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Old 17 Jul 2018, 06:00 (Ref:3837062)   #106
crmalcolm
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Originally Posted by Nononsensecapeesh View Post
Exactly, now back on subject, Kelvin Fletcher is a rarity for recent times in that he's both an actor and a gentleman racer.
But what is the point in mentioning him in this thread?

Are you saying that he is in your group of 'worst drivers'? Or as you now claim, under-performing?

If under-performing, then do you feel he is/was capable of better results, but something prevented him from getting them?

If we are genuinely going to post drivers' names in this thread, in the spirit you suggest that is intended, then what is the story you are telling us?

If this thread is genuinely going to add value, then I feel it needs to do more than just name and shame - and give as insight into something that may not be common knowledge, or provide an insight into a different perspective.

At the moment, it's all just a bit toxic still - and those standing behind the 'right to free speech' banner should remember two things:

UDHR Article 19 amendment - 'the exercise of these rights carries "special duties and responsibilities" and may "therefore be subject to certain restrictions" when necessary "[f]or respect of the rights or reputation of others"'

Joel Feinberg's Offense Principle - 'the extent, duration and social value of the speech, the ease with which it can be avoided, the motives of the speaker, the number of people offended, the intensity of the offense, and the general interest of the community'


I feel that this thread currently shows no respect for the reputation of some of the drivers mentioned, has no social value, is not in the general interest of this community and the claimed motives seem to be ignored?
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Old 17 Jul 2018, 10:41 (Ref:3837086)   #107
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medius should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridmedius should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Mark Howard finished the 2016 season on minus 3 points thanks to various penalties applied during the course of the year. Most the these were due to poor driving.

Does that count? Is he the only driver in BTCC history to finish with a negative points tally?
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Old 17 Jul 2018, 10:47 (Ref:3837088)   #108
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Originally Posted by medius View Post
Mark Howard finished the 2016 season on minus 3 points thanks to various penalties applied during the course of the year. Most the these were due to poor driving.

Does that count? Is he the only driver in BTCC history to finish with a negative points tally?
Dan Welch, 2014, -40 points
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Old 17 Jul 2018, 11:48 (Ref:3837096)   #109
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Welch and Hyla Breese, but that was due to technical reasons
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Old 17 Jul 2018, 12:58 (Ref:3837115)   #110
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Welch and Hyla Breese, but that was due to technical reasons
Dave Brodie in 1989. (-37)
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Old 17 Jul 2018, 13:34 (Ref:3837122)   #111
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Dave Brodie in 1989. (-37)
Don't think that earns him a mention in a 'Worst since 2001' thread.
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Old 17 Jul 2018, 13:42 (Ref:3837124)   #112
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Don't think that earns him a mention in a 'Worst since 2001' thread.
My mistake.
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Old 17 Jul 2018, 13:53 (Ref:3837129)   #113
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My mistake.
Although it does go to show that finishing on -ve points is not as rare as may initially be thought - so perhaps those that have done so recently haven't performed as bad as appears (in the grand scheme of things)?
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Old 17 Jul 2018, 16:05 (Ref:3837143)   #114
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Although it does go to show that finishing on -ve points is not as rare as may initially be thought - so perhaps those that have done so recently haven't performed as bad as appears (in the grand scheme of things)?
I think worst is a harsh word to use though I am no less guilty of using it than anyone else, I was thinking of F1/GP Rejects as their forum once covered a similar topic, appropriately called BTCC Rejects.
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