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View Poll Results: Who will win Bathurst in 2019
#2 Pye/Luff WAU Mobil1 Holden 1 1.89%
#3 Jacobson/Fiore KR Rabble Nissan 0 0%
#5 Holdsworth/Randle Tickford Bottle O Ford 0 0%
#6 Waters/Caruso Tickford Monster Energy Ford 0 0%
#7 Heimgartner/Fullwood KR Plus Fitness Nissan 1 1.89%
#8 Percat/Blanchard BJR BJR Holden 0 0%
#9 Reynolds/Youlden Erebus Penrite Holden 5 9.43%
#12 Coulthard/D'Alberto DJRTP Shell Ford 0 0%
#14 Slade/Walsh BJR Freightliner Holden 0 0%
#15 Kelly/Wood KR Castrol Nissan 0 0%
#17 McLaughlin/Premat DJRTP Shell Ford 12 22.64%
#18 Winterbottom/Richards Team18 Irwin Holden 0 0%
#19 LeBrocq/Webb Tekno Truck Assist Holden 0 0%
#21 Jones/Canto BJR CoolDrive Holden 1 1.89%
#22 Courtney/Perkins WAU Mobil1 Holden 0 0%
#23 Davison/Davison 23Red Milwaulkee Ford 1 1.89%
#27 Hinchcliffe/Rossi WAU Napa Auto Parts Holden 0 0%
#33 Stanaway/Pither GRM Boost Mobile Holden 1 1.89%
#34 Golding/Muscat GRM Boost Mobile Holden 0 0%
#35 Hazelwood/Smith MSR SP Tools Holden 1 1.89%
#55 Mostert/Moffat Tickford SuperCheap Auto Ford 2 3.77%
#56 Kostecki/Kostecki KBR Boost Mobile Holden 0 0%
#78 de Silvestro/Rullo KR Harvey Norman Nissan 1 1.89%
#97 Van Gisbergen/Tander RBHRT Red Bull Holden 14 26.42%
#99 de Pasquale/Brown Erebus Penrite Holden 1 1.89%
#111 Evans/Van Der Drift TKR TKR Holden (SCRATCHED) 2 3.77%
#888 Whincup/Lowndes RBHRT Red Bull Holden 10 18.87%
Voters: 53. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12 Nov 2019, 02:36 (Ref:3940085)   #931
Forda
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Forda should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by xrystl View Post
I have a dial gauge (digital) and a micrometer (digital), I tried to get it to measure down 3/1000 of an inch, it is so minuscule that it is virtually zero,
It equates to something less than the thickness of a single piece of paper.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xrystl View Post
same with my Micrometer, The difference could be as simple as taking measurements at a different temperature (hot day-cold day, hot workshop-cold workshop - hot item cold item) that only some of the measurements were off and the others were within spec would have someone in the industry believe that the engine problem that Supercars experienced was the cause of the discrepancy.
Blind Freddy could see that, but 'making a mountain out of a molehill' is the name of the game now.
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Old 12 Nov 2019, 05:24 (Ref:3940100)   #932
xrystl
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Originally Posted by Forda View Post
It equates to something less than the thickness of a single piece of paper.



Blind Freddy could see that, but 'making a mountain out of a molehill' is the name of the game now.
Nit picking to the extreme, probably just sticking the boots in after the Safety car fiasco at Bathurst and this is the only way they can make it uncomfortable for DJR/TP.
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Old 12 Nov 2019, 07:26 (Ref:3940108)   #933
Compromised
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Compromised should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
I wouldn't say virtually zero - it was nearly 0.1mm, so coke can thick. We're not exactly talking microns here...

Regardless, there's a number that the valve lift can't exceed. It was exceeded.

I also disagree with the comments regarding the measuring itself. Remember they weren't measuring an ID or an outside length, they were measuring a range. It's a lot harder to get bad readings when you zero a dial and "measure" how far the dial moves from zero.
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Old 12 Nov 2019, 07:27 (Ref:3940109)   #934
one five five
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one five five should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
For years people have been screaming that the cars need to be equal and the rules written to ensure parity

Now we are saying that cars not conforming to the exact rule book should be pardoned because it apparently wasnít performance enhancing?

You canít have it both ways
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Old 12 Nov 2019, 07:38 (Ref:3940113)   #935
Langers
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Langers should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
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Originally Posted by HDTVKSS View Post
So i'm curious, at what point does out of specifications as defined by the rules not become an issue? how much leeway should be given?

IMHO if its out of spec - circumstances or not - that sucks that you may lose a win but if its out of spec, its not in accordance with the rules and you cannot afford to be soft on that. Especially with an organisation such as Penske that has been shown to take a mile when given even close to an inch.If this is a risk that you want to be wary of then build the tolerance into the engine - or you run the risk of a penalty.

