Andrew Jones or Paul Dumbrell?

[Pro Racer]

a mate raised this question to me today i didn't have an answer to really.

both have a development series tittle.
both have done SFA in the the main game.
both have their drives for either $$$ or family not on merrit.

so who would you chose?

it's a tough one i think i will go for Dumbrell as i think he has shown on the odd day that he can turn it on a little like at the end of 06 with JDR, he matched or bettered McConkin a couple of times in the PWR hacks, i still think it's a toss of a coin maybe Dumbrell's $ gets him over the line also.

[stmookeyj033]

Neither to be honest, but if given a choice Jones has shown more in the enduros which to me holds big currency.

[Suttory]

Andrew Jones any day

[TSR]

Originally Posted by Pro Racer

both have their drives for either $$$ or family not on merrit.

They are not the only two there due to mummy & daddy'd money. Were do you want me to start.

[billybanana]

Originally Posted by TSR

They are not the only two there due to mummy & daddy'd money.

The difference is Rick can actually drive. Junior well he's a lost cause.

Oh and I'd take Andy Jones any day over Dumbrell.

[dsg]

Whoever pays the most for a seat in the second car.

[STEALTHY]

You can't really compare the 2. I'm sure Jones would have more results to show if he was driving the HSVDT car.

[JustASupporter]

Originally Posted by dsg

Whoever pays the most for a seat in the second car.

Likewise

[Wood-duck]

Originally Posted by STEALTHY

You can't really compare the 2. I'm sure Jones would have more results to show if he was driving the HSVDT car.

They are both driving WP Commodores..... there shouldnt be that much difference anyway....

[mac]

As much as I'd love Dumbrell to be successful (because he seems like a thoroughly decent chap), he just hasn't been.

If I had to choose between the two, I would probably go with Jones.

However, if Brad Jones Racing was Mac Racing, my two regular drivers would be McConville and Wilson.

[formerf1champ]

Originally Posted by mac

As much as I'd love Dumbrell to be successful (because he seems like a thoroughly decent chap),

Ahh, it makes sense now. He's a good bloke, so you're a fan of his. It's nothing to do with his driving.

Originally Posted by mac

he just hasn't been.

Well, taking away the fact he won on Sunday and, as a result, his career is now validated. Did you ever consider, despite being a good bloke, that he is a terrible racing driver? I mean, he's had a few hours of competence, that have paid off spectacularly, but miserable results otherwise.

Think about it it? 4 top 3 finishes, 2 were as the support driver to Whincup. The other two were on the same weekend at Sandown, a couple of years ago. Those podiums at Sandown tell me that the car was working great (whatever the engineers happened to do) and he made good use of it. Along with that, 1 top 10 overall c'ship placing

So, taking into account how highly rated he seems to have been and looking at his stats on wiki. I'm going to say, in his full-time career, par would be 2 top 10 c'ship placings at Perkins, with a couple of race wins and 1 outright. 9th to 12th at Walkinshaw in '09, with a couple of podiums. Top 10 in the title, in both years with FPR, with 3 race wins. Maybe, 1/2 a dozen other podiums overall. That's a fair minimum to expect, just to make par. Yet, he's not even close to those results!

But since he's a good bloke, it doesn't matter, doesn't it?

Originally Posted by mac

If I had to choose between the two, I would probably go with Jones.

What???

[rik]

Originally Posted by formerf1champ

Well, taking away the fact he won on Sunday and, as a result, his career is now validated. Did you ever consider, despite being a good bloke, that he is a terrible racing driver? I mean, he's had a few hours of competence, that have paid off spectacularly, but miserable results otherwise.

What about Percat? How does he compare to Dumbrell and Jones? Walkinshaw protege... Bathurst winner! Although not a Dev series champion after several attempts.

[Trevor]

what is with trolling all these old threads back up?

[Chappelli]

Originally Posted by formerf1champ

Well, taking away the fact he won on Sunday and, as a result, his career is now validated. Did you ever consider, despite being a good bloke, that he is a terrible racing driver? I mean, he's had a few hours of competence, that have paid off spectacularly, but miserable results otherwise.
Think about it it? 4 top 3 finishes, 2 were as the support driver to Whincup. The other two were on the same weekend at Sandown, a couple of years ago. Those podiums at Sandown tell me that the car was working great (whatever the engineers happened to do) and he made good use of it. Along with that, 1 top 10 overall c'ship placing
So, taking into account how highly rated he seems to have been and looking at his stats on wiki. I'm going to say, in his full-time career, par would be 2 top 10 c'ship placings at Perkins, with a couple of race wins and 1 outright. 9th to 12th at Walkinshaw in '09, with a couple of podiums. Top 10 in the title, in both years with FPR, with 3 race wins. Maybe, 1/2 a dozen other podiums overall. That's a fair minimum to expect, just to make par. Yet, he's not even close to those results!
But since he's a good bloke, it doesn't matter, doesn't it?
What???

As they say "you're only as good as your last race"... and PD's last race was a pretty solid affair.
I'm not saying he's the greatest driver ever to set foot in V8Supercars (he's also far from the worst), but he proved himself to be a very very solid enduro co-driver (maybe even best in class last weekend) and that sir, was what he was getting paid for.

[mac]

Is this guy for real?

You refer to how I like Dumbrell because he's a good bloke, yet I chose Jones at the time... Which inherently defeats whatever point you are trying to make. You also conveniently ignore that I said I wouldn't take either of them.

That was four years ago... Back then, I was frustrated that Dumbrell was yet to deliver on the promise that so many saw in him. He has since grown up, figured out how to be consistent, and gone on to win races while spending a year or two running right near the front of the main game.

All you are doing is proving my (and everyone else's) point, by pointing out that I used to be a pretty solid critic of Dumbrell... But he got his stuff together and, with an open mind (you should try it some time), his performances over the past few years won me over.

He's just delivered two flawless drives in the enduros to continue that trend.

Four years pass, things change, Dumbrell figured stuff out... Maybe give it four more years and you might too.

I can't believe I responded...

[formerf1champ]

Originally Posted by rik

What about Percat? How does he compare to Dumbrell and Jones? Walkinshaw protege... Bathurst winner! Although not a Dev series champion after several attempts.

Jones is not important in this comparison. This is a hard one to answer, because we're not comparing apples with apples. Unless, you can be a bit more specific? Do you mean that Dumbrell may have more credibilty than Percat because he has won a dev series and Percat hasn't? I don't rate Dumbrell's dev series anyway. It would need someone else to confirm, but with the car Dumbrell was racing, it'd be like a better than/mid range V8 team racing in the Kumho series.

Percat? I don't know how to answer I don't follow that series closely. I will say, I'm not a fan of teams "developing" drivers with their own programs. Long term, I think it stuffs up more drivers, more often, than improves them.

Originally Posted by Chappelli

As they say "you're only as good as your last race"...

Graeme Bailey, Midge Bosworth > Mark Skaife?

Originally Posted by Chappelli

and PD's last race was a pretty solid affair.

I agree. In isolation, you're right. It was a solid drive. But that all it was.

Originally Posted by Chappelli

but he proved himself to be a very very solid enduro co-driver (maybe even best in class last weekend)

I would take it back a notch, say he's very solid no pressure. If the team was relying on him to juggle everything and win the race, he would've capitulated easily. After all the time he's spent "racing", you couldn't trust him to take the initiative. That makes him ****.

Originally Posted by Chappelli

and that sir, was what he was getting paid for.

He was getting paid???