Bell's Banter 2021

[John Elwin]

Originally Posted by Lancsbreaker

Are any of our European friends anywhere near this Alfa? - It could be interesting as I have a rusty that could donate the "moteur et boite" ......


https://www.facebook.com/groups/1128...12811319539331

Lancs, it's actually in Belgium - not France - roughly midway between Brussels & Namur, about 2.5 hours from me. Don't think I can stray over the border yet though.

[grantp]

Originally Posted by Paul D

To be honest Grant, under normal circumstances, against the usual opposition in Future Classics, I wouldn't generally be on for an outright victory anyway - with or without a 30 second penalty! So the opportunity isn't likely to present itself again anytime soon - and highly unlikely it would happen again this season.

However, I am often in contention for the class win, and the penalty is going to affect me there, and probably for most of the season, simply because the outright winner in our series rarely comes from my class, which means that, for the rest of this season, I'm hampered by the penalty, but it's quite likely that no one else in my class will be (the 30 second penalty is only applied to outright race winners, not class winners).

Hence, thinking more about class victory than outright victory, I now have to see if I can find those 30 seconds over a race distance just to be where I would normally be anyway.

Still, those are the rules we all agreed to and I can hardly expect any special treatment simply on the basis that I'm not likely to win again even without a penalty.

Ah, right.

I foolishly assumed that it would be logical to apply penalties at class level in well-mixed races (in terms of classes). Or to not apply them at all if the winner was not from an obvious "fastest" class.

Such is the way of deriving manipulated results, no matter how well-intentioned.

Is the penalty for the driver or the car? Or both in combination? Could you change the identity (of either) and somehow enjoy the benefit of the win without it affecting the rest of the year?

[grantp]

A quick update on Son-in-Laws Alfa starting problem.

Saw him yesterday and he said they had changed the starter (I guess the chap doing the work had already bought it so he wanted to use it ...) and then cleaned up all of the earths and it now starts well.

I would hazard a guess that the motor itself may not have been required but never mind.

Thanks to all for the suggestions. I'm assuming that the advice was passed on to the guy doing the work and was what resulted in the clean up of the earth connections and so should lead to reduced potential recurring problems in the future.

[S griffin]

Can happen with those cars. At least he got it sorted and it’s now working. At least he didn’t need to service it. At least you now know what to do next time if it does happen again. At least now the earth has been cleaned it should not happen again anytime soon

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by grantp

Is the penalty for the driver or the car? Or both in combination? Could you change the identity (of either) and somehow enjoy the benefit of the win without it affecting the rest of the year?

Or just wear a face mask, its "Ã* la mode" nowadays… I wonder what kind of competitor you are Grant?
What sounds strange is that the 30' penalty is given for the year and not the next race only. But as Paul says, such are the rules, they are known, accepted by and applied to all. Dura lex, sed lex! Pedalla to the metalla!

[John Elwin]

Originally Posted by Lancsbreaker

Are any of our European friends anywhere near this Alfa? - It could be interesting as I have a rusty that could donate the "moteur et boite" ......


https://www.facebook.com/groups/1128...12811319539331

Does your 'rusty' have the interior trim to convert this one back to a road car?

[Lancsbreaker]

Originally Posted by John Elwin

Does your 'rusty' have the interior trim to convert this one back to a road car?

Pretty much intact, yes - Its RHD though . I do have a LHD one but that's pretty solid - for a 50 year old Alfa.


I expect someone local to the car to snap it up - because we can't travel to Belgium either, although I could argue its a business trip, I guess.....

[Gerard C]

Priced to sell I think. Must have its rear axle too and the dash looks in good condition unless the installation of the rops damaged it. The conversion involves many different parts, like steering system column included.
All in all, stay safe at home please, France is not a good travel destination ATM…

[Gerard C]

Priced to sell I think. Must have its rear axle too and the dash looks in good condition unless the installation of the rops damaged it. The conversion involves many different parts, like steering system column included.
All in all, stay safe at home please, France is not a good travel destination ATM…

[Gerard C]

Richard, is this the model with a sophisticated braking system, using two master vacs? We had this when doing the 2 Tours d'Horloge. A two litre engine helps…

[Lancsbreaker]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

Richard, is this the model with a sophisticated braking system, using two master vacs? We had this when doing the 2 Tours d'Horloge. A two litre engine helps…

Can't remember offhand when they had single servos and when twin - mine are 72 models and only single servo....just to complicate things, some had floor mount pedals and some were pendant.


Both my cars are 1600, although I do have a 78 2 litre spider that I imported from the States in 92.......that sadly has the Spica injection system, though.......I have plans to convert to Webers

[S griffin]

How much difference do twin Servos make? Are they worth it

Got a good couple of classic Alfas there, hope they still work

[JasperClan]

Originally Posted by Lancsbreaker

Are any of our European friends anywhere near this Alfa? - It could be interesting as I have a rusty that could donate the "moteur et boite" ......


https://www.facebook.com/groups/1128...12811319539331

Richard,

I have a very good friend in Antwerp who is Alfa friendly, I delivered an engine and two gearboxes to him on the way to racing in Germany, who may be able to help if you are interested.

