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Old 20 May 2017, 06:20 (Ref:3734588)   #1
Kingair
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Kingair should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridKingair should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Larry Vs Tom

I am part way through the DVD celebrating 25 years of HRT, a couple of interesting points that may be answered by those in the know.

1. What year did the UK secret build Commodore of Mr Walkinshaw's make its debut at the mountain?,

2. What year did Tom, takeover Larry's Commodore and flog the living daylights out despite being warned by Larry to keep the revs lower?
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Old 20 May 2017, 06:22 (Ref:3734589)   #2
Umai Naa
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Umai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridUmai Naa should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Both were in '88, I believe.
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Old 20 May 2017, 06:57 (Ref:3734590)   #3
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Kingair should be qualifying in the top 10 on the gridKingair should be qualifying in the top 10 on the grid
Thanks for that.

Larry would not have been happy watching Tom, flog the living daylights out of his engine!
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Old 20 May 2017, 11:24 (Ref:3734626)   #4
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chavez should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridchavez should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridchavez should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
They must have worked okay together - both of the Commodores at Bathurst were deemed to be illegal.
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Old 21 May 2017, 04:12 (Ref:3734801)   #5
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1. What year did the UK secret build Commodore of Mr Walkinshaw's make its debut at the mountain?,
I haven't seen the DVD admittedly, but i'm not sure how any Walkinshaw built VL in the UK would have been secret?

TWR had the contract to homologate the car for competition, TWR had the intention from the start of entering cars in European events, and ran the new car in ill-fated BTCC event at Birnimgham in 1988, as well as the 1988 TT at Silverstone, both of which were before the 1988 Sandown 500 in which the works cars first competed in Australia.
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Old 21 May 2017, 12:45 (Ref:3734911)   #6
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The secret was that they weren't expecting the TWR-built VL to come out were they?

Mr Perkins had 2 VL batmobiles built and ready to run for 1988.. one became a T car.. and Mr Walkinshaw chose to run his own car.

There was an issue with revs in the Perkins engines.. Mr Small apparently sold parts to TWR for an engine program, maybe not the EFI version, but Holden V8 definitely. In 1986, Mr Grice managed to pull 8,000 rpm out of his Holden powerplant on the way to victory... so maybe Mr Walkinshaw expected that level of hunger from the Perkinsmobile...
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Old 21 May 2017, 13:06 (Ref:3734933)   #7
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Obviously Perkins Engineering knew of the existence of the TWR built VL, it had appeared on Channel 7's review of the Silverstone TT where DJR were in attendance. But the airfreighting of the car to Australia was not what they were expecting. Both cars were very different in build and so it effectively became 2 teams.

Larry was not particularly keen on letting Tom drive, but he was the boss. Despite being briefed on the rev limit, Walkinshaw chose to ignore, but still circulated 2 seconds a lap slower than Denny Hulme had in his stint. When the car expired in the last stint it was in a race winning position, running second behind Tony Longhurst who was about to make a long stop for pads and with Tomas Mezera having to do the final stint.
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Old 21 May 2017, 13:26 (Ref:3734940)   #8
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When the car expired in the last stint it was in a race winning position
A moot point really given the car was declared illegal after the race

Even with a longer stop, the B&H Sierra had the pace with both drivers to see off any real threat towards the end of the race.
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Old 21 May 2017, 23:18 (Ref:3735141)   #9
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Once I have finished the DVD, I will pass it onto Ryan Walkinshaw!

Looks like big Tom, decided to drive Larry's Commodore like he had stolen it!
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Old 22 May 2017, 05:03 (Ref:3735175)   #10
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chavez should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridchavez should be qualifying in the top 5 on the gridchavez should be qualifying in the top 5 on the grid
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A moot point really given the car was declared illegal after the race

Even with a longer stop, the B&H Sierra had the pace with both drivers to see off any real threat towards the end of the race.
It would not have been good for the sport for the "winner" of the Great Race to be disqualified two year in a row.

Walkinshaw did the sport a favour.
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Old 22 May 2017, 08:42 (Ref:3735202)   #11
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Larry was not particularly keen on letting Tom drive, but he was the boss. Despite being briefed on the rev limit, Walkinshaw chose to ignore, but still circulated 2 seconds a lap slower than Denny Hulme had in his stint. When the car expired in the last stint it was in a race winning position, running second behind Tony Longhurst who was about to make a long stop for pads and with Tomas Mezera having to do the final stint.
IIRC, that run at Bathurst in '88 was Walkinshaw's last race as a driver, and he would have been a bit ring-rusty, not having raced regularly since the Rover ETCC programme finished at the end of the '86 season.

After that, as I recall he did the Fuji touring car race and part of the Nissan-Mobil 500 in NZ (just Wellington I think) with the XJS over the winter of 1986/7, and had a run at the Nurburgring WTCC round in '87 in the rarely-seen VL, then nothing until the three appearances with the VL Batmobile in the second half of '88- Birmingham BTCC, Silverstone TT and Bathurst.

That's little more than half-a-dozen races (and one of those he never actually raced, just qualified) in the last two years of his career as a driver- You can see one reason Perkins was less-than-keen about the idea of Walkinshaw driving

Last edited by KA; 22 May 2017 at 08:51.
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Old 22 May 2017, 08:45 (Ref:3735203)   #12
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A moot point really given the car was declared illegal after the race

.
What was illegal about the cars, I'm an old fart and my memery is slipping
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Old 22 May 2017, 08:55 (Ref:3735204)   #13
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I'd have to dig out books to be certain, but weren't there some differences in spec between the Perkins and UK-built examples of the Batmobile- and a few between the UK car and the homologation papers...?

From very vague memory, so I'm probably wrong, front spoiler and steering rack come to mind?
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Old 22 May 2017, 10:21 (Ref:3735216)   #14
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Originally Posted by KA View Post
I'd have to dig out books to be certain, but weren't there some differences in spec between the Perkins and UK-built examples of the Batmobile- and a few between the UK car and the homologation papers...?

From very vague memory, so I'm probably wrong, front spoiler and steering rack come to mind?
Maybe an explanation should be placed here :-) http://tentenths.com/forum/showthrea...ht=fred+gibson
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Old 22 May 2017, 12:01 (Ref:3735235)   #15
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Originally Posted by KA View Post
I'd have to dig out books to be certain, but weren't there some differences in spec between the Perkins and UK-built examples of the Batmobile- and a few between the UK car and the homologation papers...?

From very vague memory, so I'm probably wrong, front spoiler and steering rack come to mind?
From the Tuckey book:

"...The UK-built car had a softer spring and damper setup than the Perkins Commodore, and was using UK-built front uprights and their own rear axle with aluminum uprights....
....The Perkins cars (10 and 40) used his Harrop-built braking system, the TWR car an AP-designed system."

Basically Walkinshaw had his own ideas on how to set up a Commodore (as per the above, plus brake pads, tyres, ride-height), despite there being 8 years of data available through PE.

As for who blew up Larry's engine:

"Walkinshaw got into the Larry Perkins Commodore at precisely 2.24 pm"
"At 3.48 it was Walkinshaw in to give the car to Perkins for the run home" (in second place)
"Meanwhile, Perkins was being unmerciful with his Commodore....he was hammering in 23-24's...But on lap 132 he was suddenly six seconds slower..."
"The oil pump drive had broken and a rocker arm had gone...The engine had lost oil pressure, and the crew changed the oil pump, but when it re-started they couldn't get a decent reading, so they decide to call it a day."


And then there's Larry retrospective analysis of it all on Youtube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qh7wEDFcB
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