 3 was good too.

Dirt rally was a pure sim, it was a design exercise and never properly finished, they released rallycross for the licence mainly and to get people to play online, but it was very rough.

Hopefully DR2 loses none of the sim stuff
chunder is offline  
Quote
Old 8 Oct 2018, 13:45 (Ref:3855431)   #19
leonidas
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
England
Coventry
Posts: 1,286
leonidas should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridleonidas should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
It is strange how opinions are so divided. Most serious sim racers I know think that the Project Cars 2 Rallycross content is the dogs dangly bits. The cars are so controllable on the throttle, whereas Dirt 4 there is a bit too much uncontrollable snap oversteer. Ok, some rallycross cars do exhibit snap oversteer, but this is something most drivers try to avoid for obvious reasons.

The problem with Dirt 4 was that it was unfinished - and the devs admitted as much (I posted a link on this donkeys ago). The Historic RWD cars were simply not modeled correctly. The 4WD were generally much better- especially the Group B cars and those are the ones everyone plays. But you did have to set them up properly and it is amazing how many fans haven't a clue on the basics of setup. Some were a bit understeery, but then the Quattro had that problem in real life too.

The problem with Dirt Rally was that it was too easy to barrel into a turn at any speed, get the car sideways and drift through the corner. It feels great, looks great, but in real life you need to get the corner entry speed right - if you don't you understeer off or you don't get enough rotation to get cleanly though the corner. Richard Burns Rally modelled this challenge brilliantly. DR is good, but doesn't really get this right. D4 is a little better in this respect, at least with the 4wd cars.

The sad thing is that the stage generator may not be in Dirt Rally 2. This was an awesome idea from Dirt 4, but poorly executed. It just needed the devs to put the hours in to create real variety - but then so much stuff gets released before it is ready.
leonidas is offline  
Quote
Old 8 Oct 2018, 13:57 (Ref:3855434)   #20
leonidas
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
England
Coventry
Posts: 1,286
leonidas should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridleonidas should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
One further thought - I'd like to see a proper track editor to create new rallycross tracks.

SODA off road racing had this in 1996 - and its physics and ai are better than many games today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zf6bQvkjS9Y
leonidas is offline  
Quote
Old 9 Oct 2018, 09:34 (Ref:3855624)   #21
tbtstt
Veteran
 
tbtstt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
United Kingdom
Redhill, England
Posts: 3,704
tbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridtbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by leonidas View Post
The sad thing is that the stage generator may not be in Dirt Rally 2. This was an awesome idea from Dirt 4, but poorly executed. It just needed the devs to put the hours in to create real variety - but then so much stuff gets released before it is ready.
Yeah, I fully agree. Your Stage had incredible potential in my eyes and I was sure later iterations of it would fix the flaws of what we got in Dirt 4.
tbtstt is offline  
Quote
Old 17 Jan 2019, 14:12 (Ref:3876725)   #22
tbtstt
Veteran
 
tbtstt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
United Kingdom
Redhill, England
Posts: 3,704
tbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridtbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
New trailer for the World RX content now online:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0AmH16cRpc
tbtstt is offline  
Quote
Old 21 Jan 2019, 15:56 (Ref:3877539)   #23
leonidas
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
England
Coventry
Posts: 1,286
leonidas should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridleonidas should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I've seen some trailers and I'm not greatly impressed. The grip levels on loose surfaces were already too high in Dirt 4 and now seem even higher. The physics on tarmac seem bizarre, with so much drifting it looks like the cars are running on gravel tyres. The tracks are also very flat with few bumps - have these guys ever watched a rally?

There are no classic rallies for licensing reasons - so no RAC, no Monte, no Finland, no Acropolis. And there is no MyStage or editor, despite many requests. Overall, a poor effort.

Dirt rally is still probably the best of the series, although its a little too forgiving on corner entry.

If you want to get annoyed, go back to Richard Burns Rally and ask why rally sims have gone backwards in 15 years. This is still the one most hardcore fans play - there is even a modern physics update.
leonidas is offline  
Quote
Old 23 Jan 2019, 10:05 (Ref:3877874)   #24
tbtstt
Veteran
 
tbtstt's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
United Kingdom
Redhill, England
Posts: 3,704
tbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridtbtstt should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
I am disappointed not to see Your Stage return. It was flawed in D4, but as the first iteration of the idea I thought it had immense potential.

Decent chunk of rally gameplay in this video (Unfortunately all from chase cam!):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdBAc29N97c

Argentina looks like it could be a challenge!
tbtstt is offline  
Quote
Old 30 Jan 2019, 13:38 (Ref:3880664)   #25
leonidas
Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
England
Coventry
Posts: 1,286
leonidas should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridleonidas should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
This video gives me a bit more hope as the car seems to be actually reacting to the ruts and bumps. There are still places that are too smooth though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QjB2gaTVa7Y

The mini's handing looks very odd though - I'm glad mine doesn't handle like that!
leonidas is offline  
Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
DiRT Rally tbtstt Virtual Racers 9 15 Apr 2016 17:05
Winston Cup should have one Dirt Track! philip_woody NASCAR & Stock Car Racing 5 19 Aug 2003 17:17
Steve Kinser On Diggin In The Dirt nunga National & International Single Seaters 3 4 Apr 2003 12:49


All times are GMT. The time now is 17:46.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Original Website Copyright © 1998-2003 Craig Antil. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2004-2021 Royalridge Computing. All Rights Reserved.
Ten-Tenths Motorsport Forums Copyright © 2021-2022 Grant MacDonald. All Rights Reserved.