Pete Richards

[andy97]

Originally Posted by JasperClan

Richard,

I have a very good friend in Antwerp who is Alfa friendly, I delivered an engine and two gearboxes to him on the way to racing in Germany, who may be able to help if you are interested.

Pete Richards

I can see a plan forming!

[Paul D]

Originally Posted by grantp

Ah, right.

I foolishly assumed that it would be logical to apply penalties at class level in well-mixed races (in terms of classes). Or to not apply them at all if the winner was not from an obvious "fastest" class.

Yes, I tend to agree, but I suppose, from the club's point of view, it's easier to have one rule for all than it is to have everyone arguing over which classes should qualify for a penalty if they win, and which ones should be exempt on the basis theirs isn't a 'fast' class. And such a system could be open to abuse, as those with sufficient funds who usually race in one of the faster classes could simply having a stonking car built for one of the 'slow' classes and start winning races outright without any danger of getting the winner's penalty.

So I suppose it's not easy to find a balance that's fair to all and there will always be anomalies and people getting stuck with a penalty even though there's little chance of them winning again without one. As unlikely as it is, I suppose a set of freak circumstances could present themselves and I could win again (it happened once...), then imagine the complaints if I'd only won the second one because I didn't get a penalty for the first!

I actually think (never thought much about it before, as I never thought it would affect me!) it would be fairer if the penalty was applied from your second win and thereafter: that way, anyone who gets a lucky win isn't going to be hampered by it for the rest of the season.

To answer your second question: yes, the penalty only applies to the same driver, in the same car, in the same series. So yes, technically, I could avoid it by either changing cars or changing series. Couple of problems with that plan though: I don't have another car that's currently race-ready (I have thought about it though!) and in any other series that my current car is eligible for, I wouldn't be competitive against the opposition.

Life's a *****!

[Paul D]

Originally Posted by andy97

I can see a plan forming!

Andy - for God's sake, don't be giving him ideas!

Richard's already got enough cars to fill a cross-channel ferry, adding more to the stockpile probably isn't a good idea!

I'm sure Richard's opinion will differ...

[andy97]

Originally Posted by Paul D

Andy - for God's sake, don't be giving him ideas!

Richard's already got enough cars to fill a cross-channel ferry, adding more to the stockpile probably isn't a good idea!

I'm sure Richard's opinion will differ...

Arh, but we need to encourage Richard to transplant the running gear of the rusty one into this, and to race this one whilst scrapping the rusty one. Lo and behold same number of cars but at least one will be more valuable.
Voila!
I thank you!

[terence]

Originally Posted by Gerard C

SC drivers make the show sometimes. RD car driver are not always "in tune". At Dijon, the long straight starting with a tight slope, if the start is too slow drivers in the middle of the grid struggle to go forward and not backward.

It is a benefit to know what the grid is made up of Gerard.Drive according to the grid behind.You can't drive a 70kph lap if the F1 cars behind aero doesn't work at that speed.🙂

[E.B]

One for Iain in particular here, but all might enjoy:

Cam Jackson in a BT2 Brabham FJ on a drying Silverstone National track testing before the HSCC Finals meeting.
Helmet cam view.



https://youtu.be/IKa2AGfrI8I

[S griffin]

Great eye view of Silverstone, yes very nice. And in a classic car too on a fast layout. Do love a good helmet cam, look forward to more

[Gerard C]

Originally Posted by terence

It is a benefit to know what the grid is made up of Gerard.Drive according to the grid behind.You can't drive a 70kph lap if the F1 cars behind aero doesn't work at that speed.🙂

Moons ago someone found very clever to mix us Grp1's with Salooncars (kind of Mod Sports I guess, with c 400hp) and we could not even follow them during the formation lap before the rolling start! I then improvised our own start only for Grp1's? Unexpected but true, I very quickly got a drive through penalty and my grid neighbor too! Funnily enough, all our Grp1 mates were very happy with this private start, rien que pour nous. Nothing like a well trained and aware driver to drive either SC or RC car.

[Gerard C]

If you like Cortina's… https://www.flickr.com/photos/austin...57717421862651

[Peter Mallett]

Just back from Mallory Park after a great day with Gilbert, accompanied by Iain and David and Mrs David.

[Mike Harte]

Originally Posted by Peter Mallett

Just back from Mallory Park after a great day with Gilbert, accompanied by Iain and David and Mrs David.

How is Mary doing with her ARDS, or is that not allowed yet?

[The Fat Clerk]

There is an ARDS day @ Mallory tomorrow, followed by a 'normal' Javelin day on Thursday.
Only around a dozen single seaters today but still great to see.
It was the red 2CV that impressed me today, a really well sorted car.