Heres an example from 2017 of a very similar looking Penske ford in Nascar - https://www.foxsports.com/nascar/sto...scandal-050417

"Here are the two ways of looking at it: Penske is cheating up its cars. Period. How else do you explain both Penske crew chiefs getting suspended for violations in the first eight races of the year? They cheated, they got caught. And if your team gets caught multiple times, in my opinion, the penalties should get progressively more severe."

I believe it was also Penske teams that were purposely nosing their cars into the walls post win to avoid some sort of post race inspection.

So, if what you want is a series where teams are constantly looking to flout the rules and not care if they get caught because they can just pay the fine and move on, im not sure if we want the same things.

Yes, team always will push the rulebook, but this is more than taking the ****.
It becomes a real issue when the engine exceeds the power threshold on the dyno. It didnít.
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Old 12 Nov 2019, 08:00 (Ref:3940116)   #936
Forda
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Forda should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by one five five View Post
For years people have been screaming that the cars need to be equal and the rules written to ensure parity

Now we are saying that cars not conforming to the exact rule book should be pardoned because it apparently wasnít performance enhancing?

You canít have it both ways
Don't start with 'parity' now - you only have to check which brand has been winning the majority of the races since Auckland, to see where that's ended up.

What is relevant here is another absurdity altogether, being that the qualifying (Q) engine was found with some negligible tolerance differences after it was unquestionably on it's way out.
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Old 12 Nov 2019, 08:07 (Ref:3940118)   #937
HDTVKSS
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Quote:
Originally Posted by one five five View Post
For years people have been screaming that the cars need to be equal and the rules written to ensure parity

Now we are saying that cars not conforming to the exact rule book should be pardoned because it apparently wasnít performance enhancing?

You canít have it both ways
how dare you come in here with common sense comments like that...
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Old 12 Nov 2019, 08:12 (Ref:3940122)   #938
HDTVKSS
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Originally Posted by Forda View Post
Don't start with 'parity' now - you only have to check which brand has been winning the majority of the races since Auckland, to see where that's ended up.

What is relevant here is another absurdity altogether, being that the qualifying (Q) engine was found with some negligible tolerance differences after it was unquestionably on it's way out.
lets see if i remember how this goes..

you cant blame holden for doing a better job...
holden just read the rulebook better.
its just that Ford haven't got their head around single spring....
you cant blame a driver for doing a better job, the 888 drivers are just better than the rest...
the car was built to the rules and the process was approved by V8SC....

yadda yadda yadda

not forgetting that 17 and 55 (the two fastest fords... ) got shortened in QLD via driver error
penalties in the races
illegal cars being presented and paid for in penalties
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Old 12 Nov 2019, 08:38 (Ref:3940126)   #939
bluesport
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bluesport is heading for a stewards' enquiry!
Quote:
Originally Posted by one five five View Post
For years people have been screaming that the cars need to be equal and the rules written to ensure parity

Now we are saying that cars not conforming to the exact rule book should be pardoned because it apparently wasnít performance enhancing?

You canít have it both ways
They weren't pardoned, action was taken.
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Old 12 Nov 2019, 09:08 (Ref:3940128)   #940
Terry S
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Terry S should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
See post #927.

Let’s not duplicate comments
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Old 13 Nov 2019, 13:27 (Ref:3940375)   #941
Casper
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Casper should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridCasper should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by xrystl View Post
I have a dial gauge (digital) and a micrometer (digital), I tried to get it to measure down 3/1000 of an inch, it is so minuscule that it is virtually zero, same with my Micrometer, The difference could be as simple as taking measurements at a different temperature (hot day-cold day, hot workshop-cold workshop - hot item cold item) that only some of the measurements were off and the others were within spec would have someone in the industry believe that the engine problem that Supercars experienced was the cause of the discrepancy.
There are dial gauges and dial gauges which read even more accurately over a very short range. A tool maker will explain the differences for you. Any generic 1/2" dial gauge has not got the resolution to measure very small amounts and 1 thou is not a small amount when it cones down to it. A digital instrument suffers more resolution loss than a mechanical one but some are better than others. Digital in this scenario is not good enough because of the resolution loss, gee sheep stations are on the line here.
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Old 13 Nov 2019, 16:41 (Ref:3940433)   #942
JAFA851
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JAFA851 should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Casper View Post
There are dial gauges and dial gauges which read even more accurately over a very short range. A tool maker will explain the differences for you. Any generic 1/2" dial gauge has not got the resolution to measure very small amounts and 1 thou is not a small amount when it cones down to it. A digital instrument suffers more resolution loss than a mechanical one but some are better than others. Digital in this scenario is not good enough because of the resolution loss, gee sheep stations are on the line here.
Oh FINALLY someone that understands the finer details. Well done that man, said the toolmaker and machinist.
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Old 1 Jan 2020, 01:58 (Ref:3949313)   #943
thunderbolt
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you know the way i see that win
CRASHGATE Simplified - A Detailed Account About Formula 1's Darkest Moment
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27EgIi_SXD0
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